Fork in the road

[Azogar]

Ok bard just hit lv 6. Got Warchanter. Here she is so far.

Str 16
Dex 22
Chr 10
Int 8
Wis 8
Chr 21

DW finesse Piercing planning on ending with 30 dex and 26 chr. Now my question is....

Do I go?

16 Brd
14/2 Brd/Fgt
6/10 Brd/Fgt

[Bilger]

Depends on what you want to do 15/1 gets you inspire heroics but 14/2 gets what extra feat all depends on what you are looking for. What are you looking to do with the bard if CC is in the equation will be tough with a 26 char and 16 bard will give that extra dc but still real tough to land any CC at later lvls. Fighting atleast IMO 1 lvl of fighter wouldn't hurt still get heroics but it is all in what you want in your bard. Need a lil more info if ya want a good opinion.

[Freeman]

Whichever you decide, I wouldn't go below 14 levels of bard. Doing so drops your songs down below what a non-warchanter bard's songs can give you, so you lose one of the main advantages of taking warchanter. Either 15/1 or 14/2 would work fine, so the only real question is if you need something you get from Fighter 2.

[maddmatt70]

15 bard 1 fighter is the best build right now but I am not sure what build I would make when the cap goes up to 20. Inspire heroics has proven very useful in VOD and in some other circumstances; hence, 15 levels of bard..

[maddmatt70]

10 con.. ouch... Delete and reroll with higher con..

[Azogar]

Ok lets say I re-roll with starting stats (still warchanter, still finesse, still human)

Str 13
Dex 18 (+1 Dex Tome) = 19
Con 14 (+1 Con Tome) = 15
Int 8
Wis 8
Chr 13 (+1 Chr Tome) = 14

Start Fgt lv 1 for 3 feats
Then go 15 Brd

factor in all the attribute thingys and +6 items

Str 13
Dex 19 +1 (human adaptability) +4 (levels) +6 (item) = 30
Con 15 +1 (human adaptability) +6 (item) = 22
Int 8
Wis 8
Chr 14 +6 (item) = 20

This would make for a more stable option and being 15/1 Brd/Fgt would settle myself 8 total feats (not in this order)
Finesse, WF: Piercing, Power Attack, Extend Spell, Force of personality (for will save rescue) TWF, Improved Crit: Piercing and ITWF

Spells would mainly be for self buffing and party buffing since low Chr would be nothing for good CC.

[maddmatt70]

Ok lets say I re-roll with starting stats (still warchanter, still finesse, still human)

Str 13
Dex 18 (+1 Dex Tome) = 19
Con 14 (+1 Con Tome) = 15
Int 8
Wis 8
Chr 13 (+1 Chr Tome) = 14

Start Fgt lv 1 for 3 feats
Then go 15 Brd

factor in all the attribute thingys and +6 items

Str 13
Dex 19 +1 (human adaptability) +4 (levels) +6 (item) = 30
Con 15 +1 (human adaptability) +6 (item) = 22
Int 8
Wis 8
Chr 14 +6 (item) = 20

This would make for a more stable option and being 15/1 Brd/Fgt would settle myself 8 total feats (not in this order)
Finesse, WF: Piercing, Power Attack, Extend Spell, Force of personality (for will save rescue) TWF, Improved Crit: Piercing and ITWF

Spells would mainly be for self buffing and party buffing since low Chr would be nothing for good CC.

Better, still would make a few changes though. Level 1 should be bard for the skill points. You can take your second level fighter, but first level basically should be bard.

A basic question is why weapon finesse? You will at the mid levels and high levels get displacement and stoneskin wands/scrolls for your ac and at the lower levels can go with a shield what have you, but going dex based just means less dps in terms of less strength damage and one less feat that you could pick anything with. Since you can't splash a monk level for a bard due to alignment restrictions you can't get a sick ac even if you grind for all the best raid loot and items. I could perhaps see a sword and board bard that invests in intimidate having some value, but why go with an ac at all in a twf bard considering bards natural umd for stoneskin and ability to self cast displacement and some self healing capabilities.

If you were a rogue/bard that was worried about the number of stats you need to invest in and had evasion so a high dex is nice perhaps weapon finesse makes sense, but otherwise I don't see a reason for weapon finesse.

