Big F'n Stick Build

[rimble]

Full BAB melee, yes. 3/4 BAB melee (aka, Rogues), not necessarily.

Yeah, makes me nervous. Just planned out a stick build that is leaning towards 13 Rogue/6 Fighter/1 Barbarian to make up some ToHit and Damage...if WotTA III is just another 10% speed it's likely what I'll do...no point going faster if you can't hit...if it's got a little extra somethin'-somethin' on it I'll reconsider.

[Gol]

Yeah, makes me nervous. Just planned out a stick build that is leaning towards 13 Rogue/6 Fighter/1 Barbarian to make up some ToHit and Damage...if WotTA III is just another 10% speed it's likely what I'll do...no point going faster if you can't hit...if it's got a little extra somethin'-somethin' on it I'll reconsider.

Well, when it is a problem, DP clickies take care of it. I've grown accustomed to DP clickies when doing shroud runs. My Bard has over 20 clicks of it, and both of my Clerics have it loaded all the time.

[The_Phenx]

Yeah, makes me nervous. Just planned out a stick build that is leaning towards 13 Rogue/6 Fighter/1 Barbarian to make up some ToHit and Damage...if WotTA III is just another 10% speed it's likely what I'll do...no point going faster if you can't hit...if it's got a little extra somethin'-somethin' on it I'll reconsider.

I have almost no issues hitting...and leave power attack on 95% of the time. Especially on raids theres almost always a bard around and if not... tumbleweed grants a +2 ... or you could use the spectral gloves for the same effect.

You can also switch to fire stance as mentioned earlier for an additional +1 But...

Wind stance stacks for 3.5% I believe... and if your at say +28th and additional +1 is < that.

Your best bet is to use greater banes, divine power clickies, madstone boots... or a combination thereof.

That is why my favorite subterranea weapon is the dreamspitter...and seeing as the new mod will be almost entirely evil outsiders, I imagine that I will continue to use it quite often, and will be one of the strongest weapons I have.

I love running around and hearing "whos enervating the hell out of everything?"

[Gol]

Wind stance stacks for 3.5% I believe... and if your at say +28th and additional +1 is < that.

Wind stance is 2.5%. Not guessing. +1 on top of +28 isn't the way to look at it at all, either. Either a natural 2 misses or it doesn't. If a natural 2 misses, that +1 means your hit-rate goes up by 5%. Ie, you used to need a 4 to hit, now you need a 3 (so you hit 18/20 instead of 17/20). 5% > 2.5%. Like the guy that replied to me said, it's just like the PA debate. If you miss, you're better off to turn PA off.

[Gol]

So, I've been futzing around a bit with a spreadsheet and crunching some numbers while the servers are down...

Verses a single opponent, a Greensteel Greataxe does 93-101% of the damage a Greensteel Quarterstaff will depending on how much of the time you get in Sneak Attack. If you're getting 100% sneak in, a GS GA is 93.3% as effective as the quarterstaff. If you get 0% sneak in, the GS GA is 1% MORE effective. For something like Harry in Shroud who has 50% fortification, the GS GA is 96.3% as effective.

This made me step back a bit and crunch the numbers for dual wielding Rapiers. I mean really, this build has the Dex for GTWF, at least run the math, right?

Against a single opponent, dual GS Rapiers do 135% of the DPS of a GS QS, not to mention procing Radiance 2 at least almost 3 times as often. Sure, you have to get twice as much gear, but dayum.

Granted, this assumes GTWF which many of us can't get until level 18. But even if you can only get ITWF, it's 120%. I don't know about you, but I'm not sneezing at an extra 20%. Not to mention better stat damaging, better banishing/smiting/wounding/puncturing/etc... It's all about how much time you want to spend grinding for shroud ingredients, IMO. The qstaff is much cheaper (only need a radiance 2, mineral 2 can be replaced by a good transmuter). Loot gen qstaves are much cheaper too.

Sorry to wreck the train, Phenx, but running the spreadsheet was quite an eye-opener for me. I'm switching, myself

edit: at which point the Monk level, which I didn't take until I hit level 14 LAST NIGHT, is a complete and total waste.

[moorewr]

Ouch, Gol.

I'm sticking with THF & Staves.. two reasons.. everyone else has a TWF tempest.. can't compete with that. Plus it's boring, very boring, to be one of the crowd..

Also a THF might be optimal for certain bosses and mobs in Mod 9.. depending on their immunities and DR (when I ran the numbers I came up with DR>25 && DR<50 as the THF optimal range).

[rimble]

Ouch, Gol.

I'm sticking with THF & Staves.. two reasons.. everyone else has a TWF tempest.. can't compete with that. Plus it's boring, very boring, to be one of the crowd..

Also a THF might be optimal for certain bosses and mobs in Mod 9.. depending on their immunities and DR (when I ran the numbers I came up with DR>25 && DR<50 as the THF optimal range).

I agree. I feel like I was an early discoverer of the Ranger/Monk cheese, and abandoned him at level 11 when I saw all the identical builds coming up behind.

Also, THF equations should hopefully change a bit in Mod 9 with the special effects on glancing blow stuff. We have no idea how much, but it should at least close the gap a little on that 135% number, if you can work that into your build. My version of this will likely be WF for this reason, though this Halfling is a bit out of luck.

[Gol]

I agree. I feel like I was an early discoverer of the Ranger/Monk cheese, and abandoned him at level 11 when I saw all the identical builds coming up behind.

Also, THF equations should hopefully change a bit in Mod 9 with the special effects on glancing blow stuff. We have no idea how much, but it should at least close the gap a little on that 135% number, if you can work that into your build. My version of this will likely be WF for this reason, though this Halfling is a bit out of luck.

