Idea - Modify Low Level Experience Scale Back to Old for 28 Pt Builds

[Ganak]

Have you seen the following theme in-game and in forums posts like I have?


We all want new players in the game--yet many hesitate to group with inexperienced players in high end content due to inexperience.


Idea:
Modify the low level experience scale back to the old scale for 28 Pt builds. Keep the current xp scale in place for 32 pt builds.


Background:
In the early days of DDO, the experience scale was different. For example, it took 30,000 XP to hit level 2, instead of the 10,000 it does now (numbers as best I remember them).

The developers lowered the experience total needed to get through the lower levels for many reasons (historians can give details). However, the game has really evolved in my opinion. We have more awesome low level content and outdoor areas.


Benefits of change:
1. New players get more seasoning and experience playing their characters.
2. Low level content gets more traffic. We've got great low level content!
3. Experienced players keep the current scale (I'm sorry I consider a player inexperienced if they do not have a 1750 favor character).
4. Another motivation for 1750 favor (i.e. a good reason to run a wide variety of content).

Drawbacks:
1. Some complaining I'm sure from those playing a while without 1750 favor (see comment above).


Please suggest feedback! Thx!

[BuzzSaw]

So let me get this straight....

You want to actively punish new players to the game on their first trip to 16 ???

All just so you don't have to have the onerous burden of having to play with them while they learn ??

Oh yea...that'll bring 'em in in droves...

If you don't want to play with new players then drop group when you realize they are in the party. Better they know you are the one that has the problem rather then Turbine.
Buzz

[Kerrn_Siff]

I remember those days.. and it was really.. really.. slow. You already have to rerun all the low level quests a few times just to level on the current xp scale, nm the old one where the average player spent a week in WW etc. Also there would be issues with experienced players trying to help newbies and either leveling faster or having to hold back so as not to mess with the party xp dynamic.

Lower levels need a revamp I agree, but additional quests would be more in line with producing a more enjoyable lowbie experience as opposed to punishing new players IMO.

[Ganak]

Thanks for the good feedback.

The idea is not to punish, but rather an extended learning opportunity. When I began the game, I never considered running lower levels a "punishment."

To clarify: I want new players in the game to have a good experience, and I want to group with them at the highest levels. Think about this: When they are not prepared and capable at the higher level quests (think VoD, Hound, Elite high level quests) does it do them any good? The idea is to prepare them so they have a good experience and are not shunned because they did not do well in a high level quest.

Back in the day, it was slow after the initial few trips through the lower levels. Thus the change. However, there is more low level content now, and the idea is once the player gets experience (i.e. 1750 favor) they no longer have to deal with the large experience gaps of the lower levels.

Keep the feedback coming!

[Uska]

I am sorry but this has to rank up with one the worst ideas I have ever read. Exp is fine the way it is new players shouldnt be punished because they are new and sometimes people with 28pt builds arent new they are playing on a new server if they didnt any change at all it should be to give a small bonus maybe to people who group with 28pt builds now that may encourage people to group with such the bonus shouldnt be more then 1-2%, also how are you really gonna know if someone is 28pt build or not unless they tell you? hmmmm

[Ganak]

Again, where do we get the idea that running low level quests for a new player is punishment?

[moorewr]

I can't sign on to different XP by favor. Trust me, that veteran player will level quicker anyway.

People get upset about 32 point builds, period. Can you imagine what they'd say if they found out other players in their group had an easy button they were denied beyond starting stats, money, gear etc etc?

[Aranticus]

Thanks for the good feedback.

The idea is not to punish, but rather an extended learning opportunity. When I began the game, I never considered running lower levels a "punishment."

low levels are usually boring and new players will leave

To clarify: I want new players in the game to have a good experience, and I want to group with them at the highest levels. Think about this: When they are not prepared and capable at the higher level quests (think VoD, Hound, Elite high level quests) does it do them any good? The idea is to prepare them so they have a good experience and are not shunned because they did not do well in a high level quest.

there are many ways to get good players. for a start, give more xp to quests that requires varied tactics, so that people will not run the same old quests for leveling ie in faithful departed u protect some enemy mummies, this means no nuke or THF tactics but xp is so low its not worth the trouble running it

Back in the day, it was slow after the initial few trips through the lower levels. Thus the change. However, there is more low level content now, and the idea is once the player gets experience (i.e. 1750 favor) they no longer have to deal with the large experience gaps of the lower levels.

Keep the feedback coming!

when was back in the days? i started at around mod2 n i dun recall the xp scale changing

[ArkoHighStar]

when was back in the days? i started at around mod2 n i dun recall the xp scale changing

between mod 1 and 2, I rember vbecause Euphonia's used to give 5k xp to get your first action point becase lvl 2 was 10k. So the night before te change everyone created characters and got them through euphonias so they coulfd be lvl 2 the next day.

[Kromize]

OR...just add in a character rebuild feature to the game. So the inexperienced can rebuild if their current character is really that bad...and the experienced don't have to re-roll...