Start with a higher strength 16 (or higher) and a 15 dex. Put level ups into strength and use your favor tome or a +2 dex tome on dex for itwf and gtwf..

[Azogar]

so I should probably go...

Str 17
Dex 15
Con 14 (+1 Con Tome) = 15
Int 8
Wis 8
Chr 13 (+1 Chr Tome) = 14


factor in all the attribute thingys and +6 items

Str 17 +1 (human adaptability) +4 (levels) +6 (item) = 28(no tome to start leaves for +2 tome if/when acquired)=30
Dex 15 (either favor tome or +2 Dex tome) = 17
Con 15 +1 (human adaptability) +6 (item) = 22
Int 8
Wis 8
Chr 14 +6 (item) = 20

[Azogar]

OK this from the DDO planner...
(I'll probably negate the use of a Chr Tome)

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 2.96
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Lyranna
Level 16 Chaotic Good Human Female
(1 Fighter / 15 Bard)
Hit Points: 191
Spell Points: 512

BAB: 12/12/17/22
Fortitude: 10
Reflex: 11
Will: 12

Starting Feat/Enhancement
Abilities Base Stats Modified Stats
(32 Point) (Level 1) (Level 16)
Strength 17/ 24
Dexterity 15/ 15
Constitution 14/ 16
Intelligence 8/ 8
Wisdom 8/ 8
Charisma 13/ 17

Tomes Used
+1 Tome of Constitution used at level 1
+1 Tome of Charisma used at level 1
+2 Tome of Strength used at level 16

Starting Feat/Enhancement
Base Skills Modified Skills
Skills (Level 1) (Level 16)
Balance 2/ 2
Bluff 6/ 22
Concentration 2/ 3
Diplomacy 6/ 23
Disable Device n/a/ n/a
Haggle 6/ 24
Heal -1/ -1
Hide 2/ 2
Intimidate 4/ 10
Jump 3/ 7
Listen -1/ -1
Move Silently 2/ 2
Open Lock n/a/ n/a
Perform 6/ 24
Repair -1/ -1
Search -1/ -1
Spot -1/ -1
Swim 3/ 7
Tumble n/a/ n/a
Use Magic Device 6/ 22

Level 1 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Force of Personality
Feat: (Human Bonus) Two Weapon Fighting
Enhancement: Bard Extra Song I
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Bravery I

Level 2 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Weapon Focus: Piercing Weapons
Enhancement: Bard Perform I
Enhancement: Bard Energy of the Music I

Level 3 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Extend Spell
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Damage I
Enhancement: Bard Lingering Song I
Enhancement: Bard Charisma I

Level 4 (Bard)
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Attack I
Enhancement: Fighter Critical Accuracy I
Enhancement: Bard Haggle I

Level 5 (Bard)
Enhancement: Bard Extra Song II
Enhancement: Bard Haggle II
Enhancement: Bard Perform II

Level 6 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Power Attack
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Bravery II
Enhancement: Bard Energy of the Music II

Level 7 (Bard)
Enhancement: Bard Lingering Song II
Enhancement: Warchanter I

Level 8 (Bard)
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Damage II

Level 9 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Toughness
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Attack II
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness I

Level 10 (Bard)
Enhancement: Bard Charisma II

Level 11 (Bard)
Enhancement: Bard Lingering Song III
Enhancement: Human Adaptability Strength I

Level 12 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Piercing Weapons

Level 13 (Bard)
Enhancement: Bard Charisma III

Level 14 (Bard)
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Attack III

Level 15 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Diehard
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Damage III

Level 16 (Bard)
Enhancement: Human Adaptability Constitution II
Enhancement: Bard Diplomacy I

[maddmatt70]

so I should probably go...

Str 17
Dex 15
Con 14 (+1 Con Tome) = 15
Int 8
Wis 8
Chr 13 (+1 Chr Tome) = 14


factor in all the attribute thingys and +6 items

Str 17 +1 (human adaptability) +4 (levels) +6 (item) = 28(no tome to start leaves for +2 tome if/when acquired)=30
Dex 15 (either favor tome or +2 Dex tome) = 17
Con 15 +1 (human adaptability) +6 (item) = 22
Int 8
Wis 8
Chr 14 +6 (item) = 20

Yes. Now we are talking...

[Azogar]

Ok great Ima give it a shot. Thanks everyone for your input. I'll post on how it worked out