4 Clerical architypes and how they measure up.

[sigtrent]

Yes, Some people can absolutly enjoy sitting back and waiting for someone to take damage so they can cast a heal and contribute that way to a party.

There is more to it than that of course. A strong healing cleric is all about keeping the rest of the party running. You need to make sure you have LOS to combatants, arn't pulliung agro, keep buffs up on allies, spot cc mosnters, thow out DV's, etc... A good healbot makes it so the party doesn't even need to think about survival and can just plow forward at top speed.

Healbots are most fun when the adventure is a good solid challenge for the group. If its a cakewalk its really boring because they just don't need you. But if the party is teetering on the brink of death in the tough fights, playing a main healer is pretty exciting and demanding.

[Strakeln]

500+ Point per tick Critical blade Barriers are by far the single highest DPS inteh game when you know how to kite properly.

I disagree, even using the weave kite instead of the back-and-forth, still doesn't compare to what a sorc can unleash.

DPM has a good case, though.

[Impaqt]

I disagree, even using the weave kite instead of the back-and-forth, still doesn't compare to what a sorc can unleash.

DPM has a good case, though.

What? WIth Firewall? In the Vale? lol

[sirgog]

i play a "healbot" but that doesn't mean that i don't play "very smart". all of the groups that i join are glad when i heal them....that is what my toon is for to heal. and yes there are battle clerics out there and i have been in the groups where there was one, and thank god that i was in there, else everyone would have died due to the fact the other cleric wasn't healing anyone. you can play your toons the way you want to, i don't judge you....don't judge me!

When I'm in a 6-player group with Numot and another cleric, I always assume the role of primary melee unless the other cleric gets low on SP. (Of course, I check this with the party first).

[Strakeln]

What? WIth Firewall? In the Vale? lol

I didn't say "firewall", and you didn't say "in the Vale".

There's a world of difference between "single highest DPS inteh game" and "against one specific mob, in a particular quest, on the third thursday after the full moon following the next lowering of prices at QwijyMart".

[DoctorWhofan]

Iamahealbot...Iamahealbot...Iamahealbot...Iamaheal bot...

It doesn't matter that I have combat spells as my hotbar.

It doesn't matter that I have Empower

It doesn't matter that I have Cloudburst and a slew of excellent maces.

It doesn't matter what others say I AM A HEALBOT.

If I think any other way, I'd might as well break out the sorcerer.

[Impaqt]

I didn't say "firewall", and you didn't say "in the Vale".

There's a world of difference between "single highest DPS inteh game" and "against one specific mob, in a particular quest, on the third thursday after the full moon following the next lowering of prices at QwijyMart".

the game IS the Vale and Shroud right now for most folks. It is for me.

[moorewr]

No, no no. No way. Why must I be smashed into a cookie cutter?

If you are the only Cleric in a PUG, sure, yes you are the healbot. If all you ever do is watch red bars you could condense this down to a flash game of whack-a-mole.

Even some PUGs aren't that way.

I was pugging a while ago on my cleric/rogue and one character was already annoying us.. and he started yelling at me that I wasn't healing him fast enough (Never mind that I was being a good little healbot and using all my mana on him). and mind you, we were in Sorrowdusk doing quests on normal.. piece of cake, right? We had a vote and kicked him out of the group.

Iamahealbot...Iamahealbot...Iamahealbot...Iamaheal bot...

It doesn't matter that I have combat spells as my hotbar.

It doesn't matter that I have Empower

It doesn't matter that I have Cloudburst and a slew of excellent maces.

It doesn't matter what others say I AM A HEALBOT.

If I think any other way, I'd might as well break out the sorcerer.

[Tigsen]

I try not to PUG too much, but when I do, I know the expectation is that I am wanted as a healbot, and I have no issues with such. In good PUGs (ie: folks are willing to learn) I've had the opportunity to show folks how powerful blade barrier can be; also how effective the tactic of using meleers to block a door way while the wizard/sorc burns down the mobs who, being focused on the wiz/sorc, don't swing at the meleers at all (who of course are not swinging at all so as to avoid getting agro).

When with my guild, I typically group up with Antivenom/Kyleal (on Sarlona) He is one of the nicest guys you'll ever meet - a fantastic group leader who knows the quests well and gets everyone involved, including our clerics... he'll have us lay down blade barriers at the right times, etc., which really gives me an opportunity to be alot more than just a healbot. This is likely due to his main character, Antivenom, being a cleric, too, so he knows we're capable of doing far more than just healing.

As for the groupings layed out in this thread, I guess I fall into the caster class, as I have quicken, maximize, and the empower spell feats. I will dual wield a +3 superior potency VI scepter along with a +3 greater spell penetration VII scepter to give the majority of my offensive spells the maximum boost possible. I've taken cleric spell penetration I & II, but haven't taken the Spell Penetration or Greater Spell Penetration feats. I may drop empower healing in order to pick up Heighten, I'll have to see... I normally lay down a blade barrier as it is simply the best bang for the buck, so to speak, when it comes to damage done for the spell points, but I can definitely see the value of a Heightened Sound Burst, too.

