Eliminate Raid Prerequisites for DQ and VON

[tekn0mage]

I'm satisfied with the response, just not the action taken. That is far from Tolero's control, however. I do believe we will see some action on this issue. It just might be awhile. Sadly, I don't think our raid nights can wait months before they come back alive.

[Grimmlock]

Its not a response its more of a side step.

To actually see that they are in talks is good. A reasonable response would be more along the lines of " We are taking a loot at the existing way these quest are run and trying to determine what the best course of action would be if we decide that they need a change."

At least we would know they are making an effort at a possibility of a change.

[Zenako]

Here's another thought on flagging for the early raids.

Make it a counter. So after you have proven yourself to the quest giver enough times, they no longer require the prereqs again. So for Von 5, once you have completed the Von 1-4 series something like 10 times (ie ransack like number of times), you gain a free pass into Von 5 without havving to run 1-4 again.

For DQ a couple of things could work. The Stacking Idea would be a nice one, also letting those items go into a collectible Bag would address some of the same issues. You could for example gather together 10 of each item (like in Gianthold) and turn them in at one time to the Genie for a permanent Pass from each portion to the PreRaid. Or you could turn them in one at a time for one shot entries like you do now.

Both should be managable and involve changing virtually nothing in the raids themselves so the coding would be a lot more straightforward from what I could see.

[Tolero]

I can understand how that response might be frustrating. I suppose the easiest way to describe it as I can't come and say "Yes" or "No" to such a request because neither yes or no are in my available to comment on cue ...

After all, we have to balance what we do with... everything else we have to do too

I did want to make sure though that you all knew that it was on our radar though. Feed back is always worth discussion to me (granted I'm probably drowning them in it) so I've been tracking all the data I can on it vs all the feed back available on...well...everything. It's kind of like watching someone spin those plates on a pole trying to keep them all spinning so none of them fall

[Oreg]

Appreciate the update Tolero . It is obviously an important issue to us.

[Ciaran]

So because you don't like them, people who do enjoy them should be forced to jump through a bunch of hoops in order to do so?

That's the thing that's struck me from the beginning - it's like people are trying to enforce some kind of playstyle or something.

Elitists aren't just people who power game...

[Cowdenicus]

I can understand how that response might be frustrating. I suppose the easiest way to describe it as I can't come and say "Yes" or "No" to such a request because neither yes or no are in my available to comment on cue ...

After all, we have to balance what we do with... everything else we have to do too

I did want to make sure though that you all knew that it was on our radar though. Feed back is always worth discussion to me (granted I'm probably drowning them in it) so I've been tracking all the data I can on it vs all the feed back available on...well...everything. It's kind of like watching someone spin those plates on a pole trying to keep them all spinning so none of them fall

Is there really alot of feedback?

[Tolero]

Is there really alot of feedback?

Always. Like the sound of thousands of tiny voices crying out...eh...wait that's probably a bad example, as it may bring up some bad death star related memories >>

Ok, it's more like... hmm ok I'll have a goofy RP moment with you here. My old story about my bard Varro being "tapped into the consciousness of Xen'drik" it's a LOT like that. All the joy, triumph, desire, longing, hope, suffering, anger, happiness, everything. Took a moment to get adjusted to it because of just the sheer volume of it, but now I move through it as second nature and a "normal" part of my existence.

So issues, such as this one, are always in my line of sight. ^^ The trick is, like Varro, you don't necessarily know that I'm able to see it. I like to ease that distress as much as I can when I can, hence my peaking in to remind you all that you don't have to strangle one another for us to hear you

[Jaywade]

That's the thing that's struck me from the beginning - it's like people are trying to enforce some kind of playstyle or something.

Elitists aren't just people who powergame...

not sur ehow it "forces" a kind of playstyle....listen if they did make so you inly had to do von 1-4 once or soemthing alongs those lines people would still run them, I'd run the vons just to get to part 3 for the massive xp that it offers.... point is it's a pain and a grind to repeatly flag for DQ and Dragon to raids that people like running but not flagging for, and the titan and the reaver do a lot to instill that becasue they are both flag once and done

[tekn0mage]

not sur ehow it "forces" a kind of playstyle....listen if they did make so you inly had to do von 1-4 once or soemthing alongs those lines people would still run them, I'd run the vons just to get to part 3 for the massive xp that it offers.... point is it's a pain and a grind to repeatly flag for DQ and Dragon to raids that people like running but not flagging for, and the titan and the reaver do a lot to instill that becasue they are both flag once and done

He's referring to the people that are up in arms about removing the pre-reqs after you've completed it once.

