DC's on elite are RIDICULOUS

[Beherit_Baphomar]

We all know that a level 12 elite is only 14 for purposes of loot. Elite adds more than +2 to the difficulty... probably more like +4 or even +5.

If you hover above the elite button on your popup you'll see what elite means...

[GeneralDiomedes]

If you hover above the elite button on your popup you'll see what elite means...

Then why were only trap damage and reflex DCs increased and not everything else? The traps are now much harder than the mobs.

[ArkoHighStar]

Then why were only trap damage and reflex DCs increased and not everything else?

In new content monsters were also made expontially more powerful

[Beherit_Baphomar]

Then why were only trap damage and reflex DCs increased and not everything else?

What "everything else" doesnt become harder on elite?

[GeneralDiomedes]

What "everything else" doesnt become harder on elite?

On old content, the traps were made harder while nothing else was. Like I said before, the traps are now much harder than the mobs which to me seems like a shoddy bit of balancing.

[Westerner]

At least you can still get lucky and make it through if your party doesn't have a Rogue built exclusively for maximum reflex save. Has any other class besides Rogue been put through the reroll grinder as much? I am starting to feel sorry for them.

Emphasizing the trapsmithing capabilities of full rogues vs multiclass rogues is probably a good thing. However, raising the save DC's too high might have the opposite effect. Search/Disable DC's haven't changed, and multiclass rogues can still do just as good a job in most cases. On boxes that require Evasion, since the save is now impractical for everyone, those who've invested the most in it (i.e. full rogues) get devalued the most.

[Mad_Bombardier]

A better solution would have been to increase the damage as they have, but have left the DCs alone, or only slightly increased them.

At least you can still get lucky and make it through if your party doesn't have a Rogue built exclusively for maximum reflex save. Has any other class besides Rogue been put through the reroll grinder as much? I am starting to feel sorry for them.

I agree there. It's not so good when a maximum Reflex build has a 50/50 chance of getting through. The rest of us need to roll a 20 (and low HP builds will die from half damage anyway).

[Angelus_dead]

If you hover above the elite button on your popup you'll see what elite means...

I know what it means- apparently you don't.

[Beherit_Baphomar]

On old content, the traps were made harder while nothing else was. Like I said before, the traps are now much harder than the mobs which to me seems like a shoddy bit of balancing.

There has been shoddy balancing since we ran Waterworks. Normal Waterworks at level 1 is fine and dandy, elite Waterworks at level 1 and you gotta play smart...Normal Prison of the Planes at level14 is a cakewalk, elite PoP at level14 is a cakewalk.

[Kaboth]

Quite honestly, I feel that a quest on Elite, you SHOULD need to have classes along to get past it. A well balanced group, not all arcane, not all of X etc... I think a trap or two on elite that make people flinch without a rogue is a GOOD thing.

[Grond]

I'm guessing that elite shouldn't be the default setting for quests anymore. I'm guessing if you want to deal with elite traps you probably need an elite trapsmith.

[Turial]

The question is does that elite trapsmith have uses other then hopefully surviving the elite trap and disarming it? Some of the trapsmith builds I have played with couldn't fight their way out of a paper bag much less against elite mobs. (Note I said some, not all)

[dragnmoon]

Quite honestly, I feel that a quest on Elite, you SHOULD need to have classes along to get past it. A well balanced group, not all arcane, not all of X etc... I think a trap or two on elite that make people flinch without a rogue is a GOOD thing.

From what I am hearing... My 16 Rogue Will be having problems making saves on Elite!!.. Kind of sucks getting killed by the trap getting to the box. I think the highest i can get my Reflex save is 30

I think the only combo that is good on elite are Pallie/Rogues..

[dragnmoon]

From what I am hearing... My 16 Rogue Will be having problems making saves on Elite!!.. Kind of sucks getting killed by the trap getting to the box. I think the highest i can get my Reflex save is 30

I think the only combo that is good on elite are Pallie/Rogues..

I would Like to change this...

I can actually get my save Vs Traps to at least +40 maybe higher if I am missing adding something.

Looking forward to testing The traps on Elite...(not really )

[Vormaerin]

Hmmm, apparently it wasn't an accident that the DCs went up. The dev in the latest DDOcast mentioned 'higher damage and save DCs' on traps at one point during a discussion on harder content. So maybe it was on purpose..which is scary. It didn't sound like something they thought needed changing. Hopefully I'm wrong about that. Damage that's actually scary at that level? Heck, yes. DCs only really contorted builds could manage? No, thanks.

[Westerner]

If the devs dont fix this, one way to partially adapt might be with protection from energy spells. Did the trick for tonight on Deleras Elite. Fire shield might help, too.

[studentx]

There has been shoddy balancing since we ran Waterworks. Normal Waterworks at level 1 is fine and dandy, elite Waterworks at level 1 and you gotta play smart...Normal Prison of the Planes at level14 is a cakewalk, elite PoP at level14 is a cakewalk.

Several quests do not allow you to play smart, at least trap wise. You MUST STAND IN THE TRAP(S) TO DISABLE THE BOX. When you do that you MUST save vs a 40 on reflex or DIE.

ELITE POP has no traps that can be disarmed, capisci?

[Shade]

Ran von 5 today with a group on elite. The rogue couldn't disarm the trap by the last door, or pick the lock for that matter, because he kept dying in the trap.

So the rogue sucked. What was he doing on an elite quest?

It's entirely possible to unlock and open the door without getting by the trap a single time. All it takes it proper timing and jump skill. The trap can't be disabled without getting hit directly - but the trap auto disables once the door is open, and you can then disable the box afterwards if you want the bonus XP for it.

The same thing applies to almost every trap I can think of. I can't think of a single one you where you MUST get hit by to disable it.

[Shade]

Several quests do not allow you to play smart, at least trap wise. You MUST STAND IN THE TRAP(S) TO DISABLE THE BOX. When you do that you MUST save vs a 40 on reflex or DIE.

No they do not. Name one, I will tell you how to do it without getting hit.

Yes some of the save DCs are impossible to make - there designed to be. There is 2 days to make traps deadly for elite players:
A) Low save DC - but killed in 1 hit no matter what, even if you have 700hp if you fail the save... Pretty lame because it means any noob with 2 rogue levels can pull off elite traps.
B) How it is now. Mega high DC - only the most elite uber high reflex save rogues can save - But only semi-high dmg, high HP characters can survivie thru them... But your average 2 rogue splash cannot. Splashs aren't meant to be effective on elite.

The 2nd way is much better imo, as it allows for some margin of error.

[studentx]

So the rogue sucked. What was he doing on an elite quest?

It's entirely possible to unlock and open the door without getting by the trap a single time. All it takes it proper timing and jump skill. The trap can't be disabled without getting hit - but the trap auto disables once the door is open, and you can then disable the box afterwards if you want the bonus XP for it.

The same thing applies to almost every trap I can think of. I can't think of a single one you where you MUST get hit by to disable it.

Lightening/spinners hallway same quest.

And of course there is a few quests you have to jump through/over the traps to get to the box. Cabal and if I remember correctly Rainbow. Then there are the run/swim/jump/hop/tumble through traps to get x item ...scoundrel and crucible.