Spell Defense

[Shein]

I'm wanting to build a highly mage resistant toon but need a better understanding of game mechanics. I'm going Drow ranger w/ 2 levels of paladin, geared toward a high will-save. However, i need help understanding how to defend against damaging magic that doesn't require a saving throw. Any insight you can offer would be great.

General: Robe of Invuln. (-5 damage reduction vs. magic)
Magic Missile: Raktu's Trifle (absorbs magic missile)
Scorching Ray: Fire resistance???
Burning hands: Fire resistance???

What else do mobs use alot?


Thanks in advance,
-Shein

[Sybel]

First of all, a robe of invulnerability doesnt protect from magic, it actually protects against non-magical weapons. confusing yes i know. Mobs like to use will save based effects yes, but it looks like that is covered, but one thing you will want to watch out for is fear. As far as damage, most mobs use fire or lightning, so resist energy and protect energy are very usefull, as well as fire shield. Other than that, if you are good at spotting attack animations, you can dodge most ray attacks. Since you are a ranger, you will get evasion, and with evasion, a high will save, resist and protect, and maybe some SR, you will be just fine.
(dont forget the ranger resist boost and resist enhancments!)

[cforce]

Robe of Invulnerability doesn't actually protect against damage from magic. The DR notation is, unfortunately, pretty confusing/misleading. DR 5/bla means that damage *from weapons* is reduced by 5, *except* when the weapon is type "bla". So, invulnerability gives you DR of 5 vs. physical attacks, except when those attacks are with a magic weapon.

At low levels, I burned through a Ratku's trifle for Magic Missle, and then later got a Shield clickie. (Shield clickie doesn't block against force missle, though.)

The answer to most of the other no-saving throw spells, as you surmised, is energy resistance of the appropriate type. But, this doesn't cover everything: Searing Light has no applicable resistance, for example. Also, at a certain point, 30 points of energy resistance is still not enough. Ice Flenser's Polar Ray, for example, does a *lot* more than 30 points!

The only other good defense against the various Ray spells is: move out of their way. While not practical for a melee character, attacking from range should give you enough time to watch caster's animations, and get out of harm's way.

[Shein]

Ahhh... thanks for setting me straight on the robe of invuln. So that's basically like a DR5 block robe that works on slash, pierce, and bludge?

Thanks for the info guys, very helpful!

First of all, a robe of invulnerability doesnt protect from magic, it actually protects against non-magical weapons. confusing yes i know. Mobs like to use will save based effects yes, but it looks like that is covered, but one thing you will want to watch out for is fear. As far as damage, most mobs use fire or lightning, so resist energy and protect energy are very usefull, as well as fire shield. Other than that, if you are good at spotting attack animations, you can dodge most ray attacks. Since you are a ranger, you will get evasion, and with evasion, a high will save, resist and protect, and maybe some SR, you will be just fine.
(dont forget the ranger resist boost and resist enhancments!)

[Sybel]

yes fire resist will take a good 90 damage out of a max lvl scorching ray, as far as stuff like polar ray, you are gonna want protect and fire shield for that one.

[bigj1608]

How much cha are you gonna have? Do you have any idea about base stats yet?

[transtemporal]

I'm wanting to build a highly mage resistant toon but need a better understanding of game mechanics. I'm going Drow ranger w/ 2 levels of paladin, geared toward a high will-save. However, i need help understanding how to defend against damaging magic that doesn't require a saving throw. Any insight you can offer would be great.

Resist Energy and Protection from Energy. As a 12 ranger, you'll be able to cast both (RE is rgr 1, PE is rgr 2).

Resist Energy works like DR (x/-) against an energy type; e.g. it subtracts its value from the damage. Protection from Energy absorbs up to its value in points of damage of that energy type. Where you have both resistance and protection, resistance applies first, then any left over damage is subtracted from the protection.

Also, watch for casting animations from enemy spell casters as you can dodge rays. Jumping like crazy as you run towards them helps.

Why are you not worried about magic that allows a save? Are you taking the spell resistance enhancement line?

[Solmage]

Why are you not worried about magic that allows a save? Are you taking the spell resistance enhancement line?

He's taking 2 levels of paladin. If he has a decent or good charisma, he's covered for any saves.