Well, the basic problem is hit-based procs. Namely, sneak attack. If you're getting sneak attack in, there's no way around the fact that it's going off twice as often when you're swinging 2 weapons. Until the DR X/- tops 20ish, yeah, THF just plain loses, no matter what the flavor.

Anyway, I love the build, the flavor, and the change of pace. Kudos for thinking outside the box, Phenx. I personally can't give up the #s, though.

[D'rin]

The only differance will come in mod 9 when thf gets weapon effects on glancing blows. Now will this make up the differance completely, no but it will help. Especially if you are WF and have the enhancement line to increase the chance even more.

[The_Phenx]

Well, the basic problem is hit-based procs. Namely, sneak attack. If you're getting sneak attack in, there's no way around the fact that it's going off twice as often when you're swinging 2 weapons. Until the DR X/- tops 20ish, yeah, THF just plain loses, no matter what the flavor.

Anyway, I love the build, the flavor, and the change of pace. Kudos for thinking outside the box, Phenx. I personally can't give up the #s, though.

Of course a twf is going to do more puncturing sneaks etc.
But you just cant equate 6 mobs and cleave or glancing blow damage into your equations.
Mod 9 will also add effects to glacing blows as stated by others.
Acrobat III also has unknown bonuses that will come too.

That being said I know this will never be the highest dps toon available. It holds its own nicely, and its the fastest swing rate of all THF weapons.

Come mod 9 I will more than likely be swapping around to get the THF chain back... depending on the proc rates of course.

All that aside it was built for the flavor. Leme tell you that flavor is mighty tasty too.

[vasquiu]

Phenx, I play a similar build like urs, and is very funny to play.

With tempest rangers in all places, this build is a fresh way to play a DPS toon. I am leveling a drow 12 Rogue / 2 Monk / 6 Warrior and now is level 13 and I have lots of fun with him. I pretend to take 3 toughness feats at least to have enough HPs for high level content.

Someone knows if Jorgundal' Collar (http://ddo.enterwiki.net/page/Jorgundal%27s_Collar) stacks with the alacrity buffs of monk + acrobat I and II?

[The_Phenx]

Phenx, I play a similar build like urs, and is very funny to play.

With tempest rangers in all places, this build is a fresh way to play a DPS toon. I am leveling a drow 12 Rogue / 2 Monk / 6 Warrior and now is level 13 and I have lots of fun with him. I pretend to take 3 toughness feats at least to have enough HPs for high level content.

Someone knows if Jorgundal' Collar (http://ddo.enterwiki.net/page/Jorgundal%27s_Collar) stacks with the alacrity buffs of monk + acrobat I and II?

I wouldnt waste your feats on three toughnesses... 1 should suffice. Prey is at 368 hp and will be well over 400 when he hits 20th. You would be better served with combat related feats.

Yes Jorgundals collar stacks with monk air and acrobat II... but not haste.

It does however get you close to a hasted speed.

Monk Acro I II _+ jorgundals = 40%

Monk Acro I II + Haste = 48.5%

So its not abd to have... if you are running solo withoutt a haste clickie.

[The_Phenx]

Acquired Tumbleweed FINALLY... Gear updated.

I have also been asked to post skills, which I will get around to this week hopefully.

[vasquiu]

Thank u for the reply, is good to know that the collar stacks with the acrobat alacrities.

I am working in these feats in the build:

Feats:
- Toughness (M).
- Power Attack (M).
- Dodge (M). *
- Improved Critical: Blunt Weapons.
- Weapon Focus: Blunt Weapons.
- Stunning Blow.
- Cleave.
- Great Cleave.
- Iron Will (M).
- Great Fortitude.
- Toughness (M).
- Toughness (M).
- Weapon Specialization: Blunt Weapons.

I expect that are enough for combat ( I always go with power attack on)

[The_Phenx]

Thank u for the reply, is good to know that the collar stacks with the acrobat alacrities.

I am working in these feats in the build:

Feats:
- Toughness (M).
- Power Attack (M).
- Dodge (M). *
- Improved Critical: Blunt Weapons.
- Weapon Focus: Blunt Weapons.
- Stunning Blow.
- Cleave.
- Great Cleave.
- Iron Will (M).
- Great Fortitude.
- Toughness (M).
- Toughness (M).
- Weapon Specialization: Blunt Weapons.

I expect that are enough for combat ( I always go with power attack on)

Thats a good list... I don't know what race your rolling with... but if your going halfling Iron Will is a waste...their enhancements are cheaper...

You will LOVE stunning blow with a 5% weighted staff...

As a thought... since you are already taking dodge...you could switch out Iron will...and one of your toughness's and take mobility and spring attack... this would be a HUGE boon with this build since the To hit is already on the low side...and you would be able to run amuck...

OR you could go with the THF (instead of the focuses or...etc) line since in mod 9 the galncing blows will proc effects.

[vasquiu]

Arrg the temptation to take mobility + sping attack is hard!! I have taken Iron will because the toon is drow (I expect that in future Turbine will fix their SR) to maximize STR. The idea is taking stalwart defender enhancement for the ac increase benefits and +2 STR boost.

[The_Phenx]

Interesting...warforged would give you the str and the enhancement line to glancing blows however...

[MoH-Patrol]

so OP, all the stats you have given can be applied to a WF or are those strictly Halfling?

[Blind_Skwerl]

I have been wondering about that, too. How would you do this one, warforged stye?

[The_Phenx]

so OP, all the stats you have given can be applied to a WF or are those strictly Halfling?

Those stats were for a halfling.

Its debateable still who will do more dps.

Halflings will do more Sneak Damage with the guile line, have better saves, a slightly higher to hit and ac...

Warforged pick up immunities, lil higher strength, and the glancing blow enhancements (who knows what that will be)...

Leme tinker with the WF numbers a lil.. see what I can come up with tonight...