new to sorc

[philo]

.Wanna help a new player? Dont post when you dont know what your talking about

QFT

[philo]

third, as to hitpoints, all those drow sors better reroll because if any of them has max chr & more than 225 hitpoints unbuffed, i will take you off my ignore list

I shouldnt be on ignore anymore right?

[Strakeln]

I said any pure sorc with less then 200 unbuffed should reroll

I have to disagree with this, but I will admit that if you want to play a character with less than 200HP, you had better know what you're doing... and you had better be good a twitch skills.

Honestly, it's pretty rare that anything even gets close enough to my sorc for me to be concerned. When you have a nearly unlimited mana pool and 180 different ways to neuter any given opponent, you have little excuse for taking damage

[Yajerman01]

... any pure sorc with less then 200 unbuffed should reroll...

Well my sorc is at a whopping 194 unbuffed and only in a not so cohesive PUG will i die. So the concept of re-rolling based upon a paltry 6 hp is inconceivable as my caster straight out rocks and death is rare. But I guess I could get a +6 con in place of +4 im using and nudge it a bit closer to the 200 mark to make him feel more 200hp acceptable. Aside the sarcasm, i do not think 200hp is a mark that signifies reroll.

Bad choice feats, bad choice of enhancements, bad choice in skill points, bad choice in use of abilities points is what defines a good built sorc from a bad built sorc and what potentially signals a need to reroll. Granted the first two, feats and enhancements can be adjusted, skills and ability points however are a done deal.

But no matter how good of a build you have, bad player skills is what seperates peoples interpretation/perception of a l33t vs. gimp.

[Yajerman01]

I have to disagree with this, but I will admit that if you want to play a character with less than 200HP, you had better know what you're doing... and you had better be good a twitch skills.

Honestly, it's pretty rare that anything even gets close enough to my sorc for me to be concerned. When you have a nearly unlimited mana pool and 180 different ways to neuter any given opponent, you have little excuse for taking damage

you just beat me to the punch, but your right Strakeln - twitch is important, "know thy enemy". I ran VONS preraid quests last night, me (my sorc), 3 wizzies and a tank. 2 of the wizzies were doing just fine but the third wizzy just kept dying. I couldnt understand it. I do not know if he didnt have enough hit point, or if he wasnt buffing or what, but a level 15 wizzy should be soloing all the vons quests without dying, let alone 4 times. to me the perception was a bit objective but "gimp" still entered my mind.

[philo]

I have to disagree with this, but I will admit that if you want to play a character with less than 200HP, you had better know what you're doing... and you had better be good a twitch skills.

Honestly, it's pretty rare that anything even gets close enough to my sorc for me to be concerned. When you have a nearly unlimited mana pool and 180 different ways to neuter any given opponent, you have little excuse for taking damage

eh /shrug there are things that will one hit you on hard/elite settings if you dont have decent hitpoints. Delayed fireblasts in shroud on higher settings. Abbots disintigrate or delayed fireblast or polar ray come to mind. You are right, you can usually avoid that damage but not 100% of the time.

and your "nearly unlimited mana" is not even close to enough to do things like dps the pit fiend for more then 10-20% of his bar etc.

And of course looking to future expansions, im sure it will only get worse. I do understand that Im biased and rank hitpoints on my casters higher then many. 200 unbuffed base is low as is and even non hitpoint/con builds should be able to attain that number easily enough with decent gear. Dex based casters are a thing of the past. Imo having below 200hp's unbuffed means you could have planned your build better.

[Yajerman01]

eh /shrug there are things that will one hit you on hard/elite settings if you dont have decent hitpoints. Delayed fireblasts in shroud on higher settings. Abbots disintigrate or delayed fireblast or polar ray come to mind. You are right, you can usually avoid that damage but not 100% of the time.

and your "nearly unlimited mana" is not even close to enough to do things like dps the pit fiend for more then 10-20% of his bar etc.

