Are heal scrolls just the beginning?

[BlueLightBandit]

My rule is to keep scrolls handy, but try not to use them. Heck, more often than not I'm getting tells from the pally or ranger "Hey, do you have any extra wands?"

It's always better to have and not need, than need and not have.

[Cuth]

I have to agree w/ ShadesofGreen ... a big part of the problem is that 99% of builds seem to be geared entirely toward offense.

Whether this is a function of the content (AC toons are less effective in most quests), player mentality (people want to rack up high kill count scores), or something else I am not certain but it's far more likely for me to end up in a quest w/ 2 2H barbs, a TWF Ranger, 2 offensive casters, and cleric then to be w/ a couple of S/S Pally (or fighters), CC Casters, etc.

Damage mitigation / avoidance is a secondary thought to almost every build or group.

[Talon_Moonshadow]

While I agree with everything you have said, I think your perception (and other's) of the situation is skewed.
Granted, I have yet to get to prt 5 of the shroud, and have also avoided playing a lot of high lvl content with my cleric for a long time.
However, IMO people do not need to use tremendous resources to complete a quest.
Good tactics will go a long way. CC will go a long way.

Those whose only tactic is swing, swing, swing, heal, heal, heal are the ones who can't complete a quest without huge resources IMO.

I refuse to believe that the only answer to a more powerful baddie is to throw a bigger barbarian and a more uber cleric at him.

I've heard there were a few all ranger shroud runs......I doubt they used a lot of resources (healing scrolls).....but I wasn't there, so maybe they did.

My favorite way to complete any dungeon is to try not to get hurt.

I know this may not be possible, but in my experiance so far, it is more possible than most people think......it just takes an adjustment to play style that most seem unwilling to try.

[aldan]

Nevermind.......

[EspyLacopa]

QFT. Give it a month or so, and it will be another routine run with little resources used.

The tactics used during questing has everything to do with this. Folks typically are too inflexible in their thinking to try new combinations of strategies until they are forced to do so. There has been talk at every Mod. about this, that or the other being underpowered, overpowered, ect, ect, ad nauseum. Don't sweat the small stuff & have fun.

Heh. I remember the Cries of Doom with the Wiz King in the Desert, as well as the 3 hour long VoN3 runs. . .

[Cyr]

The last part of the shroud is not that bad...by the way for those who have never been there CC does nothing after the mini bosses, but the pit fiend himself mitigates damage if you know how to run the fight.

First thing first make sure everyone has a valid ranged option vs. him since you can essentially run around and avoid him the whole time and shoot him. Second, rangers do more dps then any other class per point of healing/resources (besides silver arrows so if you can grab them over barbarians do it. 11 man ranger runs are cake btw see Kargon for details (not that you need many). Third, if you want to tank it up make sure you have good weapons vs. the fiend and high hp...if you don't have both don't even bother. Fourth, lot's of tanks = mass heals not heal spell. Fifth, 2 arcanes is plenty. Sixth, bring a bard if you can speeds things up alot (still miss this detail in too many runs I see). Lastly, the most resource intensive runs always involve either large numbers of tanks (almost no ranged) or support classes (bard,clerics, arcanes) that just can not keep themselves alive for some reason. The last lesson is the big one, bad group make up or toons with both low hp/saves and players behind the keyboard who just do not pay attention to their own situation while nuking/healing are the biggest drains. Get both of those together and well then your stuck with a group that does not even complete part 4.

Oh yeah one last thing, 100 heal scrolls cost next to nothing when you can sell one large ingredient for 2 million gold or more on the AH and other classes (at least they should bring their own consumable resources which cost plat also.

[spyderwolf]

i agree with cyr on this ..did a shroud with my buddy thrann a day ago he ran out of mana on his cleric about 10 seconds before we killed the fiend in part 4..the other cleric still had 70% of his mana left .having one cleric mas heal the tanks til he runs out and hten having the 2nd cleric take over from there is the best way to go because there isnt any over healing involved. and i have a capped cleric btw i never use scrolls in vale quests.

[FluffyCalico]

Heh. I remember the Cries of Doom with the Wiz King in the Desert, as well as the 3 hour long VoN3 runs. . .

