Need expert opinion.

[Shrazkil]

So here is the scenerio , and my dilema.

So you are a 50 strength Barbarian, you have a decent dexterity 24-28 and many shot.

Which set of advantages would be more valuable in your opinion.

Option 1.

Second favored enemy (increasing both bonus' to +5 damage)
Deepwood sniper shot (+1 threat,+1 crit multiplier, +4 to-hit) every 10 seconds
+1 dexterity
Save increase of +2,+2,+2
+11 hide/move silent/ spot
First level ranger spells (rams might nice = +2 str , +2 damage, +1 trip/stun DC)

Option 2.

+1 strength
1 Feat
+2 stunning blow & trip DC increase
+4 to confirm crits
5/rest 15% haste clicks
Save increase of +4,+1,+1
+8 HP

Option 2 obviously has some more advantages, but deepwood shot would make bows X4 crit and make a threat range of 16 + for most bows.

Which would you take?

[Nestorious]

Uhm... call me a noob if ya will, but a 50 Str???

[Shade]

Does seem a bit tricky to pull off for someone with 28 dex..

Tho my barbarian has 52 str and 20 dex.

Option 2.

[Shrazkil]

Edited advantages as i thought of more.

My question based on lvl 20 spec(so more likely to be 24-26 dex at current)

The haste boost is the biggest thing im dreading missing...but X4 crit with 5 arrow manyshot...tough to pass on.

[jmelanie7]

Ok, it depends on what you wanna do, first if you have 50 STR, the STR point is useless, unless you didn't plan with a +3 tome, which would be useful. Do you use bows often ???? I made a rng/barb, and at lvl 14 i ended up being 95% melee, 5% range, so it may be cool on paper, but in fact if you don'T use the bows feats you get as a ranger(or as fighter, but i assume ranger for option 1 which boosts your dex) it's a waste. Tho, The silver bow allows you to crit for MASSIVE damage, it's pretty useless, you'll do way more dmg with your greataxe, or if you 2 weapons will crit really more often with rapiers, scimmis. (improved crit feat with barb rage critI on rapiers crit range of 14-20), just need a bloodstone to never fail on your crits. If you're really using bows, i'd go with option 1, if not, i'd go with option 2, either way, take your time and evaluate how many times you'd need a particular option.

[Strakeln]

I agree with Shade... option 2.

Something about the Deepwoods Sniper just seems off. It's not powerful enough.

[Shrazkil]

Ok, it depends on what you wanna do, first if you have 50 STR, the STR point is useless, unless you didn't plan with a +3 tome, which would be useful. Do you use bows often ???? I made a rng/barb, and at lvl 14 i ended up being 95% melee, 5% range, so it may be cool on paper, but in fact if you don'T use the bows feats you get as a ranger(or as fighter, but i assume ranger for option 1 which boosts your dex) it's a waste. Tho, The silver bow allows you to crit for MASSIVE damage, it's pretty useless, you'll do way more dmg with your greataxe, or if you 2 weapons will crit really more often with rapiers, scimmis. (improved crit feat with barb rage critI on rapiers crit range of 14-20), just need a bloodstone to never fail on your crits. If you're really using bows, i'd go with option 1, if not, i'd go with option 2, either way, take your time and evaluate how many times you'd need a particular option.

I wouldnt use bow primarily, but anytime manyshot is up for sure. My primary concept is Max strength barbarian, with ability to manyshot (so its brutal when it crits) , so that i loose no melee output. I foresee myself using bows only in open zones to draw them in, then switching to Bursting weighted 5% maul to stun, or break out SoS.

As for the strength , the 1 point could be useful depending on future content/tomes. So i do not discount it ( or to free up a human adaptability slot).

[Shrazkil]

I agree with Shade... option 2.

Something about the Deepwoods Sniper just seems off. It's not powerful enough.

Really? I guess it would depend on how long the wait for next attack would be, but if indeed usable every 10 seconds , that means at least 2 manyshot shots at 16+ normal bow 14+ silver bow, average crit with bloodstone around 142 damage + any effects.

