Here we go again

[Velorn]

Last night while scrolling through the LFM's I came across an LFM for some lowbee quest. In their comments it said something like " Kobold's Den...in progress....Battle Clerics not welcome" They were also looking for multiple classes to finish filling the group. They had no cleric in the group yet. I found it hilarious and maddening at the same time that they could start the quest without a cleric and outright neglect one because he also fights. I mean, I don't think they were looking for a babysitter if they felt they were good enough to start, so what's the difference? I almost asked to join the group with my L3 Cleric and pull out the longsword.

BattleClerics Anonymous

[Arnya]

I was on Thelanis a month back getting drow unlocked.

With my 1ftr/2clr.

Yeah, Thelanians are funny about clerics that hurt stuff huh?

[Ringos]

Lol...that stuff never stops baffling me. We don't want a Battle Cleric because they never heal, but we started the quest and we'll take a fighter or barb. Hmmmm. I guess they figure that they would kill so quick that they wouldn't require healing? Ahh, what logic! I've seen good and bad clerics that are splashed with another class. I'd give most folks try before judging them.

[~Jules921]

I think what they are trying to do when they say "no battle clerics" is to avoid those clerics that don't heal/buff the party. It might be better to do what I do in my lfm's "healer needed". I also can't say how many times the bard/ranger/pally did more healing than the cleric.

Jules

[Uska]

I dont consider my cleric a battle cleric but I dont join groups that put that in their lfm's either I like to fight some with my clerics and heck in some quests on my main my para weapon helps a bit. I just try to watch the life bars when I am fighting and those mass cure spells sure help a lot when things get a little hairy.

[MrWizard]

I personally feel that when someone says 'cleric' they are looking for a main healer.

When you are a battle cleric, you are a fighter with healng abilities (many I have run with ONLY heal themselves).


SO, a battle cleric joining is cool as a fighter, but if the only spot is an LFM for a cleric, do not join if you are not a healer. Unfortunately many 'non-healing' battle clerics decide they are 'clerics' and not fighters. So they read the lfm wrong and thus harmony is broken.

Some people play well, others are learning. Guess it is part of the process. You should join em and teach em that some people know how to fight and heal....but realize there are a lot that give them a bad name.

[Clay]

The trouble, MrWizard, should you read the OP carefully, is that the LFM was NOT up for just a cleric. It was up for multiple classes.

So, in essence, they are saying, any fighter built along a (self-healing) cleric line, one capable of whipping a wand, should need arise, let alone manna, is not allowed. But a straight fighter, who cannot wand whip, is.

That is prejudice: How dare you build a fighter using the cleric class! A plague upon your family!

[Analyst]

I would have sent the leader a tell saying that I was a pure healer. Then I would have declined his invitation letting him know that the quality and intelligence of the party was in question.

I play a straight healing cleric. I'm still new to the game, but last night we brought another cleric into our group that spent his time casting offensively while I healed. He had quite the itchy 'slay living' trigger finger. He saved me so much blue by one shotting mobs; it was a beautiful thing.

Is a battle cleric defined as a melee cleric? If so, what do you call a damage casting cleric?

[Ringos]

Analyst, that question will never be answered! On one of the many Battle Cleric threads, I suggested something like Melee Cleric for one that swings, since some consider an offensive-casting Cleric a 'Battle Cleric'.

I only have 20 Str with my main pure Cleric, and I still swing a mace when it's appropriate. I'll also throw out a dose of Destruction, Banishment and CC. Does that make me a 'Battle Cleric'. Not in my opinion.

The big problem: People tend to throw a label on something and it sticks in their head. Those are the people that miss out.

[Velorn]

I would have sent the leader a tell saying that I was a pure healer. Then I would have declined his invitation letting him know that the quality and intelligence of the party was in question.

I play a straight healing cleric. I'm still new to the game, but last night we brought another cleric into our group that spent his time casting offensively while I healed. He had quite the itchy 'slay living' trigger finger. He saved me so much blue by one shotting mobs; it was a beautiful thing.

Is a battle cleric defined as a melee cleric? If so, what do you call a damage casting cleric?

A welcome addition to any party I'd think.

[Velorn]

Analyst, that question will never be answered! On one of the many Battle Cleric threads, I suggested something like Melee Cleric for one that swings, since some consider an offensive-casting Cleric a 'Battle Cleric'.

I only have 20 Str with my main pure Cleric, and I still swing a mace when it's appropriate. I'll also throw out a dose of Destruction, Banishment and CC. Does that make me a 'Battle Cleric'. Not in my opinion.

The big problem: People tend to throw a label on something and it sticks in their head. Those are the people that miss out.

QFT in red. In mean really...it's not like I ignore health bars altogether

Perseus was rerolled as my first 32 point build and I gave him a base 16 str to start...without sacrificing wisdom..fully knowing that he'll take a level of fighter at L9 or L12. Just the way he's planned out. For now...until he can use the race restricted gear I've collected for him....he's got the Bull's Strength spell memmed. Command and Soundburst are my friends. But in my opinion he best represents what a cleric is capable of being. He's also based on one of my better PnP characters from long ago.

[malnon]

I have seen many complaints about what people want/need in their party. The party leader did not want a battle cleric, who knows or cares why. There are many threads saying that so and so wants so and so and thats it. Chalk it up to noob ignornce and move on.

The party leader may have been in one of the groups like I have been recently at low levels. Three times in the last week I have been in groups with clerics who will not heal. They run around bashing things, but will not assist any other party members. In fact on two occastions they ended the quest or hit every shrine with 50 to 75% sp. On one occasion the cleric ran right up to the end boss and agrooed him before we were setup and wiped all but one in the party. Had it not been for the ranger with healing wands and an adamantine weapon we would have failed. Now the group leader may have had a similar experience and he does not like it and has four other players he is responsible for. And so he posts his LFM to run his group the way he wants to. For many it may be a loss on their part, but there is nothing you can do about it.

