Paladin Divine Sacrifice I

[Slayer918]

Paladin Divine Sacrifice I
Prereq: Paladin level 4, Paladin Extra Smiting I, 11 Action Points spent
Cost: 1 Action Point
Benefit: Giving up some of your life force to win the battle, you empower your next blow against your foe. This attack deals an additional 5d6 Good damage to evil opponents and increases the critical multiplier of your weapon by 1, but costs you 10 hp and 1 sp, whether or not the attack is successful.". (6 second cooldown.)

So I give up 10 hp and 1 sp to gain, on average, 17.5 points of damage and a *chance* to get 20-35ish on a crit? (when mobs already have 10x our hp)

If this is what they meant by "paly love"...

I hope theres more... discuss

[elraido]

It would be interesting to know if the damage would stack with the crafted items that include good burst and blast (like I am going to do). Also would be nice if on a crit, the damage would be modified by the crit modifier, then we would be talking.

[artvan_delet]

This a lower level paladin enhancement. Level 4 requirement and 11ap spent. This is not a high level enhancement, and at the medium levels it's not too bad.

Wondering if this spell is much better than vicious?

Almost no help for paladin levels past 11, again ignoring the request for enhancements for pure paladins. Looking forward to sacrifice 2 or 3.

[Zenako]

The better question is how it stacks (if at all) with smites? I would hope, since it uses one of your smites, that it also includes the normal Smite boosts as well. The low AP cost and level does make it a real nice boon on the low to mid level paladins. However as mentioned elsewhere, it looks like it will still have the same issues with actually landing it that smite has and that is a big PITA at the current time.

[Talon_Moonshadow]

For the sake of argument.....lets assume it works like other crit enhancing enhancements currently in the game.

Not that I have a high lvl Pallie, and I'm also too lazy to fully figure it out myself......just a suggestion, since I know there are a couple precedents in te game already that you guys to go off of.

[Mad_Bombardier]

Since you can instantly self heal with Lay on Hands, why not? LoH = 200 HP for a well built paly. That's 20 Divine Sacrifices (if you're soloing and no one else is healing you) before you need a LoH. Make it #1 in the hotbar and spam away!

[Laith]

i'm more interested in how Divine Sacrifice II would be worked out, afterall: right now we're discussing a 1ap lvl4 ability and squabbling about how suck-tarded it is (and even comparing it to a lvl11 barbarian enhancement).

will II have:
more, less, or same HP/SP cost?
more good damage?
more crit modifier?

we don't even know if:
TWF will apply the effect to both weapons.
The good damage is multiplied on crit.

[Redcoil]

1. I dont see it being stackable with Smite. While it would be nice to stack the two, that would allow smites of what, 6, 700? Odds are it'll be a clicky attack same as Smite currently is... if nothing else, its probably just a lot easier to code that way.

2. An extra +1 multiplier is a GREAT way for us to help at key DPS moments, boss fights etc. While its not 'steady' per se, it can get us a lot in a reasonable amount of time. Dont underestimate it, were looking at crafting weapons where a pally can be hanging out at 1d10 + 26 with 6 seeker, and if that +1multiplier adds to burst damage you can be sitting at... oh, 1d10+26(+6) +2d6 + 3d10 on a crit sacrifice; good rolls a crit of 210, or more depending on your weapon; I'm just using mine for an example.
Higher levels of this enhancement have potential to make us GREAT DPS on bosses, while keeping barbs and fighters well acclimated to their steady damage.

3. We still dont know what levels and potential 2 and 3 tier enhancements can bring. Maybe +2crit at lv 3 or 4 along with larger HP/SP drain? Or as we pump more AP's into it, maybe it can get a little bit stronger while reducing requirements...who knows?

Why bash it til we get time to play with it?

[QuantumFX]

Eladrin was mention that other abilities will synergize off of it so stay tuned! Now that Bulwark and Resistance are being AP cost reduced we'll need stuff to spend APs on!

[Aesop]

That is actually a pretty nice enhancement. Think of Deathnip with Imp Crit and this Enhancment which leads to 17-20 x5 Crit on a strength heavy Pally we're looking at a major damage spike. Or maybe look a Sword of Shadows Power Attacking Paladin ... could be very nasty. The cost is negligable on a Paladin.

Aesop

[gpk]

Sorry I have to agree the OP, this seems to be a pretty crapy enhancement.

It's based of a level 1 Spell Compendium spell that may have uses in pnp.
The difference here is instead of being a spell it consumes 1 SP per use and only adds an x1 to the multiplier compared to its pnp counterpart.
Consider the a DDO mob's HP is vastly greater than that of it's pnp brethren this makes very little sense, the damage boost off a potential crit seems to be insignificant.
So for a level 16 pally you not only expend 1.6x more SP using this but all you get is a +1 crit multiplier vs the inflated DDO mob HP.

Some players seem to be so obsessed with a large smite crit and now this that they often pass up overall greater consistant damage for a very few big numbers.

This strange dev obession with Smite Evils and now Divine Scarifice is worrying me, I hope there is much more that they haven't told us yet. Ppl have been begging for better Spell Compendium spells, this certainly aint one of em.

Do ppl really like vicious? At least vicious doesn't remove your HP when you swing at the air, I wonder if this will...

[Blazer]

Hmm, increases the critical multiplier by 1? So SOS would be 15-20/x4? Very interesting. I think my pally hybrid will pick this up.

[SteeleTrueheart]

At 1AP and Level 4 requirement I suspect that there will be higher tiers of this enhancement.
Hopefully level 8, level 12 and level 16, maybe even a level 20 tier.

