Is the bard class for me?

[sirgog]

Bards are awesome, but they really don't start to shine until higher levels. If you are new to the game, I highly recommend that you start with the cleric out of the two you listed. In general, I will never recommend bards or rogues to new players. Bards because they are really dull until level 7 minimum - rogues because they are too easy to build poorly.

Now granted, bards are my favorite class in the game and I absolutely prefer them to anything. Just not wanting a new player to get frustrated with a class that doesn't immediately shine

IMO the Bard is the strongest class in the game at low level, if built correctly.

A first level bard can have a 16 Strength (which when combined with their own song, grants them a further +1 attack/+2 damage for about the same results as an 18 Str melee. They can also have a 16 Charisma and the Charm Person spell, which is phenomonally powerful throughout all of the Harbor quests. Not to mention, their songs benefit allies too, not just themself.

At level 2 they gain Cure Light Wounds - making them even better at helping the party and keeping themself at a solid hp total.

At level 4, and this is most important, Charm Person starts to lose some of its lustre (due to you encountering Ogres, Giants, Trolls etc). That's conveniently exactly when the Bard gains the spell Suggestion. Now you can fight like a melee, and bring better crowd control to the table than a Sorc can, and buff, and play a (very) secondary healing role.

So from levels 1-5, IMO a Bard is the best crowd controller, the best buffer, a solid melee and a mediocre healer.


At higher levels, you start to lose a little of this power. Clerics streak well ahead of you in Healing, and you can't come close to keeping up. Sorcs and Wizards surpass your crowd control skills and gain mass damage spells like Firewall, and unbuffed melees become as good as you are selfbuffed at fighting. But, you remain the king of buffing.

[sirgog]

If you choose to go Bard, here's a guide as to one way you could build your character. (It's pretty similar to how I built Cacophonous, but won't assume access to high-end loot). This is a frontline fighter bard that buffs the party, buffs himself, then pulls out a heavy weapon.


Race: Dwarf (This is mainly because Dwarves have a lot more HP than any other race, although you'll hurt from the Charisma penalty, you'll hurt more if you don't have the insane HP Dwarves get).

Starting Stats:
Str 17 (13 build points. At higher levels you will occasionally gain extra stat points - put these all into Strength).
Dex 8
Con 15 (5 build points, as a Dwarf you get a +2 bonus here, already factored in)
Int 8
Wis 8
Cha 14 (10 build points - note that as a Dwarf, you will have a 2 point penalty to Cha)

First three feats: (You get one of these at each of levels 1, 3 and 6 - the order doesn't matter much)
Power Attack (this is a prerequisite for the Warchanter enhancement, which adds a lot to your combat buffs, you get this at level 6)
Toughness (extra HP good)
Extend Spell (makes your buffs much better)

Skills:
The key ones are Use Magic Device (maximise this at every level, although it doesn't do much for you until you get it into the low 20s); Haggle (buying stuff cheap will help a lot on your first character); and Jump and Balance (these help you jump obstacles and avoid being tripped respectively, once you gain experience with the game mechanics Jump will help you avoid foes too).

Spells:
Take one of Cure Light Wounds or Charm Person at level 1. Take the other at level 2. Take anything you like at level 3, at 4 take Suggestion. Even though your Charisma is only moderate, you'll be quite effective at casting Charm spells in lower level quests, especially once you learn which foes are more susceptible.

At level 7, take Haste. It's the best buff in the game.


Enhancements:
Take the enhancements that improve your ability to buff through your songs; particularly Inspired Attack and Inspired Damage. You'll also need Inspired Bravery to qualify for Warchanter at level 6. Enhancements are easy to change - so feel free to mess around with them.

[geezee]

IMO the Bard is the strongest class in the game at low level, if built correctly.

A first level bard can have a 16 Strength (which when combined with their own song, grants them a further +1 attack/+2 damage for about the same results as an 18 Str melee. They can also have a 16 Charisma and the Charm Person spell, which is phenomonally powerful throughout all of the Harbor quests. Not to mention, their songs benefit allies too, not just themself.

At level 2 they gain Cure Light Wounds - making them even better at helping the party and keeping themself at a solid hp total.

At level 4, and this is most important, Charm Person starts to lose some of its lustre (due to you encountering Ogres, Giants, Trolls etc). That's conveniently exactly when the Bard gains the spell Suggestion. Now you can fight like a melee, and bring better crowd control to the table than a Sorc can, and buff, and play a (very) secondary healing role.