Once you have 9 levels of ranger and get evasion, you'll be golden. A scorching ray can still hit you, but resistance 30 really takes a huge chunk of it with you, since it applies individually to each ray.

A polar ray, with your refreshable protection from cold, should also not be much of an issue. You'll probably loose the entire protection from 1 ray, just refresh it. (I have all the protections hot keyed for such eventualities, it helps)

And the number one melee protection from no-save enemy spells? trip the casters

[Cowdenicus]

And the number one melee protection from no-save enemy spells? trip the casters

Truer words never spoken......

[transtemporal]

He's taking 2 levels of paladin. If he has a decent or good charisma, he's covered for any saves.

Ah, true words.

Good advice on the tripping too, I might have to employ that with my new ftr...

[Shade]

Don't be a weak elf drow..

SR they get is a joke compared to mobs caster levels - it will never help. Even the clerics 12+ lvl, so 26 at lvl14 gets bypassed a fair bit (worth asking for anyways)

Really just saves and buffs are how you resist magic. Drow get crappy saves - go Dwarf if you want a truely spell resistant character. They can get up to +5 saves versus all spells, Drow get a puny saves vs enchantments only - very small subset of spells.

Plus way way more hitpoints to stay alive with. +2 fort save just from the base con, with more from enhancements.. +2 vs poison spells, etc, etc ,etc. Elfs are for casters not melee.

For magic missles - beat the abbot and get the 14 minuit shield clicky. (I know easier said then done)

[Shein]

Well, i did ditch the drow in fact. I played that character to level 5, and while he did resist spells like mad, the melee skills were not up to the playstyle that i'm used to. I don't think it's possible for me to play anything but halfling in this game. The other races seem clunky and slow (especially the dwarf...) and have to be too close to objects to use them. This may just be a matter of perception, but that's been my experience.

I kept a similar build though, w/ 2 levels of pali & high charisma. I've been enjoying it. The only bummer about the build is that i'm forced to play lawful good, which i don't like. I like stability, and being able to use chaotic weapons... but oh well, i see no way around that.

[Riorik]

UMD will let you use Chaotic (True Chaos/Anarchic) weapons.

[Shein]

And the number one melee protection from no-save enemy spells? trip the casters

Well, i have to admit i never used this tactic... so i've been trying it on every caster since i read this post a few days ago. Unfortunetely I haven't found this to be very successful. I'd say the caster resist rate, even on kobolds below my level, is 80%+. I do play a base strength character so I'm not getting much in the way of bonuses to my trip skill, and there's no way (that i'm away of) to increase this skill.... so it looks like that already very low success rate is only going to decrease as mob levels increase. All-in-all, this isn't a very reliable defense... although I still do go for the trip every chance I get

[Drekisen]

If you get a shot of scorching ray coming at u, ur evasion will do nothing. It has no save. Only some form of resistance or protection will help with that. There are quite a few spells as well that have no save or spell resistance. Study up on the arcane and divine spells if u really wanna know. Those are the ones ur going to really wanna pay attention to. As far as damage spells that do have saves, once u have evasion and if you keep your dex high you will be able to walk thru stuff like lightning bolts most of the time.

[Arianrhod]

If you get a shot of scorching ray coming at u, ur evasion will do nothing. It has no save. Only some form of resistance or protection will help with that. There are quite a few spells as well that have no save or spell resistance. Study up on the arcane and divine spells if u really wanna know. Those are the ones ur going to really wanna pay attention to. As far as damage spells that do have saves, once u have evasion and if you keep your dex high you will be able to walk thru stuff like lightning bolts most of the time.

I think some of those no-save spells can be physically dodged, if you have the twitch skills. Just gotta master the art of moving laterally a lot & still hit what you're aiming at

[Drekisen]

I think some of those no-save spells can be physically dodged, if you have the twitch skills. Just gotta master the art of moving laterally a lot & still hit what you're aiming at

...and it's not to hard to do once you know your creature....the animations are a total give away to when they are going to cast most of the time. When I am playing a ranged character I am all over the place anyways...and tumble, tumble, tumble. Very good skill to learn, even if you have no tumble ranks.....moving around with that skill does not break attack progression.