Consider the Bard!

[Mad_Bombardier]

While I'd like to see neat specialty items for all classes, that is a lot of work for little benefit. For example, you could have a 'Pitch Pipe' trinket that gave another -10% to SP cost from Spellsinger Trance. But, I think it would be better as a more general item. Perhaps a 'Conch Shell' or 'Resonant Crystal' trinket granting Lingering Song I.

We're getting more items that grant feats (Precision bows, Mobile armor, Toughness helm). And in Mod5, we just started seeing items that granted Improved Metamagic enhancements (only 4 items). So, maybe items that grant enhancements are the wave of the future?

[Emili]

Dane. Which unique bard skills/abilities would you like to see enhanced, and how?

I think he's looking for items which scream bard... you know like a horn of blasting, or Valhala or drums of panic... or any of the bardic loot instruments (lyres, Pipes, lutes) on the DnD loot tables. Items which while potentially are useable by another class are far more effective in a bards hands. I tend to agree that my Rosewood would like a nicer instrument ... a fancier lute or a 1963 fender startocaster paired with a '68 marshall plexi. ;-)

[Aesop]

So...youwant a Raid Lute ?

/punt

I hate you

Aesop

[bellack]

Well that's cause, obviously, Bards are already too uber without any bard-specific items.

Yes Bards are rather Uber. At least mine and others I have travelled with are. That being said it would be noce to have Bard items in the game.

[Dane_McArdy]

I'll try and answer as many people as possible.

But first, it's been said that perform will become more valuable. I don't know if this means giving fascinate a check or something else. I wouldn't mind a check for it. Make perform worthwhile, and those items with + perform become more valuable.

But certainly, an item that increases the duration of our songs, would be great. On a weapon, trinket, mask.

Now, the combat bonus we give are pretty amazing, and come level 15, we will be giving an AC bonus, if things go right. So I do question the need to increase that. Right now, I think my bard gives a +7 to hit and +4/5 to damage.

Certainly items that are very bard in nature would be nice, like horns of blasting and such, but those would just be sound orinated clickies, wouldn't they? Nothing more then shout or sound burst, right?

The current enhancemenst for bards, do of course add great value to the class. I certainly know that many people really enjoy spelltrance for what it offers. And if it increases, like it looks like it will, that will indeed be very nice.

Mainly our songs are our unique abilities. So to answer MT, those are what I am thinking most. And here the balance must be considered carefully, because as some have pointed out bards are pretty uber on their own.

An item that gives the ability to fascinate the undead 1-3 times per rest (And only getting one charge back per rest) wouldn't be to over powerful in the high undead quests. Or like I've described, could add a +1 bonus to a save.

Example, +3 longsword of the nimble chant. When wielding this sword, a bards inspire greatness song provides a +1/2 bonus to a players reflex save. +3 light mace of the willful psalm. While weilding this mace, the bards inspire courage song provides a +1/2 bonus to will saves.

Hmmm. Might be to much, now that I am working out details. After all, does would it stack with greater heroism? Providing a potential +5/6 bonus to a save?

[Mad_Bombardier]

Mainly our songs are our unique abilities. So to answer MT, those are what I am thinking most. And here the balance must be considered carefully, because as some have pointed out bards are pretty uber on their own.

An item that gives the ability to fascinate the undead 1-3 times per rest (And only getting one charge back per rest) wouldn't be to over powerful in the high undead quests. Or like I've described, could add a +1 bonus to a save.

Example, +3 longsword of the nimble chant. When wielding this sword, a bards inspire greatness song provides a +1/2 bonus to a players reflex save. +3 light mace of the willful psalm. While weilding this mace, the bards inspire courage song provides a +1/2 bonus to will saves.

Hmmm. Might be to much, now that I am working out details. After all, does would it stack with greater heroism? Providing a potential +5/6 bonus to a save?

All good ideas. We have the very Bard-specific Gwylan's Blade, but it's ml:6 and we haven't seen anything comparable since.

[bellack]

While a nice spell, it still doesn't say BARD~!

What good are effects that improve abilities, when you don't have those abilites? There are effects that increase every type of magic school and damage type. Fire, cold, acid, you name it.

There are effects that increase all kinds of fighter abilities. Rogue, ranger and barbarian abilities. Cleric paladin, you name it. Every ability, there is an item that will increase it, give it, make it better.

Not for bards. Many of our class unique abilities are not touched in anyway.

Perhaps we are too uber. Though honestly, we tend to make others more uber then ourselves being too uber.

EVERY class wants to feel there is something meant for them. As you pointed out, there is that sword, but well, no one wants it.

I am always for class specific items. But as a Paladin I have traveled with a Cleric from 1st to 4th level and the Pally Cleric combo was great. Then the Cleric (a RL friend) decided that he wanted to use his Bard instead. Well I was not to keen on this switch but I said what the hell. And now at 8th level I have to say that the Bard over all was much better than the cleric. That started me playing a Bard in fact. So yes they are Uber, maybe too Uber.

[Zenako]

it is tough to make the uber more uber isn't it Dane.

We can already get Song of the Dead and Makers.

What we can't entrance are vermin and slimes, so some item that when worn/used would allow you to entrance those classes of mobs as well would be cool and clearly a Bard only item. Not sure how truely useful that would be, but it would be Bard only. Or perhaps a couple of items.