So from levels 1-5, IMO a Bard is the best crowd controller, the best buffer, a solid melee and a mediocre healer.


At higher levels, you start to lose a little of this power. Clerics streak well ahead of you in Healing, and you can't come close to keeping up. Sorcs and Wizards surpass your crowd control skills and gain mass damage spells like Firewall, and unbuffed melees become as good as you are selfbuffed at fighting. But, you remain the king of buffing.

Well, since you agree with me, you obviously know nothing about bards. They were gonna flame you anyway and edit your quotes.

Bard is not considered a playable class for new players. Everyone on this forum has another toon who is better than their bard. If you did know anything about bards, no one wants to hear it because this is not a suitable venue for discussing the bard class. I hope this teaches you a lesson not to have simplistic thinking and recognize the true power of epeen from Chinese gold farmer.

[Amabel]

Geez - I must say I didn't read most of the flames... hope they were interesting.

OP - bards are great fun. Most fun class in game in my opinion. However, they are a bit multi ability dependent (you want CHA, STR, CON and perhaps enough DEX for TWF) and benefit greatly from 32 point builds, which you open with 1750 favour, or from Drow, which you open with 400 favour.

On the other hand, many clerics can be just as effective as a 28 point human or dwarf. Max WIS and CON and you're pretty much set. A bit of STR is good, but it's barely going to matter by the time you're capped.

I suggest you go with cleric, at least until you open the Drow race, and then if you feel like a change make a Drow bard. Especially if there's a little min/maxer inside you. Otherwise you'll be re-rolling that 28 point bard eventually. The 28 point cleric you may just keep. (Although I rerolled my 28 point cleric too. )

[Freeman]

I'm new to DDO (but not MMOs) and I'm trying to debate between playing a bard or a cleric...What do you guys think?

Bard can be tough for new players, as it's the most versatile and difficult to play class.

I disagree with the above posters in that bards can be powerful at low levels too. That depends on the PLAYER.

Fixed that one little part for you.

I'll repeat, since Geezee seems to be having some difficulty remembering what the OP asked. For a new player that is unfamiliar with DDO, most people suggested starting off with a cleric until he got a little more experience with the game, be it a day, week, month, whatever. Clerics are more forgiving of new players, and group members will usually be more forgiving of a new cleric than other classes. A battle bard can be a powerful character, but if someone has no experience with combat in DDO, I would never recommend they try that one out first. For just about any new player, I generally recommend either cleric, paladin, or WF wizard. IMHO, those are the easiest classes to play while learning the game.

[seldarin]

I disagree with the above posters in that bards can be powerful at low levels too. That depends on the build. Most battle bards, for example, are overpowered at low levels.

Bard can be tough for new players, as it's the most versatile and difficult to play class. One thing about bards is that there is a multitude of different builds and playstyles. A bard can be built to do just about anything but nuke in DDO.

To answer your questions, bards are highly sought after and a lot of fun to play. I find all the other classes boring and frustrating to play by comparison.

Clerics are better at healing, bards have the best buffs in DDO. Bards can do a lot of things that clerics (and other classes) cant do. One thing about bards that beats the hell out of clerics is that you have a lot more freedom to do what you want. Clerics are expected to heal in DDO, where as no one cares what a bard does as long as he sings a couple songs and hastes everyone. The other thing that really bugs me about playing my cleric after being used to playing bards is how slow he runs and not being able to jump. Like being an old man after being in the NBA.

In the end, it boils down to playstyle. If you like keeping everyone alive and healed, cleric is probably better. If you have a short attention span and like doing all kinds of different things, play a bard.

My bard solo healed Elite runs at lvl 10 through madstone, i play a cleric as well, class doesnt make a better healer, player does. I good player on a bard can and invariably does make a better healer than a bad player on a cleric. Its all to do with playstyle, not class. As to the OPS initial post i would recommend either class. Bard has availability to that magical little skill called Haggle, plus charisma, making it a wee bit cheaper to buy stuff wouldnt you say. To contradict another post, i wouldnt say its cheaper to run a cleric, if you need to buy wands etc it would be cheaper doing it as a bard wouldnt it? Unless you have a high lvl toon to do it for you, but then again if you are a new player this wouldnt be the case would it? A class is only as difficult as you choose to make it.

[~thecaseys2004]

your all wrong. now talk over that chicken heads