[Strakeln]

Really? I guess it would depend on how long the wait for next attack would be, but if indeed usable every 10 seconds , that means at least 2 manyshot shots at 16+ normal bow 14+ silver bow, average crit with bloodstone around 142 damage + any effects.

As I understand it, it is toggled every 10 seconds to apply to your next arrow only... not your next X shots. Consider the pause in action that occurs now when you toggle something (such as manyshot). Doing that every 10 seconds means you'll be killing your DPS.

The crit damage multiplier is nice, but it only applies if you crit. So every 10 seconds you get a chance to toggle something (causing you to lose ~1 arrow shot) that has a 20% (at best) chance to do 30% extra damage with that one arrow... mind you, that additional crit damage is less than the total damage you would have done had you just fired the arrow instead of taking the time to toggle.

What this means is that the usage of the toggle is reduced to two uses:
1) As a pre-load: while you're running, hit the toggle, next mob you run into, the arrow will be supercharged.
2) In concurrence with manyshot, for the first 10 seconds of it (since, by the same argument I posed in the above paragraph, you are probably losing DPS by taking the break in firing to toggle the sniper... so it doesn't make sense to toggle a second one inside a manyshot burst).

Note that I haven't tried it out, this is just how I imagine the implementation is. If they've managed to make the toggle not interrupt your attacking, it will be better... but still not powerful.

Another consideration, gathered from someone who tested it on Risia: the action point cost for this enhancement is 13 (not sure if he meant stand-alone cost or cost plus cost of pre-reqs). He mentioned in his thread that he thought there might be a better use for those action points - such as favored enemy damage, or bow damage.

I guess it comes down to this: Tempest Ranger is an insanely powerful enhancement. It's going to change the game in much the same way that barbarian critical rage did... 2 months from now, ranger 6/fighter 10 and ranger 9/something 7 builds will be EVERYWHERE. The sniper enhancement is cool, but not nearly as useful or powerful as the tempest ranger... hence I find it a bit disappointing.

[Shrazkil]

As I understand it, it is toggled every 10 seconds to apply to your next arrow only... not your next X shots. Consider the pause in action that occurs now when you toggle something (such as manyshot). Doing that every 10 seconds means you'll be killing your DPS.

The crit damage multiplier is nice, but it only applies if you crit. So every 10 seconds you get a chance to toggle something (causing you to lose ~1 arrow shot) that has a 20% (at best) chance to do 30% extra damage with that one arrow... mind you, that additional crit damage is less than the total damage you would have done had you just fired the arrow instead of taking the time to toggle.

What this means is that the usage of the toggle is reduced to two uses:
1) As a pre-load: while you're running, hit the toggle, next mob you run into, the arrow will be supercharged.
2) In concurrence with manyshot, for the first 10 seconds of it (since, by the same argument I posed in the above paragraph, you are probably losing DPS by taking the break in firing to toggle the sniper... so it doesn't make sense to toggle a second one inside a manyshot burst).

Note that I haven't tried it out, this is just how I imagine the implementation is. If they've managed to make the toggle not interrupt your attacking, it will be better... but still not powerful.

Another consideration, gathered from someone who tested it on Risia: the action point cost for this enhancement is 13 (not sure if he meant stand-alone cost or cost plus cost of pre-reqs). He mentioned in his thread that he thought there might be a better use for those action points - such as favored enemy damage, or bow damage.

I guess it comes down to this: Tempest Ranger is an insanely powerful enhancement. It's going to change the game in much the same way that barbarian critical rage did... 2 months from now, ranger 6/fighter 10 and ranger 9/something 7 builds will be EVERYWHERE. The sniper enhancement is cool, but not nearly as useful or powerful as the tempest ranger... hence I find it a bit disappointing.

Wda states its use with manyshot. I assumed that to mean it works with all of that shot. I could very well be wrong.