An argument for acid/electric spec

[LeLoric]

So you all may be thinking what is this idot talking about but with the current high end content I just want to point out the benefits of acid/elec.

Pros:

-acid dot; with many mobs now immune or high resist to fire acid in mod 6 content is generally a better dot spell. Start out a big boss fight with a melfs and you will do more dmg per spell point than almost any other spell in the game, if it crits even better. and thats the weaker of the two spells acid fog is a great spell currently with the slow mobs effect plus increased miss chance that will stack with displacement and a pretty decent dot I always cast this on the pit fiend helping mitigat dmg and without crits about 20-30 dmg a tick not much but when crit i hit up to 100 per tick some decent dmg much better than sitting there flinging ice storm wands, which coincedentally you can still do while getting acid dmg.

-chain/ball lightning; once again with most mobs immune or highly resistant to fire these are now your best aoe dps spells. Chain lightning has a higher possible dmg than dfb due to no sup 7 items in game yet and it goes up to 20d6. Ball lightning is easier to land and does more dmg on most mod 6 mobs than cone of cold especially all the mobs that matter.

Cons:

-lower firewall dmg; not really a con as its still pretty potent when called for I still use em fairly frequently especially in the middle of an acid fog. With my current setup unless the firewall crits ill generally do more dmg with this combo than my fire/cold specced sorc does.

-lack of non save dmg spells; this is probably the biggest issue but with a high enough dc it doesnt seem to matter too much scorching ray is nearly useless anymore due to resists applying to all three rays, wall of fire i can still use fairly effectively, I do use polar ray on fire eles and this is probably the biggest difference but not a gamebreaker.

So just some thoughts on the benefits of acid/elec anyone else switched over yet?

[sirgog]

My Sorc is fully fire/cold specced and has 7APs spent on acid/elec (+10, 20 and 30% damage, and the first crit chance enhancement, which was my very last AP to spend at cap).

I'm quite a fan of Acid Arrow and Acid Fog now, for the reasons you stated. The biggest problem is that a mob in four Firewalls takes 4x the damage - this doesn't apply to acid DoT effects. This makes me sad.

Ball Lightning hasn't impressed me, honestly, due to the awkward area it covers. Cone of Cold is far superior as it hits many more foes when cast on a pack.

[LeLoric]

My Sorc is fully fire/cold specced and has 7APs spent on acid/elec (+10, 20 and 30% damage, and the first crit chance enhancement, which was my very last AP to spend at cap).

I'm quite a fan of Acid Arrow and Acid Fog now, for the reasons you stated. The biggest problem is that a mob in four Firewalls takes 4x the damage - this doesn't apply to acid DoT effects. This makes me sad.

Ball Lightning hasn't impressed me, honestly, due to the awkward area it covers. Cone of Cold is far superior as it hits many more foes when cast on a pack.

I generally find the opposite with coc, and yeah the not being able to stack multiple sucks guess thats another con hehe

[Vhlad]

Many of the enemies in mod 6 have acid resistance.

Run the shroud on elite with acid arrow and tell us if you see any numbers on the pit fiend at all.

I ran with a full acid build a bit during mod 5 when they made some ghosts immune to fire. I quickly found that cone of cold was better. Cycling between cone of cold + otilukes + polar ray is massive DPS that can't be matched by a acid/lightning build. Firewall + scorching ray cycling is another strong combo. And disintegrate or magic missle for anything immune to fire + cold.

It would be nice if acid/lightning was more appealing, but it doesnt beat cold/fire right now IMO.

[LeLoric]

Many of the enemies in mod 6 have acid resistance.

Run the shroud with acid arrow and tell us if you see any numbers on the pit fiend at all.

I do see acid dmg on the pit fiend in fact acid fog when crits does up to 100 per tick as i said in the op

definately more dmg than any firewall will see :P

[Vhlad]

I do see acid dmg on the pit fiend in fact acid fog when crits does up to 100 per tick as i said in the op

definately more dmg than any firewall will see :P

gah. I edited my post to be more clear.

[FluffyCalico]

Many of the enemies in mod 6 have acid resistance.

Run the shroud on elite with acid arrow and tell us if you see any numbers on the pit fiend at all.