And of course looking to future expansions, im sure it will only get worse. I do understand that Im biased and rank hitpoints on my casters higher then many. 200 unbuffed base is low as is and even non hitpoint/con builds should be able to attain that number easily enough with decent gear. Dex based casters are a thing of the past. Imo having below 200hp's unbuffed means you could have planned your build better.

PS, you cant max out your con and your char on a drow sorc. the highest you can obtain at inception is a 20 char and a 14 con. Hopefully as a drow you can nab a +3 charisma tome and use your favor on the con, but otherwise what ive stated is the best con you can get if your putting all your ability points into charisma.

SO having that said, i feel confident that i did the correct thing as i dumped everything i could into con and charisma. But for a second there you had me guessing about my build

[unionyes]

Man, if you need 200+ HP or reroll, I am pwned.

My sorc 15 has like 160 or so. My rogue 14 has 140 or so.

I must be friggin awesome to have survived this long with that low of hit points. Of course, my sorc kills them before they can get to me, and when you throw stoneskin, gh, false life, and other buffs on the effective number goes up some. My rogue kills them before they know I am even there. I always sort of considered myself to be an average sort of casual gamer, but with my intense squishiness and ability to survive, I must be a pretty uber gamer

The only character that I have with over 200 hit points is my dwarf fighter 8, he has 225 and is being designed to spam intimidate, shield block and keep aggro while the rest of the party kills. He is slow, dumb, and if the party ever wants him to get over a boulder or a wall they better bring some rope to haul his chunky butt over. That's why he is still level 8, it is kinda boring being a pure tank. I would much rather nuke 'em from afar, or run into the fray three steps behind the tanks and slaughter without getting aggro, much more fun IMO.

[philo]

PS, you cant max out your con and your char on a drow sorc. the highest you can obtain at inception is a 20 char and a 14 con. Hopefully as a drow you can nab a +3 charisma tome and use your favor on the con, but otherwise what ive stated is the best con you can get if your putting all your ability points into charisma.

SO having that said, i feel confident that i did the correct thing as i dumped everything i could into con and charisma. But for a second there you had me guessing about my build

with a 14 base con you should still be able to break 200hp's easily with decent gear.

20 base
4x16=64 class
10draconic vitality
6 con item makes con 20=+5 per lvl..5x16=80
30 greater false life item

thats 204 right there...
every character should be wearing minos legion imo..thats +18 so 222

thats 222 without any tomes...but +2 tomes are easy to attain these days too, they come from end rewards.

thats 238 with a +2 tome

not including any spiffy greensteel items etc. (of which i consider the first 2 upgrades attainable by even casual players)..but we will leave those out since one has so many options and hp's wont be first on most peoples list

and to the person who commented about their rogue this is only for pure casters. Rogues have to spread their stats around more while casters have a primary stat and con basically.

Note I have been saying "with decent gear". If you are lacking the gear there is no reason to reroll. You just have some things you should try to acquire. Everyone should have a 6 con item and a greater false life item at the bare minimum.

...and I personally think every class in the game should be wearing a minos legion

[CSFurious]

i forgot you are the battle cleric who plays drunk

np

Oh p.s i would like to be squelched as well cs for the amount of ******** that goes into your posts and your lack of common sense.Wanna help a new player? Dont post when you dont know what your talking about

[Aspenor]

i forgot you are the battle cleric who plays drunk

np

Actually, a lot of us play drunk. And we don't wipe when the cleric dies.

[CSFurious]

according to certain logic in this thread, there are only 3 races that can be sorcerors, i.e., humans, dwarves & warforged

those are the races that can get the most hitpoints as sorcerors

additionally, due to chr limitations, really only human should be used as a sor because that race's potential chr is higher than the other 2

that sounds like a lot of fun, i.e., if you do not choose one of those races at character creation then you are gimped

i would conservatively estimate that at least 50% of sors are drow & 50% of wizards are drow or elf

i guess that means that half of the existing arcanes need to re-roll for end game

if that is true, then there is no future for DDO end-game with respect to arcane casters because i do not foresee that many players re-rolling

cookiecutter builds are bad for the game

PS, you cant max out your con and your char on a drow sorc. the highest you can obtain at inception is a 20 char and a 14 con. Hopefully as a drow you can nab a +3 charisma tome and use your favor on the con, but otherwise what ive stated is the best con you can get if your putting all your ability points into charisma.

