4 Clerical architypes and how they measure up.

[Wutinni]

I've played my share of clerics, and I thought I would share some experience to new players who may not know what a cleric is capable of when they make their character. For the purpose of this post lets assume that there are 4 types of cleric as posted below. Many players would place their clerics into one of these categories or atleast between two of them.

Battlecleric - Defined as a cleric who's primary focus is melee and buffing to assist with his combat. Although quite capable of crowd control or healing, their focus tends to be on swinging a weapon at whatever is infront of them.

Healbot - Defined as a cleric who watches his/her parties health with little to no regard for the actual combat itself

Caster Cleric - Participates in combat with crowd control spells or DPS spells such as Blade Barrier, inflict spells, Flamestrike or various other spells.

Mixed Cleric - While not specialized in any field these types tend to drift into whatever role is required. Should the healing requirement be intese, they hold back on other activities until the option to melee or cast offensive spells presents itself.


The categories of measurement
1st = 4 points
2nd = 3 points
3rd = 2 points
4th = 1 point

DPS (Damage per second)
1. Caster
2. Battlecleric
3. Mixed
4. Healbot

Survivability (chance of being last member of party standing)

1. Mixed
2. Healbot
3. Battlecleric
4. Caster

Party Friendly (most likely to be accepted by groups)
1. Healbot
2. Mixed
3. Caster
4. Battlecleric

Least Gear intensive
1. Healbot
2. Caster
3. Mixed
4. Battlecleric

Versatility
1. Mixed
2. Caster
3. Battlecleric
4. Healbot


Soloability (yes i know its not a real word)
1. Caster
2. Mixed
3. Battlecleric
4. Healbot

Results
WINNER - Mixed cleric(18 points)
2nd - Caster Cleric(17 points)
3rd - Healbot(14 points)
4th - Battleclerics(11 points)

[thatguy]

I would be a mixed cleric, I cast offensive spells and offensive comments (thats another story) but also watch the health bars and conserve my mana for buffs and heals. I cast offensive spells in a pinch to get the party out of a jam. I can be party friendly but that all depends on how many Delscorcho type of toons are in the party. I usually am the last one stadning but not for long because I am squishy.

[Impaqt]

The categories of measurement
1st = 4 points
2nd = 3 points
3rd = 2 points
4th = 1 point

Survivability (chance of being last member of party standing)

1. Battlecleric
2. Healbot
3. Mixed
4. Caster

Party Friendly (most likely to be accepted by groups)
1. Healbot
1. Mixed
1. Caster
1. Battlecleric

(If your a GOOD cleriuc, you wont have trouble getting into any group, any time. It Doesnt matter what your focus is.)

Results
1st - Caster Cleric(19 points)
- 2nd Mixed cleric(17 points)
3rd - Battleclerics(16 points)
4rd - Healbot(14 points)

I agree with most catagories, but dissagree in others....

Too many people get Bad CLerics mixed up with Battle Clerics. Bottom line is you will NEVER have trouble getting into a Group if your a GOOD cleric. No matter what your focus is. a Good cleric will know when he needs to throw a heal regardless of whether or not he has an axe inhis hands. or better yet, knows when to take control of a bad situation. Most party wipes that are blamed onthe "Battle Cleric" are just plain poor parties.

Healbots are Boring to play and do nothing to increase the fun factor of the quest your in. Staring at red bars instead of the action is blah. and a cleric who would rather throw 10 Heals rather than wipe out a threat with a single blade barrier isnt playing very smart.

[samho]

aside with Impaqt's comment, I would like to add a one more option into the measure list :-)

Enjoyment (How much fun you can get by playing such a build)

1. Battlecleric
2. Mixed
3. Caster
4. Healbot (can we got a negtive score here?)



Also for the DPS, since everyone can grab blade barrier, and there's time when can only relay on melee damage...

1. Battlecleric
2. Mixed
3. Caster
4. Healbot



As well as Soloability, since melee/mix type rule at low level, caster/melee rule at some higher level, I would change the priority as

1. Mixed
2. Battlecleric
3. Caster
4. Healbot





And you also forget to put trapsmith type into consideration (they are neither healbot nor mix)

[Impaqt]

As far as DPS GOes, the Caster Architype is more likely to have both Maximize and Empower Spell.

