Enemy Clerics, Give them mana limits, concetration check or less casting speed.

[TwoHeals]

Quicken spell: While this metamagic feat is active, spells cast twice as fast and cannot be interrupted by enemy attacks, but they consume 10 additional spell points.

So you don’t even need a high concentration check to cast.

No, I wish they made they made the game harder, that would be awesome to see cleric be able to cast comet fall in a flash. I’d like to see enemy casters do what we do to them. Like cast a couple stone to flesh spells on our casters and clerics, chain cast damage spell on tanks. I really wish we could have enemy human controlled characters but then everyone would whine that they couldn’t beat quests lol

I’m hoping as the level cap goes up quests on elite will be more challenging, already with the new content I know several people who have beat all the new mod 5 quest including the raid on elite a couple of times.

[Jomee]

No, I wish they made they made the game harder, that would be awesome to see cleric be able to cast comet fall in a flash. I’d like to see enemy casters do what we do to them. Like cast a couple stone to flesh spells on our casters and clerics, chain cast damage spell on tanks. I really wish we could have enemy human controlled characters but then everyone would whine that they couldn’t beat quests lol

I’m hoping as the level cap goes up quests on elite will be more challenging, already with the new content I know several people who have beat all the new mod 5 quest including the raid on elite a couple of times.

It's funny the people who cry about the game being too easy are the one who have all +6 everything, all named items, heavy whatever,greater all that, and a bio that says willing to trade all this +6 stuff im not using.

[Dane_McArdy]

NPC casters actually have artifical longer times between casts on a lot of spells. They can't spam certain spells right after it's cool down.

So the only advantage they have is unlimited mana, but just as you wouldn't use all your mana in one fight, I hope, I doubt they would either.

[Borror0]

NPC casters actually have artifical longer times between casts on a lot of spells. They can't spam certain spells right after it's cool down.

According to Eladrin, they have equal or longer cooldown on certain spell (that dman annoying Obscuring Mist comes to mind, god I hate that spell).

I'm too lazy to find my speak and Say, but you get the idea. they can and do spam-cast certain spell. VoN 3 Elite clerics and Flame Strike?

So the only advantage they have is unlimited mana, but just as you wouldn't use all your mana in one fight, I hope, I doubt they would either.

You could exhaust their mana if you want. I'd try, and I'd be able to. Against the Abbot, I'd certainly try it!!

[Dane_McArdy]

According to Eladrin, they have equal or longer cooldown on certain spell (that dman annoying Obscuring Mist comes to mind, god I hate that spell).

I'm too lazy to find my speak and Say, but you get the idea. they can and do spam-cast certain spell. VoN 3 Elite clerics and Flame Strike?

They seem faster, because they are not limited by human reactions like we are. So when the timer is up, the next spell is being cast. But they actually tweaked it a bit they said.

You could exhaust their mana if you want. I'd try, and I'd be able to. Against the Abbot, I'd certainly try it!!

And that's all people would do, find a way to exhaust an NPC's mana and then trash it.

You've answered your own question.

[Yaga_Nub]

......
And that's all people would do, find a way to exhaust an NPC's mana and then trash it.

You've answered your own question.

The problem there is that waiting out the mana usage is a VALID tactic. Now if the big bad caster isn't smart enough to know he needs some additional support besides his spells that not my problem but I would expect a caster to be supports by warriors and summoned pets. So sure you can wait out his mana but then how are you going to get past the 3 CR 22 death knights and demon that the necromancer just summoned with his last bit of mana?

[Dane_McArdy]

The problem there is that waiting out the mana usage is a VALID tactic. Now if the big bad caster isn't smart enough to know he needs some additional support besides his spells that not my problem but I would expect a caster to be supports by warriors and summoned pets. So sure you can wait out his mana but then how are you going to get past the 3 CR 22 death knights and demon that the necromancer just summoned with his last bit of mana?

It's a valid tactic in paper, where you have two thinking people (I hope).

It's not a valid tactic when you are against a computer and can cause it to waste all it's mana, with no danger to you, and then go chop it down.

Because that's what people would do, find a way to get the casters to harmlessly spam spells that are not having any effect.

[Spectralist]

You could exhaust their mana if you want. I'd try, and I'd be able to. Against the Abbot, I'd certainly try it!!

Ugh, now that's a good reason to leave their infinite spell points. The last thing i need are more tactics that make a 15 minute quest into a 75 minute quest. Like invaders back when everyone was enlarged cloudkilling everything.

So the only advantage they have is unlimited mana

And no concentration checks, and improved mobile spellcasting. That's the one that bothers me most, chasing an enemy caster, as he hits himself with heal without even slowing down. Made all the worse by the fact that it's nearly impossible to so much as get a die roll when using melee attacks on an enemy that's running in a straight line away from you.

[Borror0]

Ugh, now that's a good reason to leave their infinite spell points. The last thing i need are more tactics that make a 15 minute quest into a 75 minute quest. Like invaders back when everyone was enlarged cloudkilling everything.

A lv 2 Kobold would run out of mana pretty quick... more since he throws Lightning bolt at you if you have some cover. Could always help those 'near party wipe" moments. Not telling you it would become common with me, just telling you it could have some use, mostly at low levels.

And versus the Abbot, if it does the difference between a "wait a while and run out of mana" and "drink XX Mnemonic Enhancers" raid, I'm alll for it.

[MysticTheurge]

Ugh, now that's a good reason to leave their infinite spell points. The last thing i need are more tactics that make a 15 minute quest into a 75 minute quest. Like invaders back when everyone was enlarged cloudkilling everything.

Spellcasters AI has seen some significant improvements lately. They don't just stand around casting spells at walls any more, so that problem is at least partly solved.

And no concentration checks, and improved mobile spellcasting.

Yeah, these two are the ones that annoy me. And before anyone says "Oh they have quicken" I'll go ahead and counter with "Metamagics, which are limited by costing extra SP, are flat-out cheating when you have unlimited SP."

[Dane_McArdy]

Spellcasters AI has seen some significant improvements lately. They don't just stand around casting spells at walls any more, so that problem is at least partly solved.



Yeah, these two are the ones that annoy me. And before anyone says "Oh they have quicken" I'll go ahead and counter with "Metamagics, which are limited by costing extra SP, are flat-out cheating when you have unlimited SP."

No, they actually would give them sorcerer cool down timers. Which is "cheating" as well I guess. The thing is, I've always found the monsters even in paper to be on the cheaty side.

[MysticTheurge]

The thing is, I've always found the monsters even in paper to be on the cheaty side.

Yeah, but there's a level of cheaty that people will accept and what we're trying to say to the devs is that this one, this sticking point that keeps coming up, is beyond that level.

No one minds (any more) that they've got a billion hit points. Most people are even ok that their to-hit, saves and AC numbers are mostly made up without too much logical reasoning behind them.

But the fact that you can't interrupt enemy spells according to the rules and the fact that they slide all over the place no matter what they're doing, those are two things that lots of people are unwilling to accept as just normal cheaty-ness.

[Jermacide]

No, I wish they made they made the game harder, that would be awesome to see cleric be able to cast comet fall in a flash. I’d like to see enemy casters do what we do to them. Like cast a couple stone to flesh spells on our casters and clerics, chain cast damage spell on tanks. I really wish we could have enemy human controlled characters but then everyone would whine that they couldn’t beat quests lol

How awesome would it be for a dev/mod whatever to replace the AI on some hard quests end boss every once in a while. Would really add to the challenge.