SO having that said, i feel confident that i did the correct thing as i dumped everything i could into con and charisma. But for a second there you had me guessing about my build

[philo]

all those drow sors better reroll because if any of them has max chr & more than 225 hitpoints unbuffed, i will take you off my ignore list

according to certain logic in this thread, there are only 3 races that can be sorcerors, i.e., humans, dwarves & warforged
those are the races that can get the most hitpoints as sorcerors

To funny. He must still have me on ignore because I just broke down how a drow with only a 14 base con can fairly easily attain over 225 hp's...not to mention I really only state that if you cant hit 200 you should probably rethink your build. Not sure where he got the 225 number.

[Aspenor]

with a 14 base con you should still be able to break 200hp's easily with decent gear.

20 base
4x16=64 class
10draconic vitality
6 con item makes con 20=+5 per lvl..5x16=80
30 greater false life item

thats 204 right there...
every character should be wearing minos legion imo..thats +18 so 222

thats 222 without any tomes...but +2 tomes are easy to attain these days too, they come from end rewards.

thats 238 with a +2 tome

not including any spiffy greensteel items etc. (of which i consider the first 2 upgrades attainable by even casual players)..but we will leave those out since one has so many options and hp's wont be first on most peoples list

and to the person who commented about their rogue this is only for pure casters. Rogues have to spread their stats around more while casters have a primary stat and con basically.

Note I have been saying "with decent gear". If you are lacking the gear there is no reason to reroll. You just have some things you should try to acquire. Everyone should have a 6 con item and a greater false life item at the bare minimum.

...and I personally think every class in the game should be wearing a minos legion

he must still have me on ignore because I just broke down how a drow with only a 14 base con can fairly easily attain over 225 hp's...not to mention I really only state that if you cant hit 200 you should probably rethink your build.

Quoted for good measure

[Yajerman01]

with a 14 base con you should still be able to break 200hp's easily with decent gear.

20 base
4x16=64 class
10draconic vitality
6 con item makes con 20=+5 per lvl..5x16=80
30 greater false life item

thats 204 right there...
every character should be wearing minos legion imo..thats +18 so 222

Im gonna have to check my gear tonight when i get home, excluding the +6 con item i dont have I do know i have 14 base con, I do have a Greater false life item on, but im just not getting 204, plus I am wearing the minos so im gonna have to figure out where im running up shy at.

I forgot about the added HP to greenstell items, good call! But since im wearing wiz6 greensteal bracers, i pressume it will be a while before i obtain the magic 20 runs on the shroud just in hopes of obtaining that item that clenses the greensteel gear. Until then SP rules the roost on my toon.

[Merkinsal]

cookiecutter builds are bad for the game

Interestingly enough, we can't see each others builds or gear as I could in another game I once played. I think (therefore I must be delusional) that the privacy players have with their builds and gear is a good thing. As tremendously complicated as this game is and the fact that once created a character cannot be changed, I would bet many do not have exactly what they want and are not about to reroll to do something about it. Heck, I cannot even see what damage someone is doing to compare dps, what spell they're casting, what technique they are using in hand to hand, and the kill count is a joke as it only counts the last fatal hit. Except for the "Do you have Ddoor?" or "Do you have flesh to stone" neither of which have wrong answers (I'm not sure about that statement lol) no one really knows how our characters are built. I did get the "How is your UMD?" once because we needed to rez a guy and someone had the scroll but couldn't use it. I guess I'll have to look at that when I do a 32 point build. Anyway, in that one quest, my performance was more than good enough to succeed. Point being, this game is all about how well you play within the group and the group's success, ultimately, and not so much about the build. If you like jump, then by all means up your jump and go for it. If you like agro, (and can handle it with out dying), dump diplomacy. If you like charms, charm. If you don't, then don't. Personaly I hate charms with a passion and do not use them. Never once has anyone said anything and never once has that affected the quests success. Create the character that fits your personality and go with it. You will find plenty of groups and guilds to play in and will have a wonderful time. I don't have UMD but get no end of compliments.