Thats how My Clerics Roll... They all Have Maximize, but my Offensive caster has Empower Spell as well.... 500+ Point per tick Critical blade Barriers are by far the single highest DPS inteh game when you know how to kite properly.

[Darkwolf]

Samho, your bias is showing.

aside with Impaqt's comment, I would like to add a one more option into the measure list :-)

Enjoyment (How much fun I can get by playing such a build)

1. Battlecleric
2. Mixed
3. Caster
4. Healbot (can we got a negtive score here?)

[sirgog]

Until Mod 6 I really liked the offensive caster style cleric, but the fact is now that clerics can't easily spare the feats for Spell Penetration to properly use their most potent spells for dealing with tough mobs (Destruction, Banishment, Greater Command, Symbol of Persuasion, Symbol of Stunning all suffer from this). Really the only spell they have that is great is Bladebarrier, which tends to be an aggro magnet that often only a battlecleric has the HP (and Quicken feat) to survive casting much.

In the Shroud, I'll take a battlecleric I know to be at least competent over a fighter/paladin/barbarian anyday (even when the group has 3 clerics already), and I'll also often take them over a third cleric that I know is a healbot or offensive caster.


I'd suggest changing your definition of 'mixed' as well - my cleric Numot is a battlecleric that can swap the +6 Str gloves for Gauntlets of Eternity and act as a healbot when needed (e.g. as sole cleric in the Reaver raid), but is downright mediocre at offensive casting in endgame elite quests. Most offensive caster clerics can double as healbots too but seldom can melee. Usually I describe clerics as follows - melee, offensive casting, healbot - choose two.

[Impaqt]

I solo all my clerics in the Orchard and vale with nothing but Blade barrier. 250ish HP's on my rogue, 300 on my caster, 375 on my "Battle" CLeric.

There is absolutely no diference in how surviveable they are.
I tend to wear Fearsome Armor on my 2 squishys and my Blue late on my Battle. The fearsome helps when I get tripped on occatian.

When i solo Devils, I tend to grab my Caster first because his Blade barrier hurt a lot more.

My Batle is rarely off Timer fromthe shroud for more than an hour or 2

and my Rogue is the ultimate utility cleric... Love her in Rainbow.....

[sativathered]

I agree with most catagories, but dissagree in others....

Too many people get Bad CLerics mixed up with Battle Clerics. Bottom line is you will NEVER have trouble getting into a Group if your a GOOD cleric. No matter what your focus is. a Good cleric will know when he needs to throw a heal regardless of whether or not he has an axe inhis hands. or better yet, knows when to take control of a bad situation. Most party wipes that are blamed onthe "Battle Cleric" are just plain poor parties.

Healbots are Boring to play and do nothing to increase the fun factor of the quest your in. Staring at red bars instead of the action is blah. and a cleric who would rather throw 10 Heals rather than wipe out a threat with a single blade barrier isnt playing very smart.

i play a "healbot" but that doesn't mean that i don't play "very smart". all of the groups that i join are glad when i heal them....that is what my toon is for to heal. and yes there are battle clerics out there and i have been in the groups where there was one, and thank god that i was in there, else everyone would have died due to the fact the other cleric wasn't healing anyone. you can play your toons the way you want to, i don't judge you....don't judge me!

[Impaqt]

i play a "healbot" but that doesn't mean that i don't play "very smart". all of the groups that i join are glad when i heal them....that is what my toon is for to heal. and yes there are battle clerics out there and i have been in the groups where there was one, and thank god that i was in there, else everyone would have died due to the fact the other cleric wasn't healing anyone. you can play your toons the way you want to, i don't judge you....don't judge me!

THe "Battle" Cleric in your party was not a GOod player. Or he realized you were fixing all his Boo Boos and didnt ned to worry about anyones health bars.

[samho]

Samho, your bias is showing.

Of course Bias

Since I have 6 cleric which can separate into every type he list, and the only archtype I dont have was the Trapsmith type, how can't I be bias

[samho]

THe "Battle" Cleric in your party was not a GOod player. Or he realized you were fixing all his Boo Boos and didnt ned to worry about anyones health bars.

