The new Intimitank with monk levels.

[wolfy42]

I've been kicking around this build for a week now. The main reason for me to play with it was to test how well a non-pure monk can stack up to monk abilities.

The concept is simple. Get a character who can use a maxed out intimidate while having the highest AC possible, very high saving throws and evasion.

Monks can get all that except they have to multiclass 1 level as fighter to get intimidate.

Monks though have some serious penalties. They are very restricted in weapon choice (especially if finess based), they can not use shields which seriously penalizes their DR available, they have very limited self healing (restricted to FoL and a meditation ability that costs 40 ki (useful in some solo instances but not great in a party or as emergency backup when fighting).


This build though works very well and covers almost all of the advantages the monk gets. You get SR...just not as strong as a monks....you get excellent saving throws and evasion (no improved evasion but a high enough reflex save that it doesn't matter), you get a higher AC then the monk, self healing, buff spells including full resists etc.

Here is the basic build:

Drow Paladin 12/monk 2/fighter 2 (alternative is paladin 11/monk 3/fighter 2 for fists of light but you lose DS damage that way).

Stats:

Str 10 (boosted up to 18-20 (depending on tome) eventually)
Dex 18
con 10 (toughness feats compensate for the low max hp...you get 4 extra feats 2 of which can be toughness)
int 12 (+2 tome lets you max UMD....+1 tome anyone can get for CE)
wis 14
Cha 14

Level up stats into dex.

First lvl should be monk for the extra skill points....make sure you put 2 into intimidate even at the first lvl so you can easily keep it maxed when yout ake your fighter levels.

Required feats:

Dodge, CE, Weapon Finess, Toughness (at least 1), improved crit piercing

Suggested feats:

Shield mastery, Improved shield mastery, Skill focus intimidate, additional toughness feat (minimum of 2).

Hp max reachers over 400 if you take 2 toughness feats or more along with maxing paladin toughness enhancement and lvl 1 monk turtle enhancement.

AC is the highest in game currently possible. It is superior to a pure monk halfling AC build by 3-4.

You do not even need a resist item/nightshield spell etc to reach saving throws high enough to not matter anymore (opens up more slots which you need for stats).

Very equipment dependant. You can use a rapier for extreme crit range (kurkri for slash).

DR is fairly decent as well (not optimal since you can't use a tower shield without loosing a ton of AC). The +6 to DR from shield masteries though adds up quickly...especially in combo with natural DR from robes till you get WDSR.

Full resists up constantly + extreme ac + decent DR + awesome saves + evasion + extreme crit range (15-20 norm...14-20 for smites), healing, immunities etc = nice useful character.

You can solo very well and are extremely useful in a party.

[Inspire]

Post The Ac Breakdown Please, Buffed And Unbuffed.

[ShadowFox1978]

I may be wrong, but doesn't a sheild uncenter you? If so would that not negate your wisdom bonus to AC?

[Angelus_dead]

AC is the highest in game currently possible. It is superior to a pure monk halfling AC build by 3-4.

How can you say a drow has the highest AC? Anything the Drow does, a halfling can do too, and also have a +1 size bonus.

[wolfy42]

Yeah the build has the highest AC sorry...not the race.

But drow has +2 int/dex/cha all of which are needed for the build...so to me it's worth the sacrifice of AC for the over all bonus.

That being said a halfling gets +2 dex...so the difference is only 4 creation points between them and a 32 point halfling build makes up for that.

Therefore you can go with the halfling pally 12/monk 2/fighter 2 and that allows you to use your extra feats for dragonmarks if you want...a nice long term bonus.

I posted the AC breakdown in the other thread...I can copy and paste it...but that was for the halfling version. Ends up with a 73 base ac (74 if you start with a 20 dex and 8 cha...but who starts with an 8 cha as a pally?).

I'll go copy and paste it here.