Tigsen

[Ringos]

You can even excell at that type of play. playing that game becomes pretty monotonous to me..... Its almost like a game of keeping red bars full more than DDO.

Clerics can do so much more.... and the phrase "An ounce of prevention is better than a pound of cure" is pretty accurate.....

Yeah, that used to be me...I'd go to sleep at night and see red bars going down and up when I closed my eyes.

I learned to throw a few ounces of 'prevention' in the mix and had a TON more fun in the process!

[Darkwolf]

I've had the opportunity to show folks how powerful blade barrier can be; also how effective the tactic of using meleers to block a door way while the wizard/sorc burns down the mobs who, being focused on the wiz/sorc, don't swing at the meleers at all (who of course are not swinging at all so as to avoid getting agro).

You do realize, they are fixing this silly broken tactic with Mod7. Right? Keeping a mob from his agrro target will now earn hate. And rightly so, IMO.

[DoctorWhofan]

No, no no. No way. Why must I be smashed into a cookie cutter?

If you are the only Cleric in a PUG, sure, yes you are the healbot. If all you ever do is watch red bars you could condense this down to a flash game of whack-a-mole.

Even some PUGs aren't that way.

I was pugging a while ago on my cleric/rogue and one character was already annoying us.. and he started yelling at me that I wasn't healing him fast enough (Never mind that I was being a good little healbot and using all my mana on him). and mind you, we were in Sorrowdusk doing quests on normal.. piece of cake, right? We had a vote and kicked him out of the group.

you didn't read what I SAID.

[Ringos]

you didn't read what I SAID.

That's because he didn't slow down, take time and really put his heart into reading what you wrote.

We aren't all all the same...

[DoctorWhofan]

That's because he didn't slow down, take time and really put his heart into reading what you wrote.

We aren't all all the same...

Thanks... i know Moore is smarter than that, must of read it at work when he shouldn't be!

[Wutinni]

I disagree, even using the weave kite instead of the back-and-forth, still doesn't compare to what a sorc can unleash.

DPM has a good case, though.

I gotta agree with Impaqt here. Although a sorc has the potential to truly blast stuff a caster cleric can easily keep up for less mana. Lets loot at two scenarios

AOE spells vs standard mobs
Arcane - Firewall is really the only AOE persistent spell worth mentioning as and previously stated many mobs are resistant/immune to fire.
Divine - Blade Barrier - nothing has any resistance (Just imagine if clerics could increase the crit chance through enhancements)

DPS one shots
Arcane - Cone of cold, Scorching ray, Polar ray all do great DPS but drain heavy on resources due to maximize empower etc
Divine - Harm is one of most looked over spells in this game. Since most clerics spec for healing its not hard to do 700+ damage for 30 sp. Not only is this efficient use of mana, there is no SR for the spell and evasion wont help you as its a will save not ref. others have made mention of mass heal being added for level 9, if mass harm is added the effects would be devastating.

[Wutinni]

As far as DPS GOes, the Caster Architype is more likely to have both Maximize and Empower Spell.

Thats how My Clerics Roll... They all Have Maximize, but my Offensive caster has Empower Spell as well.... 500+ Point per tick Critical blade Barriers are by far the single highest DPS inteh game when you know how to kite properly.

QFT

[moorewr]

you didn't read what I SAID.

Yes, I surely did.


EDIT: not trying to start any fights - if you are just talking about you you can see I was talking about me.

[Strakeln]

Divine - Blade Barrier - nothing has any resistance

Aside from that pesky evasion and all...

I gotta agree with Impaqt here. Although a sorc has the potential to truly blast stuff a caster cleric can easily keep up for less mana.

So what you're saying, then, is that you agree with me, not Impaqt. Impaqt's claim regarded DPS only, your argument is that the cleric's DPS is less but the DPM is more. Which is *exactly* what I'm saying in the text you quoted.

DPS = Damage Per Second. Mana usage/efficiency has nothing to do with this calculation.
DPM = Damage Per Mana. Mana usage/efficiency has everything to do with this.

This is fact: Impaqt's claim, as originally stated, is completely, utterly, false.

[Impaqt]

Aside from that pesky evasion and all...

So what you're saying, then, is that you agree with me, not Impaqt. Impaqt's claim regarded DPS only, your argument is that the cleric's DPS is less but the DPM is more. Which is *exactly* what I'm saying in the text you quoted.

DPS = Damage Per Second. Mana usage/efficiency has nothing to do with this calculation.
DPM = Damage Per Mana. Mana usage/efficiency has everything to do with this.

This is fact: Impaqt's claim, as originally stated, is completely, utterly, false.

Tell ya what, lets pick a exploerer area, Take a screenshot at start and 10 minutes later. (So that # of kill shows so we can calculate easily how many mobs we kill in that 10 minutes)

Youuse yoru Sorc, I'll use my Cleric. and well see how it comes out.

[Anthios888]

The original poster is so right. I'm never letting a fighter or barbarian or whatever into the group again, because I swear they never watch MY HP and keep me healed.