These people get all worked up how the pre-reqs should be run every time, and anyone who disagrees is a lootmonger, etc.

That is in a sense forcing a playstyle since nothing is preventing THEM from running VON1-4 then onto 5&6 on THEIR raid nights.

[Cowdenicus]

/snip

I like to ease that distress as much as I can when I can, hence my peaking in to remind you all that you don't have to strangle one another for us to hear you

But sometimes the strangling is fun (if you are on the giving end, because this is one of those times it is better to give then receive.)

You know I am just messing with you......

So uhm Tolero.....

How you doin'?

[Drider]

I have fun running the Queen and the Dragon. However I find the vons and desert to be boring.

There's no fun anymore in doing the pre-req's for me.. not when we can solo most of them now anyway. The raids still have that element of excitement because they can still be a challenge on the higher settings.

[Tolero]

But sometimes the strangling is fun (if you are on the giving end, because this is one of those times it is better to give then receive.)

You know I am just messing with you......

So uhm Tolero.....

How you doin'?

*thump* back on topic

[Tin_Dragon]

So, Turbine, when are we going to do something about the Demon Queen and the VON series?

Haven't we ran VON1-4 enough? And the three (or four) pre-quests for DQ are just killing our time in game. Can we get a word on whether this is something we can take a look at? Right now, the Reaver is just overcooked to death. It's time we get some answers on what you guys plan on doing.

The DQ and the VON series are great raids, but the time spent flagging every week is just making it to where they will without a doubt fall off the map (if they haven't already).

/signed

[akla_thornfist]

tolero you rock girl thanks for taking time out of your day to calm the masses see ya akla

[GeneralDiomedes]

no response from devs - /waiting
vague response from devs - /shrug
concrete response from devs - /cheer

Note that /angry is not one of them

[Cowdenicus]

no response from devs - /waiting
vague response from devs - /shrug
concrete response from devs - /cheer

Note that /angry is not one of them

any response from Tolero = /flirt

Uhm, back on topic though now that I have been chastised, I would love to see these prereqs go the way of the Dodo.

[Jaywade]

He's referring to the people that are up in arms about removing the pre-reqs after you've completed it once.

These people get all worked up how the pre-reqs should be run every time, and anyone who disagrees is a lootmonger, etc.

That is in a sense forcing a playstyle since nothing is preventing THEM from running VON1-4 then onto 5&6 on THEIR raid nights.

you see tech that's the thing that drives me nuts about this game (I'm sure you too), what does player A care if player B doesn;t have to flag for the dragon anymore, how does that effect player A???? ....we see way too much of this...player A might see it as the Dev's caving to what player B (powergamer) wants.... folks don't like rerunning these things again and again......ughhhh...

[tekn0mage]

you see tech that's the thing that drives me nuts about this game (I'm sure you too), what does player A care if player B doesn;t have to flag for the dragon anymore, how does that effect player A???? ....we see way too much of this...player A might see it as the Dev's caving to what player B (powergamer) wants.... folks don't like rerunning these things again and again......ughhhh...

I agree we have far too much of it... but its on the other side of the coin. Ask the people who are against the changes what their big hangup is.

I made strong, valid points regarding raid-reflagging and it's only met with "your a loot hooker". Not one of my arguments had anything to do with loot. I don't see how they got that opinion, but meh.

[Tin_Dragon]

I agree we have far too much of it... but its on the other side of the coin. Ask the people who are against the changes what their big hangup is.

I made strong, valid points regarding raid-reflagging and it's only met with "your a loot hooker". Not one of my arguments had anything to do with loot. I don't see how they got that opinion, but meh.

Well we are talking about RAIDS, why does anyone run raids over and over and over?