Sometime, people see ONE cleric icon show up on the party window, their intelligence score suddenly reduce by 5 -- and the horrible thing was, you know, this effect can be stack !


*Two cleric icon show up at party window? I'm feeblemind !* (Since most people start their DnD carrier with, um, INT 10 or lower, isn't it? )

[moorewr]

I'm really enjoying my trapsmith cleric.. not to mention a cleric with backstab (and weapon proficiencies) is a lot better off for DPS at low levels.. plus sneak helps when soloing, though I don't have the skill points to keep it high enough...

Light armor was a challenge, but I'm using Silken Mail (axeblock, Move Silently +10) and Mummy Wrappings for my mid-level fearsome needs.

I hated being a pure healbot with Alfred, and now he has a lot more HP and max+emp, so he counts as mixed.

...though we all end up as healbots in certain groups... or at the end of the shroud....

[sigtrent]

I think that was mostly on target...

DPS probably goest to the battle cleric who can blade barrier pretty well and fight well too, then caster, then mixed.
Solo probably goest to the battle cleric as well. They solo very well. A really focused caster cleric is probably a bit squishy (I know mine is).


How to know them! that may be the missing element since many of them are pretty similar... here is my stab at defining traits

Battle Cleric: Sacrificed wisdom for strength and/or spent most of their feats on martial combat, likely multi classed at least one level.
Caster: Maxed wisdom, spent most feats on metamatic/spell pen
Healbot: Cranked up the charisma and carries empower healing, very little if any Str
Mixed: Doesn't fit one of the above

[Wan6Tan6]

Bah, why fight if I don't have to? My healbot/buffer suits me nicely, thank you. People want only one thing from a cleric: healing.

What they need to do is bump up the Paladin class so it isn't so gimped.

[Darkwolf]

Of course Bias

Since I have 6 cleric which can separate into every type he list, and the only archtype I dont have was the Trapsmith type, how can't I be bias

My point was, 'Enjoyment' is based on personal preferance. Believe it or not, there are Healbot clerics out there that LOVE to play that way. The fact that you don't like it means squat to anyone but yourself.

[samho]

My point was, 'Enjoyment' is based on personal preferance. Believe it or not, there are Healbot clerics out there that LOVE to play that way. The fact that you don't like it means squat to anyone but yourself.

Not saying you are wrong nor saying you can't enjoy playing a healbot, but ... maybe because they don't have other cleric variants of their own to compare the difference?

I would be more than interesting if anyone start a survey for something like: If you have multiple cleric, which type of cleric you would like to play or how you compare about them ? Otherwise, ALL discussions here were bias. And at the very least, I will admit openly that my comment comes from my personal preference / experience.

[Malhavic_clovenhelm]

I really love my cleric. I guess he would fall under "caster" but the only offensive spell I cast is blade barrier. 500+ damage on crits = dead mobs quick. He can solo alot of quests with his massive hp, and has plenty of spell points to be laying down max/emp/quick/extended blade barriers.

But then again, when i'm in a party for the shroud ect. I only heal.

Point im trying to make is that the "type of cleric" you are really depends on the quest and who your playing with.

[Darkwolf]

Not saying you are wrong nor saying you can't enjoy playing a healbot, but ... maybe because they don't have other cleric variants of their own to compare the difference?

I would be more than interesting if anyone start a survey for something like: If you have multiple cleric, which type of cleric you would like to play or how you compare about them ? Otherwise, ALL discussions here were bias. And at the very least, I will admit openly that my comment comes from my personal preference / experience.

Or, maybe... they are playing the type of cleric they like to play.

[Impaqt]

I cant argue the fact that some people find beng bored quite entertaining.

Yes, Some people can absolutly enjoy sitting back and waiting for someone to take damage so they can cast a heal and contribute that way to a party.

You can even excell at that type of play. playing that game becomes pretty monotonous to me..... Its almost like a game of keeping red bars full more than DDO.

Clerics can do so much more.... and the phrase "An ounce of prevention is better than a pound of cure" is pretty accurate.....