I ran with a full acid build a bit during mod 5 when they made some ghosts immune to fire. I quickly found that cone of cold was better. Cycling between cone of cold + otilukes + polar ray is massive DPS that can't be matched by a acid/lightning build. Firewall + scorching ray cycling is another strong combo. And disintegrate or magic missle for anything immune to fire + cold.

It would be nice if acid/lightning was more appealing, but it doesnt beat cold/fire right now IMO.

As long as you have anything that will hit him you can kill him. There are mana pools and well it might take 10 hrs but yes one person can kill him.

[Vhlad]

As long as you have anything that will hit him you can kill him. There are mana pools and well it might take 10 hrs but yes one person can kill him.

Of course. But we're talking about acid damage, and I was referring to whether or not you would see any red numbers at all using acid arrow on the pit fiend on elite. The OP is arguing the benefit of acid DOT, but DOT takes a big hit from elemental resistance.

[LeLoric]

the trio of lightning bolt/ball lightning and chainlighting equals your cold trio actually surpasses it against any devils including pitfiend because there is no lightning resist. Yeah you do lose some effectiveness with acid fog on pit fiend due to resists but it will still do more dmg per sp than any other spell against him plus it helps negate some dmg from pit fiend on melees due to the miss chance.

[FluffyCalico]

the trio of lightning bolt/ball lightning and chainlighting equals your cold trio actually surpasses it against any devils including pitfiend because there is no lightning resist. Yeah you do lose some effectiveness with acid fog on pit fiend due to resists but it will still do more dmg per sp than any other spell against him plus it helps negate some dmg from pit fiend on melees due to the miss chance.

1) Ever hear of acid rain?
2) Force missle actually works best on pit fiend.
3) Most damage per spell point would be haste

[LeLoric]

1) Ever hear of acid rain?
2) Force missle actually works best on pit fiend.
3) Most damage per spell point would be haste

1) yes i have i use it too, acid fog is still better as more ticks
2) not better than lightning spells when fully specced for it crit ball lightnings over 900 chain lightnings over 1000
3) talking direct dmg here

[FluffyCalico]

1) yes i have i use it too, acid fog is still better as more ticks
2) not better than lightning spells when fully specced for it crit ball lightnings over 900 chain lightnings over 1000
3) talking direct dmg here

Simpily put the lighting line is great, the fire line is good, the cold line is good, and force line is good. Acid line is by far the weakest of all.

[LeLoric]

Essentially heres how my pit fiend fights go.

Haste/cc for beginning fight

Acid Fog in middle

debuff with ray of enfeeb and exhaust

acid fog again if first not crit

bring sp pool down to about 70% with lightning spells

mm (7th wand the rest of round)

rehaste

Refog

kill gnolls

if 2 rd kill dump mana with lightning spells if not go to about 30% then wand

repeat for 3rd round if more than 3 rounds group sucks lol

remove the haste step if bard in group.

Total dmg done around 7-10 k depending on crits (this is an estimate if two acid fog crits gonna be more than that )

[FluffyCalico]

Pros:

but when crit i hit up to 100 per tick some decent dmg much better than sitting there flinging ice storm wands, which coincedentally you can still do while getting acid dmg.



?

Random mob
Wow you have a 2d6 critting for 100 damage that's pretty good. Just think if you were using a damage spell what you would crit for.

2d6 is 7 damage on avg x2 max x1.5 emp x 1.5 super potence x1.4 enhancements so 44 on non crits

32d6 real spell 112 damage on avg x2 max x1.5 emp x 1.5 super potence x1.4 enhancements so 705 on non crits.

Sorry 44 down right sucks for damage. Its a CC spell for a reason.

Blah I can't remember if the Xs all multiply each other or just the base
But either way its 16x the damage as your tick so you would need 16 ticks just to break even. Assuming all the ticks hit.

[Vhlad]

the trio of lightning bolt/ball lightning and chainlighting equals your cold trio actually surpasses it against any devils including pitfiend because there is no lightning resist. Yeah you do lose some effectiveness with acid fog on pit fiend due to resists but it will still do more dmg per sp than any other spell against him plus it helps negate some dmg from pit fiend on melees due to the miss chance.

lightning bolt: 10d6 (reflex for half)
ball lightning: 15d6 (reflex for half)
chain lightning (max 20d6): 16d6 (reflex for half)

cone of cold: 15d6 (reflex for half)
otilukes: 15d6 (reflex for half)
polar ray (max 25d6): 16d6 (no save)

Shroud also has that sup pot 9 staff. So on elite, or even hard, where he's making all his saves, polar ray is nice.

