what to do when the cap goes up...

[tc12]

So my Dwarf is just about to 14th now, should be capped just about when the cap goes up. He'll be Fighter12/Ranger2, and I'm wondering where to go from there. Not sure if there's much reason to go past 12 Fighter levels. I already have feats I don't really use. (Dabbled in tactics but didn't spend much on supporting enhancements so my stun & trip aren't good enough that I try them much.)

My stats are about like this, might be off just slightly here or there but basically STR 30, DEX 22, CON 20, INT 14, WIS 8, CHA 6. INT was for CE, which I use when I go with a shield and DWA. I also have Power Attack when I go with a Greataxe. Which I use depends on party make-up and opponent. I think the balance between the two is the strength of the build: I can be the DPS guy if there's no barb in the party, and while not an intimitank can get the initial agro and take a pounding while still dealing decent damage in defensive mode. (Couldn't quite pull off the trifecta with solid tactics too, but haven't given up yet as a few more enh points might do it.)

So where does a hybrid build to go from here? I don't see myself re-specing ever to 2WF, so more ranger levels would only get me another FA pretty and then not until the cap goes to 18, not 16. More Fighter levels are an option of course, but there's certainly no feat I feel like I'm dying for even now at 13th level. (Sure I'll get greater weapon spec at 14th, but will I even notice 2 more damage points? I'll take it, but ... really not that significant)

That leaves me wondering if a third class makes sense. Barbs base movement increase is always nice, and rage could go well when I'm going with 2H and PA I guess, but how much better is the barb rage than a stack of pots if you're only going a couple levels deep in the build? Well conceivably 6 possible at 20th, but for several months only 2 deep at 16th.

Paladin might make sense for one level, but with my low CHA I'm not sure if more ever would. It would barely address what my biggest weakness right now is: my will save. My low WIS hurts a bit more than I hoped it would: even with a +4 Resist item, Dw Spell Def III and Iron Will I still get Commanded and such more than I'd like. But this is also largely that I'm also not wearing any WIS item right now either. If I really decided the save was worth freeing up a slot for, I could wear a +5 WIS item and eat a tome to get 3 more to my Will. At 14th I could still be over 300 HP if I swapped a GFL or CON item slot to do so.

To close I still like what the 2 ranger levels gave me versus just going 14 Fighter, the wand use alone paid for itself. FA Giants is cool for any melee Dwarf too, even if more for flavor than true build need. But I'm just opening this up for suggestions as I know a lot of build-masters out there have been thinking about those next two levels too. So fire away with what you think is best for this build and why. Thanks!

TC

[ArkoHighStar]

I would wait till we have a better picture of what the new levels are going to contain before making any decisions. Not so much for the fact that you will be able to take advantage of them, because you won't ,but you will be able to plan out to level 18 if you decide to go fighter for your next 2 levels. If you decide to increase ranger levels or pick a third class the best you will be able to get is lvl 17 fighter and 3 levels of something else.

[binnsr]

If you stick with pure fighter, dodge->mobility->spring attack->whirlwind isn't a bad combo, and neither is adding cleave->great cleave to your Power Attack.

Since Cleave, Great Cleave and Whirlwind are all on separate timers, they are great tools to use for gathering aggro, as well as just plain damage dealing.

My 12ftr/2brb is fairly similar to yours, except instead of tactics feats, I went the whirlwind route and will pick up Cleave and Great Cleave when the cap goes up. He intimidates, then when the timer is at about half-way to clearing, he'll nail all those intimidated mobs with whirlwind to pick (most of) them up. Then, once the timer is clear, he repeats the intimidate. (for the record, my playstyle doesn't fit the intimiturtle role .. I intimidate and then attack)

Back to whether to MC further or not ..
I'd say there's no reason for you to take any more ranger levels - you already figured that one out..

For Paladin Levels, your charisma stands in the way of taking anything beyond paladin 1, which to me, seems like a waste of the MultiClass. if you had a decent charisma, I'd recommend taking the next 3 levels as paladin for the enhancements.

2 Barbarian levels are pretty nice for a mixed DPS/defensive fighter like yourself. I really enjoy the +10% movement and the rages (took extra and extend rage) are nice for end-boss fights. Plus, rage pots and madstone rage both stack with barbarian rage, for a total of +8str and +10 con.

[Emili]

I've kept my fighters pure, in fact most my characters are... only because the devs once mentioned epic levels, Remains to be seen should this game last into epic levels but wanted to assure myself of attaining full epic feat chains from the epic bonus feats. This coming cap increase poises uncertainty with me as am not quite sure I'd have a rude awakening should the game be tossed out at lvl 18 or 20. I've thought of splashing them a few times now but always comes back to weather or not I want to take evasion or divine grace and give up something at the end of one of the epic chains which some of require so harsh pre-reqs.