When was VON3 3 hrs long? I remember farming it on Elite for the chests about 2 weeks after it came out.

[EspyLacopa]

When was VON3 3 hrs long? I remember farming it on Elite for the chests about 2 weeks after it came out.

When it was done by a group of lv8 characters who had no idea what was in store for them ^^

Even having one person who knew the way greatly sped up the quest.

And now of course, with groups of people who have run it so much, it's easily done in 20-30 minutes.

[Strakeln]

When it was done by a group of lv8 characters who had no idea what was in store for them ^^

Even having one person who knew the way greatly sped up the quest.

And now of course, with groups of people who have run it so much, the entire series is easily done in 20-30 minutes.

Fixed that for ya

[Nonan]

The number of heal scrolls you use also depends on how many tanks go in and hit the mob on part 4. If the group is balanced and has a couple of rangers, then if you have 3 clerics and 3 tanks on teh boss, each cleric can heal one tank and not really have to use scrolls. I find I use scrolls more when there are 2 clerics or one of them dies while doing part 4.

One thing i always reccomend when I am running the raid is that fighters heal themselves after teh boss goes up, it saves a lot of cleric mana. Also, clerics DV each other right away, rangers and bards can wand heal if needed. Rangers save their mana for Fire PRotections or even make sure teh fighters bring their own pots. As always, cleric donations are appreciated, especially if u do 4 and 5!!!

What it boils down to is that it is a team effort to beat parts 4 and 5.

[Turial]

What it boils down to is that it is a team effort

Sooo true.

[Oreg]

I like you have been playing since the game was playable and also have the perspective that only time will grant you.


Mod 6 then = OMG!!!! clerics in gianthold need to buy hundreds of heal scrolls to keep up with the damage these mobs are doing

Mod 6 now = LFM Crucible .. elite run .... cleric welcome but will take any........In Progress


Yes! Scrolls are just the beggining.

Yep, Always the case. A bit more extreme this time around but already many many many clerics are doing it sans heal scrolls (or if so just a few).

[EspyLacopa]

Fixed that for ya

You referring to lv8 characters working their way up the levels, or lv16 characters rushing through to get ready for a Dragon Raid?

[Strakeln]

You referring to lv8 characters working their way up the levels, or lv16 characters rushing through to get ready for a Dragon Raid?

L16, of course... vons are still a fun challenge at level 8. I forgot what it was like to be scared of a beholder until I ran a lowbie through von 3 a few months ago

[paintedman]

To me at least how things can get derailed so easily, perhaps I should be more clear(clearer? bah grammar!). The concern is that apart from tight nit groups that actually care about one another, that clerics that pug (yes, that is also playing DDO) are having thier abilities outstriped by one of the following, super tuff mobs ability to inflict lots of damage, players wearing tinfoil for armour, or healing abilites not scaling with the content. I also fear high damage/high hit point build cycle meshed with Devs having to create monsters that can tackle these builds that causes more specific builds until we reach a point that if you do not have 300 or more HP that your toon, regardless of class is gimped.

Perhaps I'm being dismal, but it just seems that way, and maybe that is exactly what it is, but please don't brush aside this beacause you have not dealt with this youself, yes some people make funny builds, but does that mean that they cannot have a good time with you and your "great" build? Or complete difficult quest with out pulling out thier hair. More so, if that is how some people feel now, just think when the next cycle comes through, will that be the point where things fall apart community wise, from those that can and those that want to.

-paint

[Gunga]

Correction many players don't care about 100 scrolls as they are not the cleric buying them nor are they funding it.
Most players have decided why should we use resorces and try hard when the only person that must is the cleric.

Easy solution to the LF clerics for shroud that always up. Entry into raid is 10 heal scrolls. If everyone had to bring that many so what if the group used 100 scrolls thats just 10 each. The issue is if you use 100 as a group and 2 players bought them all and the other 8 sat there barely trying and not using their own resources because they knew the clerics would.

Nonsense. Everyone should bring what they need to the table. Clerics bring scrolls, fighters/casters bring pots. Easy.