Helm of Jubilex for the slimes - +13 Perform, 3/rest can enhance fascinate to affect slimes and perhaps some other boost like Acid Resist (10 points).

Helm of the Arachnid - +13 Perform, 3/rest can enhance fascinate to affect spider and perhaps some other boost like Poison Resist.

[Raithe]

The Hammer of the Leaden Clouds is an excellent weapon for a strength-based bard. I can't imagine any other class making use of it as well as such a bard could.

[Borror0]

All good ideas. We have the very Bard-specific Gwylan's Blade, but it's ml:6 and we haven't seen anything comparable since.

Well, it's not even a Bard item... since Perfom does nothing at all. No need to improve it.

No Fascinate DC... no perform-based song length..

So, pretty much a junk named loot.

[Dane_McArdy]

The Hammer of the Leaden Clouds is an excellent weapon for a strength-based bard. I can't imagine any other class making use of it as well as such a bard could.

Accept, that I'm not sure that bards get Hammers as part of the weapons they are proficent in, which would require a feat just to use one weapon. I'll have to check.

[Borror0]

I'll try and answer as many people as possible.

But first, it's been said that perform will become more valuable. I don't know if this means giving fascinate a check or something else. I wouldn't mind a check for it. Make perform worthwhile, and those items with + perform become more valuable.

Perform score-based song length. According to Eladrin:

I'm currently also looking into ways of having a character's Perform skill have an effect on your songs - it's likely that that will somehow play into song durations, so there's no need to panic about fascinate durations yet.

[Mad_Bombardier]

Well, it's not even a Bard item... since Perfom does nothing at all. No need to improve it.

True, but if Perform did something, the stacking Perform bonus on Gwylan's Blade would be cool.

[Borror0]

Accept, that I'm not sure that bards get Hammers as part of the weapons they are proficent in, which would require a feat just to use one weapon. I'll have to check.

They don't.

Shortswords, shortbow, longswords, rapiers and simple weapons.

[Borror0]

True, but if Perform did something, the stacking Perform bonus on Gwylan's Blade would be cool.

Yeah, but I rather argue in a world of what if's.

I try to play the game the way it is now.

[GuitarHero]

Accept, that I'm not sure that bards get Hammers as part of the weapons they are proficent in, which would require a feat just to use one weapon. I'll have to check.

warchanters would, assuming multiclass, but my warchanter doesn't have any sonic spells, so i still wouldn't see much come of it. A cleric casts soundburst more often than i see bards casting it...

[Zenako]

Another whole line would be items that let song uses emulate certain spells.

Song of Haste Boots. Boots that enable the Bard to cast a Song of Haste which grants the same bonuses as a normal Haste, uses a song up, but like other songs, is not readily dispelled. Duration is fixed, something like 1 minute (Min level 10 for example). Click on the boots and you go into the Song Animation and cast a Song Haste effect (FLight of the Bumblebee). Most of the time, normal Spell Point Haste is better, but for example when fighting mobs like Beholders it would be very useful.

Song of Life Amulet - Creates a minor Death Ward Affect. Lasts 10 minutes, and absorbs first 5 points of Neg Energy Damage like the Silver Flame Amulet. Clicking on the Amulet triggers a song casting (Something with Organ pipes comes to mind) and uses up a song casting. Not as good as Death Ward, but cool none the less.

I am sure many more ideas are out there...

[Dane_McArdy]

warchanters would, assuming multiclass, but my warchanter doesn't have any sonic spells, so i still wouldn't see much come of it. A cleric casts soundburst more often than i see bards casting it...

Sound burst in on my spell slot, because on normal and hard, it's great for when you see a large group of stunnables running towards your party. Shout isn't as useful.

[RichD]

The Hammer of the Leaden Clouds is an excellent weapon for a strength-based bard. I can't imagine any other class making use of it as well as such a bard could.

This does look like another attempt at a bard-related item, but given there are only 2 sonic damage spells, one of which the damage is really incidental (Soundburst) and the other which is extremely underpowered (Shout), and the fact that pure bards won't be proficient with this weapon, it has limited appeal.

The types of effects that might be useful on bard-focussed items might include:

Extending song durations
Adding songs per rest (analogous to adding SP for casters)
Enhancing song effects (e.g., additional +1/+1 to Inspire Courage)
Instruments that give new songs with charges but require a minimum Perform skill to use (e.g., SlimeSong=OozePuppet, or maybe an area-effect Panic debuff) - maybe Perform skill would control the power of the effect (how many dice of slimes, or what negative to apply on the debuff)

COMMENT: Wow, hot topic, a lot of responses jumped in before mine so pardon any restatement

[Oghma]

I'm with Dane on this one.

Abilities specific to Bards are only affected by enhancements, and have no items that increase them. A wiz or sorc can get elemental criticals on enhancements and items, clerics can get healings crits likewise. No love for the minstrel!

PnP has instruments for bards as magic items, why not DDO?

Items could:

Add to the number of bard songs/rest

Increase duration of bard songs (like Lingering Song)

Increase the effect of bard songs - +'s to attack, damage, fear, HP's gained, duration or effect of suggestion or fascinate, increase the numbers affected or change the way in which they are affected, or add new effects (how about a melee alacrity song? or a pied piper song that keeps them fascinated but they follow the bard? or a fire shield song?)

One thing I like about the PnP items as that the powers granted by an instrument scale as the wielder's perform skill goes up. I would love to see perform become more important.

--K