whats the best class for wf

[iruka41]

i know of the elf and halfling thing but most elves are wizards and wizards dont care anything sorta for dex cause main one is int and most halflings are rouges and rouges are mainly dex and int cause of some of the skills

Most elves are not Wizards. I bet there's more Elven Rangers than Elven Wizards. Also there's a lot of DEX-based Elven fighter/rogue/bard, or even STR-based high DEX Elven barb/fighter/pally/etc/etc. Don't even have to count sooo many Elven multiclassed builds out there other than wizards.

You're right though, High DEX doesn't mean anything to wizards now that we have the feat: Insightful Relfexes,
but high DEX still means something to sorcerers, for high Reflex save (=guarantied half damage from most spells).

Unless it's a raid quests,
High DEX WF Sorcerer = the Most Deadly, yet the Most Indesructable in the game. No one can match its "DPS + Survivability"
(Oh well, I'm talking about 14 starting DEX here, not 18 lol)

[iruka41]

ok, lets get some things down, those 38 dex finesse rangers out there with 10 str, are not doing real damage, so im not sure how less dex is going to be " less damage"

Sure, an elf or halfling makes a better dex ranger, but finesse rangers are a waste of a raid spot bud.

Good Dex-Rangers start at least with 12 STR, get Power Attack, and leave it on always, if DPS is needed.
(But really, who needs STR-based dps when there's finessable W/P,V,D,S,B weapons?)

Raid spot? I'm sure those Dex-Rangers are doing about the same on their racial-enemies as most non-ranger melees.
And they're better at killing non-boss mobs in raids. How come they be a waste of spot?

Have capped both DEX, STR rangers, and this is my conclusion.
Of course my bio says my main is a STR-based Dwarven Ranger and I prefer STR-builds, but I don't think DEX-Rangers suck at all.
Actually after the Monk and the Icy outfit, I wish I have another Dex-Ranger.

[iruka41]

Actually a dwarf would be a better brick wall then a wf

It's really situational.
Raid Curses and Docent of Defiance changed entire game expirience.

[iruka41]

right now, sorc is like insanely popular, sorc being just an awesome class anyways, but being able to reconstruct at the snap of a finger seems really good. err, is really good, many of the best players I know have wf sorcs.

edit: also I'm glad to see WF getting love, back in the day it used to be WF couldn't get a group, now alot of people are being very creative with them and coming up with stuff that is really strong. As I'm only just coming back froma yr break, its nice to see this.

Even I become seriously aggresive when I'm playing my WF 15Sorc/1Barb.
It's just too powerful. Makes me feel like every other races are squishey, every other classes are low-DPSed
(But still I prefer to play my Ranger :P)

[DragonKiller]

Personally I think WF's are great at any Melee class, and as Arcane casters. They can also be very effective as rogues.

I lean towards using them as Barb's (because of the immunities, and the fact they don't become exhausted after raging), and Wizards. Some of my guildies have very successfully used them as Sorc's and Pally's. One of my favorite characters to play right now is a 12/3/1 Barb/Rogue/Wiz WF. Great DPS, HP, Trap/lock smithing and able to self heal and buff reasonably well (if a bit expensive in wand usages).

[Uska]

thatd be a short brickwall

but much much thicker than a wf one

[Uska]

Good Dex-Rangers start at least with 12 STR, get Power Attack, and leave it on always, if DPS is needed.
(But really, who needs STR-based dps when there's finessable W/P,V,D,S,B weapons?)

Raid spot? I'm sure those Dex-Rangers are doing about the same on their racial-enemies as most non-ranger melees.
And they're better at killing non-boss mobs in raids. How come they be a waste of spot?

Have capped both DEX, STR rangers, and this is my conclusion.
Of course my bio says my main is a STR-based Dwarven Ranger and I prefer STR-builds, but I don't think DEX-Rangers suck at all.
Actually after the Monk and the Icy outfit, I wish I have another Dex-Ranger.

takes 13 str to get power attack doesnt it?

[shadow543256]

but much much thicker than a wf one

to me, dwarves are short angry stumps perfect to throw at people

[nbhs275]

Good Dex-Rangers start at least with 12 STR, get Power Attack, and leave it on always, if DPS is needed.
(But really, who needs STR-based dps when there's finessable W/P,V,D,S,B weapons?)

Raid spot? I'm sure those Dex-Rangers are doing about the same on their racial-enemies as most non-ranger melees.
And they're better at killing non-boss mobs in raids. How come they be a waste of spot?

Have capped both DEX, STR rangers, and this is my conclusion.
Of course my bio says my main is a STR-based Dwarven Ranger and I prefer STR-builds, but I don't think DEX-Rangers suck at all.
Actually after the Monk and the Icy outfit, I wish I have another Dex-Ranger.

ok, lets consider dps.

DPS = damage per second, which basically what is needed for any red/purple, and some orange and norms.

Wounding of puncturing doesnt count as dps, as all red/purples are immune.
Vorps, don't count as dps, as all red/purples and some normals are immune.
Disruptors, neither, yet again immune.
Smiting? immunities
Banishers? all red/purples are immune, as are most elementals and outsiders in endgame.

Even in a place where those weapons are useful, the str ranger is only MAYBE 1-2 attack behind. When your already hitting on a 2, it doesnt matter. The weapons are the same strength between the two, unless you consider the fact that the str ranger will kill faster because he also has more dps along with the proc chance.

Next, lets look at my "str" ranger WF, vs your "dex" ranger .

My str is 30 standing, and yours is what? 18-20 maybe? I benefit from madstone rage as a constant(because 1. i got 7 pairs from soloing reaver and 2. you get hit when you can actually do damage and gain aggro) so average of 32 str vs a 34ish dex. and your wasting a feat on finesse, so lets say i spent that same feat on weapon focus. Wow, we are both at the same to-hit, but i also do 6 more str damage in my main hand, and have the WF PA bonuses, for 1-3 more damage in each hand.

And in raids, the main worry are your red and purple bosses. Those are the fights that are make or break.

Can you finesse rangers do 120+ crits on harry with a rapier? how about 200+ in your offhand?

Plain and simple, DPS builds are > finesse builds. The advantages of a finesse dex build just arent outweighing their drawbacks.

[Hvymetal]

Warforged pure cleric........
Talk about the ultimate battle cleric with self healing, nuke spells and built in immunities. If the caster works with you, you can save SP by healing all the fleshies and having the caster repair you. And guess what, you're the healer so who's gonna argue with you saying they don't want to waster resources healing the toaster! :-)

QFT I love my WF Cleric, but I took 1 level of Paladin.

[sirgog]

My suggestions:

Avoid builds that are AC-focussed, as non-WFs can generally do better here (either as a Dwarf in mithril fullplate or mith BP, or as a halfling with uber Dex and robes).

WF shine most as melee/caster hybrids (these require an experienced player, search the board for the Arcane Psycho build to get an idea of what these can look like, although they can also be high Str Wiz15/Ftr1), barbarians and also make excellent pure casters.

Of course, this assumes you want to minmax your character so you can handle endgame raids on hard and elite - if that's not your goal, feel free to make anything.