You want more content? Make it your darn self...

[sirgog]

I'd like the idea, except for one thing - any truly memorable villians/NPCs you create (the Stormreaver, Black Abbot, Zawabi, etc) would technically permanently become a part of the Eberron world for all pen&paper campaigns if implemented in game.

[MysticTheurge]

I'd like the idea, except for one thing - any truly memorable villians/NPCs you create (the Stormreaver, Black Abbot, Zawabi, etc) would technically permanently become a part of the Eberron world for all pen&paper campaigns if implemented in game.

Well that's kind of debatable.

They've been pretty good about keeping Eberron Canon undiluted by at least sort of suggesting that a lot of interpretations in various mediums are "One Person's Eberron" rather than the official Eberron.

Kind of like when I run an Eberron campaign with my tabletop group, you don't have to include my stuff in your game of Eberron.

[binnsr]

Sorry Sane, but no QA on player made content is ripe with abuse. Kill a Kobold for 500k XP? Think loot is out of control now? Wait til a player can populate a chest! :P

I know the process for made content with NWN, have a few of my own up. NWN design model included end user created content, DDO does not.

*EDIT*

TY for your addition Cd!

It doesn't have to be all that ..
Have the XP automatically calculated based on size, number of mobs, etc. (not going to try to figure that out - that would be the dev teams job ) Alternatively, Turbines QA team that does XP assignment now could play-test it and assign XP values manually.

Regarding loot, if it's a lvl8 quest, then any chest in the quest would be automatically a lvl8 chest. By doing that, the loot is guaranteed to be the same as what you pull from any other lvl8 quest. It also negates the chance of a player adding unbalanced named items (like a ml12 +5 cold iron holy burst greataxe of pure good with a modified crit range) because the loot is auto-generated based on the level of the quest.


Meh.. the more I think on it, the more I sorta agree with you .. For this to really work, both of these, even automating both loot and XP would still require some sort of QA.. Mostly because my loot idea does not preclude a player from making a lvl15 dungeon that consists of slaughtering one CR3 kobold guarding 5 chests in a single room..

[cdbd3rd]

Well you obviously didn't read the whole post, or missed the part where I mention that players don't gain experience or loot from player created adventures. I'm sitting here, laughing my ass off reading people's complaints about legal issues and whatnot; there is nothing you people won't whine about.

Hmmm. I admit I did miss the small paragraph mentioning no XPs or items.
I think you would find an area that offered no benefits (XP or loot) would have a limited draw for folks. One visit to see it, then never return. I stand by the option I mentioned about having the area seperate from the regular servers.

As for the whining comment...

[Hvymetal]

Well you obviously didn't read the whole post, or missed the part where I mention that players don't gain experience or loot from player created adventures. I'm sitting here, laughing my ass off reading people's complaints about legal issues and whatnot; there is nothing you people won't whine about.

Yes cause legal issues are a whine and not a REAL reason......

[Aethene]

I'm not paying 15 a month to play some player made dungeon.

Besides, the have talked about why they don't do this.

That's right... i'm paying $15 a month to play the same old stuff i play every month

[Bombalo]

While I don't think that pure player created content would be the way to go I wouldn't mind seeing a monthly contest for a dungeon or two that turbine would develop into a later release.

[Hvymetal]

While I don't think that pure player created content would be the way to go I wouldn't mind seeing a monthly contest for a dungeon or two that turbine would develop into a later release.

This I could definatly get behind...

[oronisi]

Well I'm glad to see they take our feedback seriously >.< *Hands lightbulb back to Glasscannon* Guess we aren't going to need these...

I think they even responded to one of the previous times this was proposed. It's not that they don't like the idea, it's that it's not feasible. It supposedly would take more effort to weed through all the **** we would submit to Turbine, rebalance the overpowered loot and xp we coded in, QA the dungeon, look for bugs and secrets we snuck in, etc, than it would for them to make their own content.

[Hendrik]

I think they even responded to one of the previous times this was proposed. It's not that they don't like the idea, it's that it's not feasible. It supposedly would take more effort to weed through all the **** we would submit to Turbine, rebalance the overpowered loot and xp we coded in, QA the dungeon, look for bugs and secrets we snuck in, etc, than it would for them to make their own content.

But the real funny part about this 'suggestion' is that the OP want's no XP/Loot/QA for player made Quests.

So, what's the point?

Spend a **** load of time creating something that you won't be rewarded for running. All that time and effort for what? It's a waste of time to waste time. Shall we touch on potential bandwidth issues with all those people DL Quests from Turbine? Viruses from some dysfunctional child? Of course that would be labeled as 'whining' to look at a bigger picture....