{edit} P.S. Tip on being successful. As a Sorc, you are back there with the cleric. Keep him alive! lol. I love to hear "Thank you again. How many times have I said that?" If the cleric dies, I take that as a personal failure and ask what could I have done differently.

[philo]

Im gonna have to check my gear tonight when i get home, excluding the +6 con item i dont have I do know i have 14 base con, I do have a Greater false life item on, but im just not getting 204, plus I am wearing the minos so im gonna have to figure out where im running up shy at.

I forgot about the added HP to greenstell items, good call! But since im wearing wiz6 greensteal bracers, i pressume it will be a while before i obtain the magic 20 runs on the shroud just in hopes of obtaining that item that clenses the greensteel gear. Until then SP rules the roost on my toon.

If i had to guess... Since you have a 4 con item and wear minos legion should put you at 206....but if you arent breaking 200 you probably dont have draconic vitality and are sitting at 196? Did you get your gianthold favor? Im probly off but...does 196 sound right?

that would include 14 base a 4 con item and minos legion without having draconic vit.

[Yajerman01]

If i had to guess... Since you have a 4 con item and wear minos legion should put you at 206....but if you arent breaking 200 you probably dont have draconic vitality and are sitting at 196? Did you get your gianthold favor? Im probly off but...does 196 sound right?

that would include 14 base a 4 con item and minos legion without having draconic vit.

I called my wife and she annoyingly agreed to look at my character. ANd first off, I apologize, she said my toon is showing 190 hp, not 194. I also asked her to read back my con ability and she said its 15. so either I ate a +1 tome or I actually have a +5 con item on (pretty sure its a 4).

As for giant favor, yes, that I already have. Im not sure about the draconic vit and I dare not ask my wife to check again. so ill have to look later. but at this point im assuming it is the draconic vit., because that and a +6 con item would put me at 204 then. I pressume anyway <shrugs>

I hate being at work!

[CSFurious]

seriously, unless you play 4 to 7 hours per day +2 con tomes do not drop from the sky & neither does all that other gear either especially when you spend your time playing multiple characters

anyway, the easiest way is to make a human sor because you can easily have starting chr of 18 & con of 16

when a +2 con tome drops from the sky, you can have a con of 24 with a +6 item on your brand-new human sor

this week would actually be a great week to re-roll as there is +25 bonus & you could probably get to level 12 or 14 by Sunday if you took off a few days from work or decided not to sleep that much

sounds like a lot of fun

the above is satire, & i think your sor is fine as is as i believe in freewill & also sticking it to the man, i.e., players who know everything

additionally, i have decided that, for the time being, if current end-game requires a sor to throw around heal scrolls in the shroud that i will not be playing any sor because that is not my idea of fun

peace

I called my wife and she annoyingly agreed to look at my character. ANd first off, I apologize, she said my toon is showing 190 hp, not 194. I also asked her to read back my con ability and she said its 15. so either I ate a +1 tome or I actually have a +5 con item on (pretty sure its a 4).

As for giant favor, yes, that I already have. Im not sure about the draconic vit and I dare not ask my wife to check again. so ill have to look later. but at this point im assuming it is the draconic vit., because that and a +6 con item would put me at 204 then. I pressume anyway <shrugs>

I hate being at work!

[Deragoth]

UMD, and Concentration are the most important. Diplomacy would be nice to have... if you're not a noob like me and only took a 10 intelligence.

Hey, are you guys with the +36 UMD taking Skill Focus? I've been thinking about picking this feat up...