Weekly Developer Activities: 3/24/08

[GhostNull]

While Divine Sacrifice could potentially be powerful, it still suffers from the same problems as the current Smite Evil has (as others have explained).

I think many who play Paladins would still like to see Divine Might and Divine Shield as feats or enhancements.

[ArkoHighStar]

You're not likely to see any new enhancements at the power level that Barbarian Improved Critical is currently at. There are some interesting synergies out there between certain item enchantments and other Paladin abilities with Divine Sacrifice. (Such as Bodyfeeder, noted earlier in the thread, or the Virtue spell.)

Edit: And Mystic Theurge beats me to the comment, again.

then barb improved crit should be diminished, if you are basically saying thatbecause of timing rogues, fighters and paladins will ever have really powerful enhancements, then this is completel unfair and unbalancing Basically nobody wants to roll a fighter, paladin or rogue, as they are just totally eclipsed by Barbarian improved crit 2. You have given an extremely powerful enhancement to one melee class basically telling players that only a barbarian is worth playing

[Kisaragi]

Yes. And that enhancement is overpowered. I'm glad they're not matching new enhancements to it and hope they reconsider the current effects of said barbarian enhancement.



And none of those characters will have the defensive capabilities of a paladin.

And the defensive capabilities of a paladin would be what? 20 hp that get burned through if a monster looks at you? The angelskin spell that doesn't seem to do much of anything even against evil creatures? The +3 AC against monsters who hit you not caring what your AC is? The lack of feats to buy additional health, abilities to dodge, weapon focusing, shield mastery, etc?

Oh I know! The ability of a paladin to run away screaming like a Kobold when surrounded by enemies yelling to the cleric "MEDIC!!!!" and screaming to yourself 'this is going to hurt....' hoping apon hope that your LoH can keep you alive long enough for the cleric to save your butt.

Now compare that rogue/ranger uncanny dodge, you know the skill that's let them solo raid bosses. Or the sorcerer's ability to use wands/scrolls to heal themselves so they can solo things like the Stormreaver. Barbarians have high con/strength to take a licking and keep ticking. Fighters get feats to make them versatile.

Pure Paladins have to spend stat points in Charisma and Wisdom in addition to Strength/Constitution, which means they will never be nearly as high.

[Yaga_Nub]

then barb improved crit should be diminished, if you are basically saying thatbecause of timing rogues, fighters and paladins will ever have really powerful enhancements, then this is completel unfair and unbalancing Basically nobody wants to roll a fighter, paladin or rogue, as they are just totally eclipsed by Barbarian improved crit 2. You have given an extremely powerful enhancement to one melee class basically telling players that only a barbarian is worth playing

I have to agree with Arko on this. Either make enhancements that are similar or ........ I REALLY hate saying this but you need to nerf the barbs. Sorry El but that's a fact that you can't get around.

[Mavnimo]

NEW Paladin Divine Sacrifice I
Prereq: Paladin level 4, Paladin Extra Smiting I, 11 Action Points spent
Cost: 1 Action Point
Benefit: Giving up some of your life force to win the battle, you empower your next blow against your foe. This attack deals an additional 5d6 Good damage to evil opponents and increases the critical multiplier of your weapon by 1, but costs you 10 hp and 1 sp, whether or not the attack is successful.". (6 second cooldown.)

will this attack bypass dr? for example using SoS on a devil

[Laith]

I have to agree with Arko on this. Either make enhancements that are similar or ........ I REALLY hate saying this but you need to nerf the barbs. Sorry El but that's a fact that you can't get around.

cheapening current enhancements, making current ones slightly better/easier to get, and creating new (cheap) ones seems to be them trying to avoid the nerf.

odds are, it'll be a LONG time before barbarians get any loving. in the mean time, everyone else has an opportunity to catch up.

personally, i prefer the slow & measured approach to balance... we all know what happens when things move too quickly.
while i may think some of the new enhancements are... interesting, i'm willing to see how they change the landscape.

[ArkoHighStar]

cheapening current enhancements, making current ones slightly better/easier to get, and creating new (cheap) ones seems to be them trying to avoid the nerf.

odds are, it'll be a LONG time before barbarians get any loving. in the mean time, everyone else has an opportunity to catch up.

personally, i prefer the slow & measured approach to balance... we all know what happens when things move too quickly.

I wouldn't call this catching up wrack of contruct 3 cost 18 AP for a cooldown effect

[Laith]

I wouldn't call this catching up wrack of contruct 3 cost 18 AP for a cooldown effect

the option is better than no option at all.

i admit that it doesn't look incredibly impressive, and i would have designed it differently.
i just don't like how quickly forum goers completely dismiss new abilities as useless.

i wonder, for instance, if this ability will apply damage twice to TWF, like tactics (trip,sunder,stunning blow) are. What about the pally attack?
Afterall, it seems like they are using the same mechanic.

[Yaga_Nub]

cheapening current enhancements, making current ones slightly better/easier to get, and creating new (cheap) ones seems to be them trying to avoid the nerf.

odds are, it'll be a LONG time before barbarians get any loving. in the mean time, everyone else has an opportunity to catch up.

personally, i prefer the slow & measured approach to balance... we all know what happens when things move too quickly.
while i may think some of the new enhancements are... interesting, i'm willing to see how they change the landscape.

I prefer the slow steady way as well but that seems to be something that the devs are just now learning. I hope that lesson sticks.

Be that as it may, they still need to address the difference in the melee types.