Yea, sure, Ill spend hours in some player made chain quest, maybe loosing XP and cost of repairs/supplies, only to come out at the end with no XP, beyond debt, no loot to recover my expenses, and nothing to show for it beyond wasting some time.

Shortsighted to say the least.

I agree with you oronisi, player made content would detract from what Turbine does for us and thusly giving more fuel to the haters.

[Arianrhod]

Well, they could at least have an official location (email address, forum area, or whatnot) for people to submit ideas for new content (putting it all in the development forum tends to result in it getting lost amid bug complaints, suggestions for class improvements, etc.). A uniform format for submitting such ideas would make it easier for the devs to pick & choose what they'd like to add to the game.

[Hendrik]

Well, they could at least have an official location (email address, forum area, or whatnot) for people to submit ideas for new content (putting it all in the development forum tends to result in it getting lost amid bug complaints, suggestions for class improvements, etc.). A uniform format for submitting such ideas would make it easier for the devs to pick & choose what they'd like to add to the game.

Agreed!

A place where we can submit idea's/features we would like to see is a great idea. Keeping it on-topic would be the hard part!



This would be as close as we can get to end user content.

[Vorn]

MysticTheurge did some forum generated adventure concepts quite a while back. It was a whole campaign quest chain and was pretty fun to participate in. Perhaps even a contest worthy topic?

[neoanderthal]

That's right... i'm paying $15 a month to play the same old stuff i play every month

You do have a choice, after all. I don't know about you, but no turbine employee showed up at my apartment, and demanded that I hand them money and sign on every few days... :P

[oronisi]

But the real funny part about this 'suggestion' is that the OP want's no XP/Loot/QA for player made Quests.

So, what's the point?

Spend a **** load of time creating something that you won't be rewarded for running. All that time and effort for what? It's a waste of time to waste time. Shall we touch on potential bandwidth issues with all those people DL Quests from Turbine? Viruses from some dysfunctional child? Of course that would be labeled as 'whining' to look at a bigger picture....

Yea, sure, Ill spend hours in some player made chain quest, maybe loosing XP and cost of repairs/supplies, only to come out at the end with no XP, beyond debt, no loot to recover my expenses, and nothing to show for it beyond wasting some time.

Shortsighted to say the least.

I agree with you oronisi, player made content would detract from what Turbine does for us and thusly giving more fuel to the haters.

Actually, I don't agree with what I posted (paraphrasing what I think I remember the devs saying). The devs definitely have a problem coming up with quality quest ideas. It's like they are filling out mad libs and not even using different sheets, it's all the same:

You fight [insert monster here] in an effort to [save someone / get something / clean out the dungeon]. This quest will take place in an epic [long / very long quest length] [tileset (sewer1, sewer2, temple1, cave1, fire_cave, ice_cave)]. To reach your goals, you will need to collect [1, 2, 3, or 4] keys, or destroy [1, 2,3, or 4] sub-bosses.

In the very least, I think the DDO devs could take player-made IDEAS and build dungeons around them. Ideas can't contain exploits, unbalancing items, glitches, or secrets. But they could improve the quality and diversity of what we have to play with.

[neoanderthal]

Actually, I don't agree with what I posted (paraphrasing what I think I remember the devs saying). The devs definitely have a problem coming up with quality quest ideas. It's like they are filling out mad libs and not even using different sheets, it's all the same:

You fight [insert monster here] in an effort to [save someone / get something / clean out the dungeon]. This quest will take place in an epic [long / very long quest length] [tileset (sewer1, sewer2, temple1, cave1, fire_cave, ice_cave)]. To reach your goals, you will need to collect [1, 2, 3, or 4] keys, or destroy [1, 2,3, or 4] sub-bosses.

In the very least, I think the DDO devs could take player-made IDEAS and build dungeons around them. Ideas can't contain exploits, unbalancing items, glitches, or secrets. But they could improve the quality and diversity of what we have to play with.

Now that would be cool - maybe run a contest ( like the community guide books ) every month, and select one or two ideas per month to implement as new content. That would be cool!

[Hendrik]

Actually, I don't agree with what I posted (paraphrasing what I think I remember the devs saying). The devs definitely have a problem coming up with quality quest ideas. It's like they are filling out mad libs and not even using different sheets, it's all the same:

You fight [insert monster here] in an effort to [save someone / get something / clean out the dungeon]. This quest will take place in an epic [long / very long quest length] [tileset (sewer1, sewer2, temple1, cave1, fire_cave, ice_cave)]. To reach your goals, you will need to collect [1, 2, 3, or 4] keys, or destroy [1, 2,3, or 4] sub-bosses.

In the very least, I think the DDO devs could take player-made IDEAS and build dungeons around them. Ideas can't contain exploits, unbalancing items, glitches, or secrets. But they could improve the quality and diversity of what we have to play with.

