Enemy Clerics, Give them mana limits, concetration check or less casting speed.

[Jomee]

They cast as fast as a sorceror, have unlimited mana and no checks of anykind, even laying dead on the floor they get that last flamestrike off.

A level six quest on elite an 1 cleric wipes a full group of 6-8's. Flamestrike,heal,Flamestrike,heal,Flamestrike,heal ,Flamestrike,heal,Flamestrike,heal,Flamestrike,hea l,Flamestrike,heal,Flamestrike,heal,Flamestrike,he al,Flamestrike,heal,Flamestrike,heal,Flamestrike,h eal,Flamestrike,heal,Flamestrike,heal,Flamestrike, heal,Flamestrike,heal,Flamestrike,heal,Flamestrike ,heal,Flamestrike,heal,Flamestrike,heal,Flamestrik e,heal,Flamestrike,heal,Flamestrike,heal,Flamestri ke,heal,Flamestrike,heal,Flamestrike,heal,Flamestr ike,heal,Flamestrike,heal,Flamestrike,heal,Flamest rike,heal,Flamestrike,heal,Flamestrike,heal,Flames trike,heal,Flamestrike,heal,Flamestrike,heal,Flame strike,heal,Flamestrike,heal,Flamestrike,heal. Oh i forgot blackwolf trips,Flamestrike,heal,tripFlamestrike,heal!

[Spectralist]

I agree. They should also not all have improved mobile spellcasting.

[unionyes]

I agree with the OP. At the very least, there should be a couple dozen Greater Mnemonic Enhancement pots in the chest, how else could they concievable be getting all that manna back?

[oronisi]

They do, in fact, have to make concentration checks. They just put alot of points into the skill.

[Kerr]

I'm pretty sure they have mana limits as well. Just look at the Efreeti summoned pet. He has a mana pool that as he casts is used up. When it's gone he stops casting and goes to melee. While he's meleeing, however, his mana pool regenerates.

It may look like they have a unlimited mana, but they only have a limited pool that regenerates at a set speed.

[Mad_Bombardier]

no checks of anykind

This part is not true. If you hit a mob for a large amount of damage (20-25% of his health) in one hit, it will automatically lose whatever action it was taking.

Edit: search for posts by Eladrin for Dev confirmation of this fact.

[GeneralDiomedes]

I disagree, simple as that. Most enemy casters in this game are a joke. They cast too slow, they run around too much without casting, they cast too many buffs on themselves as you are attacking them, they make too many melee attacks, they cast things you are immune to, they are entirely predictable.

Unlimited mana is a moot point and would invite silly mana draining strategies. Concentration checks would also make things too easy (just run them through a firewall). And in my experience they don't cast as fast as a Sorcerer .. they cast slow enough that I can watch the caster animation and dodge any flamestrike they try and cast on me with 25%+ striding.

It's Elite. I'm glad your party wiped. Why is when the game actually beats you .. your first response is to demand that the game be made easier?

[Jomee]

I disagree, simple as that. Most enemy casters in this game are a joke. They cast too slow, they run around too much without casting, they cast too many buffs on themselves as you are attacking them, they make too many melee attacks, they cast things you are immune to, they are entirely predictable.

Unlimited mana is a moot point and would invite silly mana draining strategies. Concentration checks would also make things too easy (just run them through a firewall). And in my experience they don't cast as fast as a Sorcerer .. they cast slow enough that I can watch the caster animation and dodge any flamestrike they try and cast on me with 25%+ striding.

It's Elite. I'm glad your party wiped. Why is when the game actually beats you .. your first response is to demand that the game be made easier?

Did i say casters? No i said cleric... spam heals and a cr12 for a lvl6 quest. They dont run around. They just spam heals and flamestrikes. Did i say make it easier? NOPE didnt read again did you. Give them con checks or give them actual mana limits. OH 25% striding, hmm well i see my level 6 toon has a set in the bank, Doh let me put them on. Yeah its so easy now, thanks for the advice.

[Impaqt]

This part is not true. If you hit a mob for a large amount of damage (20-25% of his health) in one hit, it will automatically lose whatever action it was taking.

Edit: search for posts by Eladrin for Dev confirmation of this fact.

SO your saying the StormReaver has a 4000 COncentration Check?

I always just assumed they all had Quicked Spell as well.

[Aspenor]

I disagree. Please make elite casters able to pwn us.

[Borror0]

I disagree. Please make elite casters able to pwn us.

Guess Asp doesn't want to be nerfed, huh?

[Blazer]

This has been a concern for some people since release. I used to be in the same camp as the OP, but have changed my POV 180 degrees. Basically, it all comes down to the scaled up nature of DDO. Think about how much your average fighter-type does for damage at lvl 6-8ish. Now your average rogue (including sneak attack). Now your average sorc or wiz. And so on through the classes.

The concentration scores these enemy clerics (and other casters) would need to have to not make them trivial encounters would be very high; high enough that people would then just complain about how high their concentration scores were instead of how they seem to have no concentration check. The enemy clerics and casters need to get these spells off, otherwise there is no point to having them in there.