[wolfy42]

Oh and you do not lose your wisdom bonus to AC when uncentered. You only lose your Centered bonus to ac (only 1 point at lvl 1 monk).

You retain your wisdom and dex bonus to AC while uncentered. The question is....is this a bug?

It has not been called a bug and it's been known for awhile now so I have to figure this is working as intended.

[Inspire]

Oh and you do not lose your wisdom bonus to AC when uncentered. You only lose your Centered bonus to ac (only 1 point at lvl 1 monk).

You retain your wisdom and dex bonus to AC while uncentered. The question is....is this a bug?

It has not been called a bug and it's been known for awhile now so I have to figure this is working as intended.

Im Pretty Sure It Is A Known Bug, If You Lose This Trait Your Build Loses 9Ac.

[Borror0]

How can you say a paladin 12 has the highest AC, a 15 paladin/ 1 monk would.

[wolfy42]

AC breakdown

10 base
7 WDSR + alchemical
8 +5 shield with alchemical
12 dex
8 wisdom
5 CE
5 protection
4 pally aura
3 natural
6 dodge
1 size
4 insight

Total = 73

[Inspire]

AC breakdown

10 base
7 WDSR + alchemical
8 +5 shield with alchemical
12 dex
8 wisdom
5 CE
5 protection
4 pally aura
3 natural
6 dodge
1 size
4 insight

Total = 73

I Still Fail To See How You Can Beat A 94 Buffed Ac.

[Angelus_dead]

Oh and you do not lose your wisdom bonus to AC when uncentered. You only lose your Centered bonus to ac (only 1 point at lvl 1 monk).

It looks to me like you also keep the Centered AC bonus while uncentered.

[wolfy42]

Sorry I meant the highest possible AC that actually makes sense to play lol.


The pally 15/monk 1 would have a higher ac (1 more from aura), but you miss out on evasion, intimidate as a class skill, 3 feats etc.

You can get a higher AC but once your in the low to mid 70's unbuffed.......I don't think it's worth sacrificing so much for just a few more points.

Thats why the 18 dex instead of 20 (better to have a 14 starting cha). Same with 11-12 pally levels instead of 14-15 for the last AC point from the aura....just not worth it for the slight bonus (course having holy sword would be nice too).

You could go pally 14/monk 2 (I think the last aura bonus is lvl 14 pally not 15)....still get evasion, get 2 bonus feats.....but you lose 9 points from intimidate.....which makes you far less effective as your primary role in a group.

AC by itself is not enough, you have to be able to USE the AC to actually help your party!!

[wolfy42]

All the buffs you can get inspire (other then shield which is short term in most cases and requires UMD even in those cases or clickies) my character can get.

The exception of course is having another paladin around giving you an aura.

So yeah...IF your character has afriendly paladin sitting next to him....he will have a higher AC.

Other then that they can both buff up the same.


And I double, tripple and quadripple checked.....you lose your centered bonus to AC when wearing a shield...or uncentered at all.

[Inspire]

All the buffs you can get inspire (other then shield which is short term in most cases and requires UMD even in those cases or clickies) my character can get.

The exception of course is having another paladin around giving you an aura.

So yeah...IF your character has afriendly paladin sitting next to him....he will have a higher AC.

Other then that they can both buff up the same.


And I double, tripple and quadripple checked.....you lose your centered bonus to AC when wearing a shield...or uncentered at all.

Yep, Nearby Paladin Will Add +5 To The Build I Posted, And 1 To Yours.

73Ac +1 Paladin = 74
72Ac +5 Paladin = 77 (+4 Shield Wand Lvl5*For Easy UMD*) 81

With Just The Shield Wand Thats

73Ac Vs. 76Ac

[wolfy42]

As far as highest AC buffed.

Your build gains 5 AC from having a full pally aura affecting him.

Mine gains only 1.

Thats 4 AC difference.

My build has 2 more AC with similar stats to yours.......so naturally could run around with a 74 AC.