EDIT: I think they have for the Rangers in terms of the Tempest enhancement but I would still refer them to my thread on the Deepwood Sniper as an example of what they need to do for the ranged focused melees. I'll reserve judgement on paladins until I have time to play around with these new enhancemetns. Fighters still need something to call their own.

[ArkoHighStar]

I have to agree with Arko on this. Either make enhancements that are similar or ........ I REALLY hate saying this but you need to nerf the barbs. Sorry El but that's a fact that you can't get around.

To be honest Barb improved crit should something improving crit multiplier, not crit range, the only class that should be able to improve crit range should be a rogue as they are the masters of the calculated strike

[ArkoHighStar]

the option is better than no option at all.

i admit that it doesn't look incredibly impressive, and i would have designed it differently.
i just don't like how quickly forum goers completely dismiss new abilities as useless.

its not useless just very expensive for what it gives you, imagine of they do the same for undead, that would be 36 AP's for an attack that can still miss, and can be used only every 8 seocnds, whereas everything tied to barbarian rage last for the entire duration of the rage as perm effect, given the number of shrines in most quests a barbarian can basically stay raged the entire quest

[Strykersz]

To everyone circle...whatevering over divine sacrifice; what Paladins really needed was the ability to add vicious to their weapon once every 6 seconds? Really? Oh wait, that power has a worse ratio than vicious.

[Missing_Minds]

Is this going to be mappable to other keys?

if it is, maybe it will finally be a workaround to the bloody mouse over issue.

[MysticRhythms]

I wouldn't call this catching up wrack of contruct 3 cost 18 AP for a cooldown effect

How are you getting 18AP's? I count 12 and you are getting Disable Device III in the process.

[Hyldr]

[U][B]Weekly Development Activities


[*]NEW Paladin Divine Sacrifice I

• Prereq: Paladin level 4, Paladin Extra Smiting I, 11 Action Points spent
• Cost: 1 Action Point
• Benefit: Giving up some of your life force to win the battle, you empower your next blow against your foe. This attack deals an additional 5d6 Good damage to evil opponents and increases the critical multiplier of your weapon by 1, but costs you 10 hp and 1 sp, whether or not the attack is successful.". (6 second cooldown.)

This is cool, I carry enough potions/wands that the missing hp/sp won't be a problem. I just hope it lands the hit. Thanks for the pally attention though.

[Kisaragi]

It's not so much that everything is worthless. It's really the fact that we've gone the route of many mmos. There aren't representatives for the races/classes.There isn't one of the developers that lists playing a pure class from 1 to 16. So when these abilities come out, I wonder if they're really playing that class.

Paladin for example (which is why I'm frustrated). Play a pure paladin from 1 to 16. Do not send yourself equipment from other characters. Do not send yourself money from other characters. Then do this little test;

1.) If you lose interest in the character the class has problems.
2.) At level 10 (pure paladin) are you being outclassed? In damage? In AC/Survivability (oh and since you're playing a tank you should be on the front lines trying to draw aggro). In healing ability? In spell choices? In health/manna? In to hit?
3.) When you hit 14 see if you do not want to improve the class a lot.

And since the developers are expected to 'play the game' to figure out what's right and wrong, we should be seeing builds from them. Not names, not levels. But builds and comments at each level. Then I would be satisfied that someone, anyone from turbine cares what happens to the class. Why? Because they're now have one of those characters.

When Codog was making comments about his experience using Archery, archers got BAB when shooting. That worked. People who actually play the classes make genuine improvements that people in enjoy. If you just throw a class a bone because you think it sounds good without playing it through, I say boo.

If you can take a pure paladin level 16 into the new raid and this ability helps you either survive or compete with the other classes, then it's worth it. If you're not using it. If you're getting smacked down because of it. It goes back to the drawing board.

[Angelus_dead]

[*]NEW There are now 20 shortcut bars available, for those who carry too many clickies/weapons/spells to fit on 10. Those of you who had previously used the unsupported methods of accessing bars 11-20 will be happy to know that they now will remember where you put them on the screen.

It would be helpful if we can assign keystrokes to switch to the new shortcut bars, like we can for bars 1-10.

[ArkoHighStar]

How are you getting 18AP's? I count 12 and you are getting Disable Device III in the process.

you are right it is 12 someone mentioned 18 in an earlier post and it just stuck with me. Still 12 is not cheap for what you get, considering

bard music of of the maker cost 14 and is 10X more powerful
Barbarian improved crit 2 costs 6 and is effectively always on

[Turial]

Now compare that rogue/ranger uncanny dodge, you know the skill that's let them solo raid bosses.

Rangers dont get uncanny dodge as a class ability. Rogues and barbarians do however.

I do agree with the substance though that the new pally ability seems less fitting with pally abilities. Seems like the ability is working twards the evil type of paladin. A good type paladin ability would seem to be one where the pally gains life rather then sacrificing it.

[Angelus_dead]

[*]NEW Rogue Wrack Construct III[LIST][*] Prereq: Rogue level 11, Rogue Disable Device III, Rogue Wrack Construct II, 37 Action Points Spent[*] Cost: 3 Action Points[*] Benefit: You can activate this ability to use your understanding of mechanical objects and their vulnerabilities to strike at critical points in a construct's anatomy, dealing an extra 5d6 damage to constructs or living constructs.

I suggest that Wrack Construct III be changed so that Way of the Mechanic can be used to qualify in place of Disable Device III. That makes logical sense that it would improve your machine-understanding to a similar degree, and it will help keep Way of Mechanic useful (in comparison to the improvements coming to Way of Assasin).