Every MMORPG, not just DDO, suffers from this problem in Quest design from my experience.

Never hear or read me saying otherwise: Player input on design, at any level, is a good thing. The player base here is extremely resourceful and a fountain of ideas - good or bad. A resource that should be utilized.

Really think the quality of quests we have is not that good? Trying to understand, why I ask. See, I think the quality of quests we have (design, layout, atmosphere, etc.) is rather high - again, compared to my past experiences.

As far as diversity, like choices, well, more is good!

[Hendrik]

Now that would be cool - maybe run a contest ( like the community guide books ) every month, and select one or two ideas per month to implement as new content. That would be cool!

Have that person 'work' with the DEV's, under a NDA.

Now this would be something and big boost to the community!!!

Heck, if not for a whole Quest, this would still be a great if they could design a room, a big fight, a trap. Some direct community involvement in shaping our game!

Maybe allow them to a story, kind of like a behind the scenes thing. Let a player tell the players what he/she experienced.

/brainstorm

[ccheath776]

I have a most wonderful idea I have to share! After reading countless posts of players making demands of the devs for an uncountable number of different things (mostly new content), and seeing that Turbine is without a Lead Content Designer for DDO (or whatever that post actually implies), a lightbulb went off.

The big thing in game development right now seems to be player created content, and why shouldn't it be? Less work for devs, a near limitless supply of content for players, and a new way for both players and developers to interact and foster a strong community. But in an MMO? Oh yes! Ryzom Ring was an expansion to Ryzom last year that allowed players to create instanced "adventures" they could invite people into. Given the design of DDO and its use of instanced "dungeons", I can't think of anything more perfect!

What I envision:
Give us, the players, your toolset. Modify it, tweak it, dumb-it-down and hand it over! Give me the ability to create my own dungeon, to set deadly traps around every corner, to create mind-wrenching puzzles that confuse those who dare enter, to script the spawn of 12 firey dragons just as the players begin to rush for the exit after a gruesome battle! Let me create a series of modules and form a campaign for my guildmates to venture through as my story unfolds for them. Let me build a shady tavern off a muddy road where I can roleplay with my friends and tell stories of my past adventures and conquests And oh how I've dreamt of writing that beautiful golden DM text myself ^.^

What I propose:
Create a modified version of your in-house toolset, that will give us DMs (yes, we can have them even in DDO!) at least some basic functionality. Let us use the resources you've already created (terrain textures, monsters, tilesets, various placeables etc.), and let us use new resources as you release them with new content. The technical complications of allowing fully user created content (i.e. textures and models and such as is done in NWN) could be forgone by limiting resources to those Turbine created (basically, we can only build adventures with the resources you give us).
I'm trying to abstract the idea from implementation because I don't really feel its my place to tell you how anything should be done, and am just using a concept that could possibly work from this player's perspective.
In a big public area accessible by everyone like the harbor or market even, have one of those quest portal door thingies (yes, that's the technical term) that links to player created adventures. Instead of the normal mode selection window, have a window that shows all the currently running adventures and who "owns" them. If I see the module my friend created I could click "ask for invite" and it would alert the owner I would like to enter, and he/she can accept or reject (kinda like inviting someone to your group but in reverse). My client would then download the necessary files and would join the game when its finished. Once the group is all together we all set off on our merry way burning and looting things as we go, just like any other adventure. There could be a "meeting room" of sorts that you enter before the actual module where players could gather pre-game and chat, prepare spells, and wait for the download to finish, then all enter together.
Because all of this would be user created content and, for the most part, uncontrolled by Turbine, unlike regular quests, players don't gain experience or get to keep any loot they find, but they could earn something else instead. For example rather then making all toolset resources available immediately, players could earn access to use new resources by building and playing in user created adventures. Or have characters level separately when in the user created adventure dimension, so-to-speak. Regardless, there are some very cool possibilities.

User created content would bring so much to DDO. Amazing press, more subscribers, and a butload of good times! Who's with me on this? Dungeons and Dragons has always been about roleplaying and running off on some grand adventure that a buddy crafted to test your wit. Let us have it!

(My apologies if I ramble and trail in my post, I'm extremely exhausted and hardly conscious :P )

i am already in the process of making this.
I am getting into game design myself. Watch the forums in the next few days for more details. I think you will be quite thrilled.

[Raithe]

The best way to have player-created content would be to include the functionality within the game itself, not in an outside development kit. Add areas designed specifically with player contributions in mind, and add game mechanics that allow a subscribing player to populate several different pre-made dungeons or castles with already balanced encounters of different types. Sort of like MMO housing, but for the mobs...