And as stated it does beg the question what is a battle cleric. A melee build, an offensive caster build, or both? One of the eternal questions that will never be answered.

[Greymeir]

I would have sent the leader a tell saying that I was a pure healer. Then I would have declined his invitation letting him know that the quality and intelligence of the party was in question.

I play a straight healing cleric. I'm still new to the game, but last night we brought another cleric into our group that spent his time casting offensively while I healed. He had quite the itchy 'slay living' trigger finger. He saved me so much blue by one shotting mobs; it was a beautiful thing.

Is a battle cleric defined as a melee cleric? If so, what do you call a damage casting cleric?

NECROMANCER!!!

[malnon]

Don't you wish we had domain abilities/spells available?

And I would disagree on that. A necromancer universally applies to an arcane caster.

[Heladron]

That kind of junk is D U M Dumb. I really get bugged by unimaginative thinkers.

While the person has the right to post whatever type of LFM they want, they better realize that they are advertising that dumbness to the whole server by telling people this is how I want you to play.

I've seen a lot of wannabe battle clerics that don't do a very good job at it, but I've seen, on a rare occasions, battle clerics owning Co6 and other quests on elite. That's probably not going to be the case at low levels, but it illustrates a point that a good battle cleric is a force to be reckoned with.

I don't consider my cleric a melee battle cleric, but I've cast many a max'd BB or Comet Fall and a well placed Destruction on an orange named boss here and there to save a lot of lost hit points and spell points.

Poor game play is poor game play. I've had clerics that just sit there and leech xp and their blue bar is just as full when the quest finished as when it started. They never took a swing with their weapon and just followed the party along. The casters are sending party tells asking for heals all the way through the quest and whoever was driving the cleric around didn't do anything. I'm pretty convinced it was some kind of social experiment to mess with people. The cleric was 6th level and we were running Delera's tomb.

I'd take a battle cleric that contributes vs. a cleric that just goes along for a joy ride.

[malnon]

Oh Heladron I agree whole heartedly. Until finger was introduced, slay living and destruction were the best at one shot kills. I have been able to save a lot of sp by slaying a beholder or mindflayer versus standing around and watching the tanks and casters try to beat them down. Also, a well placed greater command can really help manage agro and received damage. Yet another spell I wish I had started using earlier.

I just wish I cold have figured out the spell pen mechanics sooner.

[Uamhas]

I would have sent the leader a tell saying that I was a pure healer. Then I would have declined his invitation letting him know that the quality and intelligence of the party was in question.

I play a straight healing cleric. I'm still new to the game, but last night we brought another cleric into our group that spent his time casting offensively while I healed. He had quite the itchy 'slay living' trigger finger. He saved me so much blue by one shotting mobs; it was a beautiful thing.

Is a battle cleric defined as a melee cleric? If so, what do you call a damage casting cleric?

Well that's easy, silly: Divine Caster.

[malnon]

Well that's easy, silly: Divine Caster.

But aren't they all?

[Ministry]

I mostly chalk this up to one of 2 major (not the only... so relax) issues for a LFM up with the comment "no battle clerics".

1 - Ignorance.

2 - Poor players on team, or most likely poor leadership.

I know for one, I fell into the first category in my first year. I even recall telling a guildy that I thought he was too much of a battle cleric and I would often not ask him to join because I wanted a pure healer, unless it was a quest I knew well and could figure out with a Cleric than may or may not heal, and this was because many more people were dying in quests with him because he was on the front lines ahead of everyone and was missing tonnes of mobs and we were overwhelmed and healing potions just weren't cutting it.

Battle Cleric by definition??? Anyone??? Does a Battle Cleric not heal or do they occasionally, or is it split as when required?

That is an issue in itself.

I tell my mates that I'm not the best healing cleric, but **** can I kill a lot on my Cleric. But, if necessary, I have seen my heals in the 800-900 range, which is more than enough at this point.

But, I prefer to go in and cast Destruction, Greater Command, or one of many other great Cleric spells to either a) destroy the dangerous mob outright or b) knock a bunch down so my party can take them out without fear of being injured, thus requiring my healing.

I don't put those people down who are either of my 1 or 2 categories, because I figure it's one of those and just let it go.

I have used much less mana and waaaaaaayyyyyy fewer heal scrolls by destructing tough mobs right upfront, or after I see my melee friends are not having tremendous success.

Oh.. by the way... it may help others if they were to play multiple classes to get a feeling for them. I play a mage, sorc, bard, rogue, pally, ranger, tank and a cleric and have deleted a number more, so I have learned to survive and succeed without one or 2 of the classes above, including a Cleric.

My suggestions are once again... one of 2 (but I'm sure there are more)

1 - Teach your friends and guildies how to succeed in quests without what people see as "key" builds. Make your own teams and try do do things without "key" builds to see how it goes.

2 - Avoid those parties that are stating... no battle clerics.

Oh.. yes... it's funny... I also know this sad to be true... One bad experience with a poor build, be it Ranger, Cleric or Bard and unfortunately we get jaded. Hey, I just make a list of the real big issues and remember not to team with them... simple. Well, there is one exception... if someone is not so good, but a nice guy, I may offer to coach them or at least offer alternative solutions.

Anyways...I've said more than I like to... because next you will get me on Rangers which is my fav class to play and my best toon. Yea, now I have some of looking and thinking.. "What... Ministrye's Ranger SUX!!!

Hey, maybe I was having an off day... it actually states that and apologizes *kinda* in my bio.

[Cowdenicus]

The reason I no longer play on Thelanis......