If as Borrow says....you went with 14 pally/2 monk and said who caires to intimidate) you could nab a 5 aura all the time...meaning running around with 75 AC.


That being said my build and yours standing next to eachother with a full pally aura affecting us....yours would have 2 more AC then mine.....fully buffed. If you include the shield spell (1 minute duration per clickie/scroll) you could get 6 more total.

So true...fully buffed with very limited duration you could have a higher AC.

But standing AC (IE solo/nonbuffed) mine has more....has intimidate to make use of it...has superior blocking abilities and DR, more feats, more max hp, self healing, DS's, Smites etc.

[Inspire]

As far as highest AC buffed.

Your build gains 5 AC from having a full pally aura affecting him.

Mine gains only 1.

Thats 4 AC difference.

My build has 2 more AC with similar stats to yours.......so naturally could run around with a 74 AC.

If as Borrow says....you went with 14 pally/2 monk and said who caires to intimidate) you could nab a 5 aura all the time...meaning running around with 75 AC.


That being said my build and yours standing next to eachother with a full pally aura affecting us....yours would have 2 more AC then mine.....fully buffed. If you include the shield spell (1 minute duration per clickie/scroll) you could get 6 more total.

So true...fully buffed with very limited duration you could have a higher AC.

But standing AC (IE solo/nonbuffed) mine has more....has intimidate to make use of it...has superior blocking abilities and DR, more feats, more max hp, self healing, DS's, Smites etc.

Yep Yours Has 1 More Ac More Unbuffed.

Mine Has 7 More Ac Buffed Actually.

[Inspire]

Mine Is However A Pure Monk, And They Have Great Saves Too, Wholeness Of Body For Self Healing(Should Be No Problem For A 2wF Kama Using Monk) Also Fist Of Light/Healing Ki, They Also Have 26SR Before A Cleric Buff.

[wolfy42]

It would have 2 more if I went with a 20 dex and 8 cha....it only has 1 more AC if you start with a 18 dex.


But I agree...nobody would actually start with a 20 dex...so your right


A naturally running around 73 ac though is nice....very nice.

Especially with all the other bonuses you get along with it....a intimidate around 50, evasion + extremely high saves etc.

DPS? Not so great...but neather is a monks.

Crit range is superior though as is weapon versatility.

Going to be my first ever intimidate based build

Course just watch...2 months down the road we will suddenly hear that wisdom bonus is not supposed to work with shields and poof it will end up being worthless lol.

I guess I could always switch to TWF at that point though...that would allow me to get both a dex bonus and insight bonus on my weapons. I could snag TWD as well and luckily I have been boosting UMD already so shield scrolls will be easy to use....I guess it wouldn't be the end of the world if they do make shields unuseable...it would just reduce the extreme top end AC a tiny bit and make me reliant on shield scrolls.

[Inspire]

It would have 2 more if I went with a 20 dex and 8 cha....it only has 1 more AC if you start with a 18 dex.


But I agree...nobody would actually start with a 20 dex...so your right

Yep, Youd Also Lose Alot Of The Nifty Paladin Bonuses To A Degree, 8Cha = Terrible LOH/Saves, Not To Mention Youd Be Relying On An Inventory Slot(One You Could Use Towards Ac) For A Charisma Item To Use LOH.

[wolfy42]

Yeah we have VERY similar monk builds Inspire....mine took halfling dragonmarks as well for self healing...and I have soloed a ton using Wholeness of body which is indead cake to get 40ki to use. It's not that useful in a party and pretty much worthless in elite content which is what really matters though. Same with FoL and it's finisher...totally absolutely worthless in any quests post lvl 10 on elite and often even hard.

I like the defense I have on my monk...and even his HP are not too bad for survivability. I don't like not having intimidate though...that would have made him far more useful in a group. I need something else to play when I want a break for him so the pally/monk/fighter intimidate build seems like fun to me