And really, 1 encounter is not enough for me to justify changing my sorc. The cold/fire combo is much better for velah and queen, and for the majority of quests. And I really don't think acid fog or arrow is going to be doing much damage/sp to the fiend at all.

[LeLoric]

Simpily put the lighting line is great, the fire line is good, the cold line is good, and force line is good. Acid line is by far the weakest of all.

Ill do more dmg by far with an acid crit fog on pit fiend than any other spell once again, a regular fog is still one of the best spells against him

[LeLoric]

lightning bolt: 10d6 (reflex for half)
ball lightning: 15d6 (reflex for half)
chain lightning (max 20d6): 16d6 (reflex for half)

cone of cold: 15d6 (reflex for half)
otilukes: 15d6 (reflex for half)
polar ray (max 25d6): 16d6 (no save)

Shroud also has that sup pot 9 staff. So on elite, or even hard, where he's making all his saves, polar ray is nice.

And really, 1 encounter is not enough for me to justify changing my sorc. The cold/fire combo is much better for velah and queen, and for the majority of quests. And I really don't think acid fog or arrow is going to be doing much damage/sp to the fiend at all.

factor in resists and lightning easily outdoes the dmg even with the staff without the staff lightning does as much due to no potency for ray resist not even counted

as far as velah and queen sure fire/cold is better but my wiz can do plenty against either of those without any spec in fire/cold. not like those are tough fights for a lev 16 like i said in the op i based this entirely on mod 6 content

[Vhlad]

Acid rain:
3d4 acid damage every 2 seconds for the duration of the storm. The duration starts at 6 seconds and increases by 2 seconds at level 9 and every 3 caster levels thereafter.

Acid fog:
2d6 acid damage every 2 seconds to targets within the cloud.

Acid arrow:
Deals 2d4 acid damage to a target with a magical arrow of acid. The arrow does an additional 2d4 damage every 2 seconds for a 12 second duration. This duration increases by 6 seconds for every three caster levels after level 3.

The base damage is so low, your DPM (damage per mana) is going to be greatly reduced by anything with acid resistance. Do you even see numbers on normal if you don't get a crit? What about hard/elite?

[FluffyCalico]

Acid rain:
3d4 acid damage every 2 seconds for the duration of the storm. The duration starts at 6 seconds and increases by 2 seconds at level 9 and every 3 caster levels thereafter.

Acid fog:
2d6 acid damage every 2 seconds to targets within the cloud.

Acid arrow:
Deals 2d4 acid damage to a target with a magical arrow of acid. The arrow does an additional 2d4 damage every 2 seconds for a 12 second duration. This duration increases by 6 seconds for every three caster levels after level 3.

The base damage is so low, your DPM (damage per mana) is going to be greatly reduced by anything with acid resistance. Do you even see numbers on normal if you don't get a crit? What about hard/elite?

QFT
We should just stop. He won't listen. Let him keep using CC for damage. Plus everyone knows all mobs stand in the cloud forever

[LeLoric]

Random mob
Wow you have a 2d6 critting for 100 damage that's pretty good. Just think if you were using a damage spell what you would crit for.

2d6 is 7 damage on avg x2 max x1.5 emp x 1.5 super potence x1.4 enhancements so 44 on non crits

32d6 real spell 112 damage on avg x2 max x1.5 emp x 1.5 super potence x1.4 enhancements so 705 on non crits.

Sorry 44 down right sucks for damage. Its a CC spell for a reason.

Blah I can't remember if the Xs all multiply each other or just the base
But either way its 16x the damage as your tick so you would need 16 ticks just to break even. Assuming all the ticks hit.

Im generally not saying to use this on the random mob its main use is for the pitfiend and pretty much all ticks hit for about 40 dmg non crit but due to the length of the fights I generally cast several and crit on a good share with full spec when crit this spell hitting for up to 100 dmg per tick is nasty about 20 ticks x100 = 2k dmg.

Any other spells you know that do that kind of dmg? Plus while its ticking off you can cast other spells.