This would work like this:
1-You decide you want to rebuild to make your character perfecter(cause' we all know, our characters are perfect...even if they are melee only wizards).
2-You find a mind flayer(not just fred, Bob! ), pay him some money and some dragon shards, and he agrees you wipe both your mental and physical memories clean of feats, stats, and other abilities.
3-Without losing any experience from the ordeal(he's a really skilled mind flayer), you can go about leveling up your character as you wish.(you would go through the character creation process as well)

I read a post about tokens for this, like 1 token for 1 level of a certain class, so that if you were 11 fighter, 2 rogue, 3 paladin, you would then get 11 fighter tokens, 2 rogue tokens, and 3 paladin tokens. And if u wanted to go pure fighter, you could then use the 11 fighter tokens, and would have to manually regain experience for the other fighter levels. Also, if you were a level 11 when you went through this, you could not use any tokens past lvl 11, to be exact, when you achieve lvl 11, any remaining tokens disappear.


But then again...actually seeing something like this implemented...lol Kinda like an account vault, for all your characters to access. And guild housing/banking. Etc...(oh, I could put so many etcetera's...but I won't.)

[Aranticus]

between mod 1 and 2, I rember vbecause Euphonia's used to give 5k xp to get your first action point becase lvl 2 was 10k. So the night before te change everyone created characters and got them through euphonias so they coulfd be lvl 2 the next day.

so they reduced the xp euphonia gave? how is this making it easier to level? i still dun get it lol

[Aranticus]

OR...just add in a character rebuild feature to the game. So the inexperienced can rebuild if their current character is really that bad...and the experienced don't have to re-roll...

This would work like this:
1-You decide you want to rebuild to make your character perfecter(cause' we all know, our characters are perfect...even if they are melee only wizards).
2-You find a mind flayer(not just fred, Bob! ), pay him some money and some dragon shards, and he agrees you wipe both your mental and physical memories clean of feats, stats, and other abilities.
3-Without losing any experience from the ordeal(he's a really skilled mind flayer), you can go about leveling up your character as you wish.(you would go through the character creation process as well)

I read a post about tokens for this, like 1 token for 1 level of a certain class, so that if you were 11 fighter, 2 rogue, 3 paladin, you would then get 11 fighter tokens, 2 rogue tokens, and 3 paladin tokens. And if u wanted to go pure fighter, you could then use the 11 fighter tokens, and would have to manually regain experience for the other fighter levels. Also, if you were a level 11 when you went through this, you could not use any tokens past lvl 11, to be exact, when you achieve lvl 11, any remaining tokens disappear.


But then again...actually seeing something like this implemented...lol Kinda like an account vault, for all your characters to access. And guild housing/banking. Etc...(oh, I could put so many etcetera's...but I won't.)

i'd just limit this to the first 5 levels rather than opening everything up..... could be a can of worms

[binnsr]

This is the kind of idea that dingo123 would have come up with...

my main account with 1750 multiple times says no thanks
my second account that doesn't have 1750 says NO THANKS

[Wan6Tan6]

You need to get to level 4 easily, within a week of casual play, otherwise, that money from the possible sale with a trial account you were about to make goes out the window.

[Ikuryo]

Euphonia's gives you 1/5 or 1/4 the amount of xp you require to level, enough to get your first action point. When the xp required to gain level 2 was 30k you would receive 6kxp. When the xp required to gain level 2 was changed to 10k Euphonia's rewarded you with 2kxp instead, which is the amount needed to get your first action point with the new xp scale.

The old xp levels would probably be a bit slow, maybe somewhere in the middle, or just for the first couple levels with it removed if you hit a lower favor level, say 250 or so. Something not so high that it required knowledge of the whole game but enough to let you have some quests and experience playing under your belt. It would depend on how the NPE is though. If they have done well with it then this will be less of an issue. They will still need to have quests they are not experienced with explained to them but this is true for all people who are new to a quest. The fact that people are expected to know how to do quests they have never set foot in is a failing I've seen in a number of higher level quests. It helps if new people say that they are new and actually LISTEN when people are giving directions though.

[Dariuss]

I remember those days.. and it was really.. really.. slow. You already have to rerun all the low level quests a few times just to level on the current xp scale, nm the old one where the average player spent a week in WW etc. Also there would be issues with experienced players trying to help newbies and either leveling faster or having to hold back so as not to mess with the party xp dynamic.
.

This is only true because players limit themsleves to durks/ww/ringleader/info is key on their way out of the harbor. It is quite easy to level without repeating quests if you go for a variety (liek an ew player might).

[MageLL]

Whether it is punishment or not is irrelevant.

The purpose of the idea was so that players have more experience by the time they are able to run the high end quest. There is a couple things wrong with this idea for that purpose. First, it doesn't matter how much game experience you have, we are all newbs when a new quest opens up. Your first run through VoD is your first run through VoD regardless if you been playing since beta or not. Secondly good gear comes from either A luck or B repeating the same thing over and over. The general idea of having newer players be more advantageous to a group is good, but making them play longer to gain levels isn't going to achieve that.

[Kromize]

i'd just limit this to the first 5 levels rather than opening everything up..... could be a can of worms

well...the first 5 levels are the easiest to get tho...you can get those in a few hours...almost takes the point of re-building away...

[Aranticus]

well...the first 5 levels are the easiest to get tho...you can get those in a few hours...almost takes the point of re-building away...

precisely. if you allow anyone to change their classes so easily, then it defeats the purpose of "building" a character. what many will do is just to accumulate the tokens, and when a new mod comes, change into the flavor of the month

[Lorien_the_First_One]

Again, where do we get the idea that running low level quests for a new player is punishment?

Having to repeatedly grind them is punishment.