Precision & Barbarian Rage Bug?

[gwu]

Anyone else found Precision to turn off when Raging?

Is that deliberate? Is it suppose to work like that, especially since Power Attack is a similar mechanic but it doesn't turn off when Raging?

[tihocan]

I'm not sure, it could be intended and make sense too (not sure if precision is an official feat, but for instance per PnP rules you cannot use Combat expertise while raging).
I would be curious to know why you want this though. A raging barbarian usually have little trouble hitting stuff. Unless you're a funny dex based build?

[rpasell]

I'm not sure, it could be intended and make sense too (not sure if precision is an official feat, but for instance per PnP rules you cannot use Combat expertise while raging).
I would be curious to know why you want this though. A raging barbarian usually have little trouble hitting stuff. Unless you're a funny dex based build?

Precision is an "official" feat. I know of many dex based barbarians using weapon finesse, and dual wielding. I have a 11/3 Ranger barb, but I don't know if precision works when raging, as I don't have the feat on that character.

[Shade]

Guess it's like combat expertise and considered a smart-person only ability, so when you rage and forget all intelligence based things it gets flung out the window where it belongs

[gwu]

I'm not sure, it could be intended and make sense too (not sure if precision is an official feat, but for instance per PnP rules you cannot use Combat expertise while raging).
I would be curious to know why you want this though. A raging barbarian usually have little trouble hitting stuff. Unless you're a funny dex based build?

Funny dex build: Barbarian based archer.

It seems odd that with more strength the character is unable to have a steady hand.

Unlike combat expertise that requires one to think it seems that being able to shoot accurately would not be effected by going berserk and being 'in the zone/in your element'.

Submitted a bug either way... There is no text to indicate that the stance should auto disable when raging.

[Soul-Shaker]

Its because of logic behind the stances. CE uses the mind to concentrate on defense over tohit. Precision concentrates on just landing a hit based on flexable timing and accuracy and not caring how if it does much dmg. Power attack uses no concentration but runs wild focusing on swinging as hard as possible even if you cant swing at where you planned to. Rage from a barbarian makes it so you cant really concentrate on tasks, so it turns off your concentrating stances.

I dont really think its a bug, and it makes sense that precision should turn off in rage. If it still doesnt make sense lets try darts for a example. If you just go up and threw without really looking or spending time to look at the board or position of body(similar to rager) your not likely to hit the target as someone who goes for precision by staying calm, relaxed, and focuses on target.

[gwu]

Its because of logic behind the stances. CE uses the mind to concentrate on defense over tohit. Precision concentrates on just landing a hit based on flexable timing and accuracy and not caring how if it does much dmg. Power attack uses no concentration but runs wild focusing on swinging as hard as possible even if you cant swing at where you planned to. Rage from a barbarian makes it so you cant really concentrate on tasks, so it turns off your concentrating stances.

I dont really think its a bug, and it makes sense that precision should turn off in rage. If it still doesnt make sense lets try darts for a example. If you just go up and threw without really looking or spending time to look at the board or position of body(similar to rager) your not likely to hit the target as someone who goes for precision by staying calm, relaxed, and focuses on target.

I understand that view and it is contradicted by martial arts for example. As a trained and an effective fighters become hot blooded and engages in a battle they are able to use their "rage" to channel their strikes onto targets and achieve their goals. In fact they almost relax into the fury of the fight and excel with the build up of conflict, there is a sense of clarity and almost foresight (people involved in accidents report time almost slowing down, another example of intense moments providing clarity).

I'd love to get a developer's/designer's perspective on this, and have some action taken to resolve it or have text added to respective feats clarifying the situation.

[bigj1608]

Funny dex build: Barbarian based archer.

It seems odd that with more strength the character is unable to have a steady hand.

<BLAH>

"It seems odd that you can swing your greataxe at an elite kobold warrior at level 2 and hit him three times (very clearly) and he not split in half or lose an arm."

[Fallout]

I understand that view and it is contradicted by martial arts for example. As a trained and an effective fighters

Thats a fighter. Barbarians are different.

[tihocan]

Precision is an "official" feat.

Is there anything about raging described in this official documentation then? It's not in the SRD so must be in some other D&D material...

[Emili]

Funny dex build: Barbarian based archer.

It seems odd that with more strength the character is unable to have a steady hand.

Unlike combat expertise that requires one to think it seems that being able to shoot accurately would not be effected by going berserk and being 'in the zone/in your element'.

Submitted a bug either way... There is no text to indicate that the stance should auto disable when raging.

Rage - Going Berzerk - is an out of element thing not in element... It is an unruley mob of Vikings waving axes and sword recklessly. but with all the might they have... Rage is not "in the element" it is uncontrolled inaccuarcy yet mighty all the same. It is not the coach pshyicing up the local HS sports team. It is a lust for blood and pilagaing. When I think of a barbarian I think of early saxons, picts and other tribes ... not the trained soldier of a rome, nor the feudal vassel or knight who trained with thier weapons eight hours a day. precision is a concentrated aim.

[gwu]

By "in the element" i mean .. surely if you get blood lust, after years of it you'd get used to it and it would become natural and with that comes control. Unless every time you experience rage, it is your first time ever.

Now, for GM response... Apparently Precision SHOULD turn off when raging because... it is an activated feat and since only one activated feat is allowed to be turned one at any one time, rage (which is also an activated feat) replaces Precision.

SO (you'll love this) Power Attack is working incorrectly! Power attack SHOULD turn off when you rage... power attack is bugged (according to in game GMs). So who's going to be the first person to log a bug report for that?

*EDIT* Time to post in development forum to get descriptions or mechanic updated!

[maddong]

Is this still the case?
Does this apply to raging from adrenaline with FOTW?