Quote Originally Posted by gpk View Post
Admirable if that's the case but I doubt most operate this way since mod5, but this is an old discussion and perhaps it's best to not discuss it further here.



I'm rather confused, if there isn't a better chance of getting more raid loot with a full group then why is it "greedy" to wait to fill the group ?

You're saying a 12 player raid doesn't mean more chances at loot? So now they're not greedy for waiting to fill it?
I am not saying 12 player raid doesn't mean more chances at loot. Most people see things very simplistic. The way most think "The more I see x drop then the better chance I have at looting x" So in their mind the more people in raid = more times it drops = more times I see it drop = better chance for me to loot and if this is the line of reasoning behind waiting to fill a group it is greedy. You are waiting because you feel it will benieft YOU. Now this line of thinking IS statistics, garbage statistics but statistics none the less. Why is it garbage statistics? Lets take a look at my grouping example earlier.

You are a mage looking for a torq from DQ. You run with 3 other people where no one but you wants the torq and your buddy runs with a full group where 4 others are looking for the torq as well. Who do you think statistically has a better chance at getting the torq? The general population will belive your buddy will because of the simple statistics I mentioned above. However lets look at real statistics. Lets say torq has a .5% chance to drop per person in group.

Group 1 - 4 people in group = 2% chance for the torq to drop no one else wants so you have a 2% chance to get the torq from that group.

Group 2 - 12 people in group = 6% chance for the torq to drop however 5 people want it giving your buddy 1.2% chance at looting it if it drops.

This is just one case where the current loot system favors the smaller group. Now we can take A_D's example of a cleric looking for the shield from SR with same drop rate.

Group 1 - 4 people in group = 2% chance with you only one wanting makeing it a 2% chance you get it.
Group 2 - 6 people in group = 3% chance with you only one wanting makeing it a 3% chance you get it.
Group 3 - 12 people in group = 6% chance with you only one wanting makeing it a 6% chance you get it.
Group 4 - 12 people in group = 6% chance with 2 people wanting it makeing it a 3% chance you get it.

Makeing no difference between group 2 and 4 other than the percieved difference.

These are not actual drop rates but that does not matter because the math is the same no matter what.

Now words by themselves are just groups of letters it is how we use them and give them meaning. Greed is basically doing something for no other reason than that it beniefts you. Fair discription of it? If so then you agree with me that to wait to fill up a raid because "you think" it will provid you with a better chance to get loot IS greedy. Not saying it is good or bad just stateing it for the fact that it is. Now if you wait to fill up raid because "you think" it gives everyone a better chance at loot includeing the people joining you could see it as being generous. Its the motives behind your actions that define them as greed or generous just like its the meaning given to the words that define the groups of letters.

Milolyen

PS as far as guild rules on a guild run raid ... loot has always been done that way, even if it isn't the norm.