So I would like to see
DSII - level 8 - reduced costs (8hp)
DSIII - level 12 - +2d6 damage +1 crit multiplier (or crit range)
DSIV - level 16 - reduced costs (5hp)
DSV - level 20 - +2d6 damage +1 crit multiplier (or crit range)

[Aesop]

Sorry I have to agree the OP, this seems to be a pretty crapy enhancement.

It's based of a level 1 Spell Compendium spell that may have uses in pnp.
The difference here is instead of being a spell it consumes 1 SP per use and only adds an x1 to the multiplier compared to its pnp counterpart.
Consider the a DDO mob's HP is vastly greater than that of it's pnp brethren this makes very little sense, the damage boost off a potential crit seems to be insignificant.
So for a level 16 pally you not only expend 1.6x more SP using this but all you get is a +1 crit multiplier vs the inflated DDO mob HP.

Some players seem to be so obsessed with a large smite crit and now this that they often pass up overall greater consistant damage for a very few big numbers.

This strange dev obession with Smite Evils and now Divine Scarifice is worrying me, I hope there is much more that they haven't told us yet. Ppl have been begging for better Spell Compendium spells, this certainly aint one of em.

Do ppl really like vicious? At least vicious doesn't remove your HP when you swing at the air, I wonder if this will...

BY what do you mean you expend 1.6x SP...I'm missing something... it is early after all... YAWn

[TechNoFear]

NEW Paladin Divine Sacrifice I
o Prereq: Paladin level 4, Paladin Extra Smiting I, 11 Action Points spent
o Cost: 1 Action Point
o Benefit: Giving up some of your life force to win the battle, you empower your next blow against your foe. This attack deals an additional 5d6 Good damage to evil opponents and increases the critical multiplier of your weapon by 1, but costs you 10 hp and 1 sp, whether or not the attack is successful.". (6 second cooldown.)

Some maths.....

5D6 Good damage to Evil

~95% damage will be within 10-25 HP.

Will do more HP than you take ~96.5% of the time.
Will do 20 HP or more ~22% of the time.

Crit Multiplier

The extra critical multiplier equates to a single extra 'normal' hit each time it crits, but only happens a small percentage of the time (<30% at best?). [Damage is approximately even IF any extra damage not multiplied (ie elemental, maiming) is roughly equal to any extra damage that is multiplied (ie Seeker, Bane plus).]

Issues

If the mob moves, teleports, dies or you miss then you just hurt yourself for no gain, so a risk to use.
Not good to use if you are the last man standing or taking a lot of damage.
Is another button to find in combat (ie actually checking the timer, then clicking the UI, takes time and is a distraction).

Synergies

Virtue can give you the HP needed to cast, two uses of DS per Virtue (at 10th?).
Angel Skin / DR may negate some of the HP damage.





Now the opinion.....

If it costs you one attack to click the button to activate a Divine Sacrifice (or heal) then you have probably lost any net benefit.

It would require much more damage and extra crit multipliers (for the same cost) at higher levels to be of use IMO.

Could be fun for a paladin with heavy pick seeing what big numbers they can get (but then what is Smite Evil for?).



If Divine Sacrifice enhanced each Smite evil (+5D6 / +1 Crit mult for no HP/SP cost) for 1 AP would be nice (IMO).

But that is not what we asked for, is it?

Now we got what we asked for (not limited number / rest) we don't seem to like it.....

[Ralmeth]

Divine Sacrifice is an interesting concept, but I'm a little skeptical. I'm going to reserve judgement though until it comes out and I see how it works in practice. Wouldn't it be cool if they took away the nerf to Divine Favor?

[artvan_delet]

I'm in agreement with Technofear:

Now the opinion.....

YES: If it costs you one attack to click the button to activate a Divine Sacrifice (or heal) then you have probably lost any net benefit.

It would require much more damage and extra crit multipliers (for the same cost) at higher levels to be of use IMO.


If Divine Sacrifice enhanced each Smite evil (+5D6 / +1 Crit mult for no HP/SP cost) for 1 AP would be nice (IMO).

You are losing at least one attack to cast this spell, if not more. You are losing guaranteed damage. Then you need to make sure the mob is in front of you when you swing, which could cost you another attack. More I think about this spell, the more I don't like it.

[Mad_Bombardier]

I'm in agreement with Technofear:

Now the opinion.....

YES: If it costs you one attack to click the button to activate a Divine Sacrifice (or heal) then you have probably lost any net benefit.

It takes some timing, but you can attack 3 times, trip on the fourth, and start a new combo chain with very little interruption. This should be the same way (unless it's more like a Cleave in which case it will completely break the attack chain and be a detriment to DPS).

[Hyldr]

I agree with what most have said. I'm glad for the attention, but am skeptical of the pending results.. I do hope that this is merely a first of things to come. If there isn't, I see no reason (outside of roleplaying) to remain a pure paladin. Up to level 10 we do pretty well and can contribute greatly to a party.. After that we come up lacking. Divine Sacrifice sounds nice, but I don't think it is enough at this point in time, unless they give it a duration instead of being a one hit (or miss which is often the case). A duration of 60sec or even 30sec would give us time to at least hit something with it. It may be worth the hp loss then.. Just my opinion.

[elraido]

If it is a one time shot thing, the more I think about it the more I don't think it will work that well. Sure it will be somewhat usefull for like a lvl 5 guy but at that lvl he won't have the hp to really use it well. once he is high enough in hp, by that time the extra damage he is doing will not be worth it.

Come on devs. Leak us some more info on ideas you guys are thinking about churning out.

One thing I think that would be nice is turning Divine Favor into an AP ability. If you want to go past +3, then you need to spend 2 AP to get up to +4 and then another 2 to get up to +5.