Another quasi-fact about DDO is that elite is never just 2 levels above the dungeon, it's typically more, sometimes as much as 4. Scaling of dungeons for difficulty levels doesn't seem to be linear; exponential or geometric, perhaps, but not linear. So your level 6 quest is really like a level 10ish quest, which you are trying while your character is level 6.

Next time you attempt a quest like this, try some different tactics. Have the high STR melee try and trip the clerics. Have the wiz/sorc/cleric in your group try and Hold Person them. Have the bard fascinate or dance them. Lots of other things to try rather than just trying to beat them down faster than they can heal themselves.

[TwoHeals]

Quicken spell: While this metamagic feat is active, spells cast twice as fast and cannot be interrupted by enemy attacks, but they consume 10 additional spell points.

So you don’t even need a high concentration check to cast.

No, I wish they made they made the game harder, that would be awesome to see cleric be able to cast comet fall in a flash. I’d like to see enemy casters do what we do to them. Like cast a couple stone to flesh spells on our casters and clerics, chain cast damage spell on tanks. I really wish we could have enemy human controlled characters but then everyone would whine that they couldn’t beat quests lol

I’m hoping as the level cap goes up quests on elite will be more challenging, already with the new content I know several people who have beat all the new mod 5 quest including the raid on elite a couple of times.

[Jomee]

No, I wish they made they made the game harder, that would be awesome to see cleric be able to cast comet fall in a flash. I’d like to see enemy casters do what we do to them. Like cast a couple stone to flesh spells on our casters and clerics, chain cast damage spell on tanks. I really wish we could have enemy human controlled characters but then everyone would whine that they couldn’t beat quests lol

I’m hoping as the level cap goes up quests on elite will be more challenging, already with the new content I know several people who have beat all the new mod 5 quest including the raid on elite a couple of times.

It's funny the people who cry about the game being too easy are the one who have all +6 everything, all named items, heavy whatever,greater all that, and a bio that says willing to trade all this +6 stuff im not using.

[Dane_McArdy]

NPC casters actually have artifical longer times between casts on a lot of spells. They can't spam certain spells right after it's cool down.

So the only advantage they have is unlimited mana, but just as you wouldn't use all your mana in one fight, I hope, I doubt they would either.

[Borror0]

NPC casters actually have artifical longer times between casts on a lot of spells. They can't spam certain spells right after it's cool down.

According to Eladrin, they have equal or longer cooldown on certain spell (that dman annoying Obscuring Mist comes to mind, god I hate that spell).

I'm too lazy to find my speak and Say, but you get the idea. they can and do spam-cast certain spell. VoN 3 Elite clerics and Flame Strike?

So the only advantage they have is unlimited mana, but just as you wouldn't use all your mana in one fight, I hope, I doubt they would either.

You could exhaust their mana if you want. I'd try, and I'd be able to. Against the Abbot, I'd certainly try it!!

[Spectralist]

You could exhaust their mana if you want. I'd try, and I'd be able to. Against the Abbot, I'd certainly try it!!

Ugh, now that's a good reason to leave their infinite spell points. The last thing i need are more tactics that make a 15 minute quest into a 75 minute quest. Like invaders back when everyone was enlarged cloudkilling everything.

So the only advantage they have is unlimited mana

And no concentration checks, and improved mobile spellcasting. That's the one that bothers me most, chasing an enemy caster, as he hits himself with heal without even slowing down. Made all the worse by the fact that it's nearly impossible to so much as get a die roll when using melee attacks on an enemy that's running in a straight line away from you.

[Borror0]

Ugh, now that's a good reason to leave their infinite spell points. The last thing i need are more tactics that make a 15 minute quest into a 75 minute quest. Like invaders back when everyone was enlarged cloudkilling everything.

A lv 2 Kobold would run out of mana pretty quick... more since he throws Lightning bolt at you if you have some cover. Could always help those 'near party wipe" moments. Not telling you it would become common with me, just telling you it could have some use, mostly at low levels.

And versus the Abbot, if it does the difference between a "wait a while and run out of mana" and "drink XX Mnemonic Enhancers" raid, I'm alll for it.

[MysticTheurge]

Ugh, now that's a good reason to leave their infinite spell points. The last thing i need are more tactics that make a 15 minute quest into a 75 minute quest. Like invaders back when everyone was enlarged cloudkilling everything.

Spellcasters AI has seen some significant improvements lately. They don't just stand around casting spells at walls any more, so that problem is at least partly solved.

And no concentration checks, and improved mobile spellcasting.

Yeah, these two are the ones that annoy me. And before anyone says "Oh they have quicken" I'll go ahead and counter with "Metamagics, which are limited by costing extra SP, are flat-out cheating when you have unlimited SP."

[Dane_McArdy]

According to Eladrin, they have equal or longer cooldown on certain spell (that dman annoying Obscuring Mist comes to mind, god I hate that spell).

I'm too lazy to find my speak and Say, but you get the idea. they can and do spam-cast certain spell. VoN 3 Elite clerics and Flame Strike?

They seem faster, because they are not limited by human reactions like we are. So when the timer is up, the next spell is being cast. But they actually tweaked it a bit they said.

You could exhaust their mana if you want. I'd try, and I'd be able to. Against the Abbot, I'd certainly try it!!

And that's all people would do, find a way to exhaust an NPC's mana and then trash it.

You've answered your own question.