Armor Skin, Combat Archery, Damage Reduction, Devastating Critical, Dire Charge, Distant Shot, Epic Endurance, Epic Leadership, Epic Prowess, Energy Resistance, Epic Toughness, Epic Weapon Focus, Epic Weapon Specialization, Exceptional Deflection, Improved Combat Reflexes, Improved Manyshot, Improved Stunning Fist, Improved Whirlwind Attack, Infinite Deflection, Instant Reload, Legendary Commander, Legendary Rider, Legendary Wrestler, Overwhelming Critical, Penetrate Damage Reduction, Perfect Two-Weapon Fighting, Reflect Arrows, Spellcasting Harrier, Storm of Throws, Superior Initiative, Swarm of Arrows, Two-Weapon Rend, Uncanny Accuracy.

[binnsr]

I've kept my fighters pure, in fact most my characters are...

I'm the exact opposite ..
12/2 ftr/brb (planned 18/2) - balanced intimitank
10/2/2 rog/ftr/pal (planned 14/4/2 for superior TWF)
10/2/2 src/pal/rog (currently 6/2/2 - planned 16/2/2)
12/2 pal/rog (planned 12/6ftr/2)
11/2/1 pal/rog/ftr (currently 8/2/0 - planned 11/2/7 if I keep him)
13/1 brd/ftr (currently 1/1 lol - rolled her yesterday - planned 19/1)
13/1 sor/clr (currently 4/0 - planned 19/1) - nothing says loving like the sorcerer with 15+ DVs
14 Clr (planned 20)
9/3/2 ftr/pal/rog evasive WF intimitank (currently 3/3/0 - planned 15/3/2)
In the last month, I've deleted a 5th lvl barb/rgr, a 6th lvl arcane trixter, and a 7th lvl rgr/ftr

So yeah .. I'm pretty firmly in the multi-class camp I plan for 20 based on SRD abilities and will make whatever enhancements come along work for me, although with most of my characters, I'll be able to do a solid plan out to 20 once mod6 arrives because they're all 4-6 levels deep and I'll know exactly what enhancements will work for them at lvl20.

[Emili]

I'm the exact opposite ..
12/2 ftr/brb (planned 18/2) - balanced intimitank
10/2/2 rog/ftr/pal (planned 14/4/2 for superior TWF)
10/2/2 src/pal/rog (currently 6/2/2 - planned 16/2/2)
12/2 pal/rog (planned 12/6ftr/2)
11/2/1 pal/rog/ftr (currently 8/2/0 - planned 11/2/7 if I keep him)
13/1 brd/ftr (currently 1/1 lol - rolled her yesterday - planned 19/1)
13/1 sor/clr (currently 4/0 - planned 19/1) - nothing says loving like the sorcerer with 15+ DVs
14 Clr (planned 20)
9/3/2 ftr/pal/rog evasive WF intimitank (currently 3/3/0 - planned 15/3/2)
In the last month, I've deleted a 5th lvl barb/rgr, a 6th lvl arcane trixter, and a 7th lvl rgr/ftr

So yeah .. I'm pretty firmly in the multi-class camp I plan for 20 based on SRD abilities and will make whatever enhancements come along work for me, although with most of my characters, I'll be able to do a solid plan out to 20 once mod6 arrives because they're all 4-6 levels deep and I'll know exactly what enhancements will work for them at lvl20.

What I am saying is I planned past 20.. so as to complete epic feat chains (is why they're pure) should the game go as far as the devs claimed in the past. Only thing is I feeling now the devs may never breach 20.

[Stravkos]

Paladin may be an option if you're really concerned about your will saves. Take 2 levels of Paladin and the Force of Personality feat. With 6 charisma, you'd get:

6(base)+6(Item)+1(tome)+1(Paladin Enhancement)=14 for a +2 mod. Force of Personality would give you another +2 to your will saves for a total of +2/+2/+4 to your saves. Or +3/+3/+6 if you managed a +3 tome. You would give up any new fighter enhancements as well as a feat, but if none of the current feats interested you, and if the new fighter enhancements aren't must haves it would give a nice boost to your will save. Just remember that you have to be Lawful Good to take Paladin.

[sigtrent]

What I am saying is I planned past 20.. so as to complete epic feat chains (is why they're pure) should the game go as far as the devs claimed in the past. Only thing is I feeling now the devs may never breach 20.

FYI: The new D&D 4th ed goes to level 30. Since DDO already has many elements we expect to see in 4th ed I wouldn't be suprised at all if instead of "epic" levels they just roll on into levels 21-30. I'm sure there would be more advanced enhancements and the like, but I doubt we'd see epic as its implimented currently in D&D. Just my prediction mind you.

[Borror0]

FYI: The new D&D 4th ed goes to level 30. Since DDO already has many elements we expect to see in 4th ed I wouldn't be suprised at all if instead of "epic" levels they just roll on into levels 21-30. I'm sure there would be more advanced enhancements and the like, but I doubt we'd see epic as its implimented currently in D&D. Just my prediction mind you.

Even if it is not how I thought it would have been, what you're saying does make sense. I guess it's more a mattter on when we'll hit level 20...