New Party Type - Friendly Fire

[Shadow_Flayer]

In a different thread relating to opening existing quest environments to PvP, sans monsters, I go to wondering if adding a 'Friendly Fire' mode to the 'Party' option (where you convert to raid, have convert to friendly fire) would add a different dimension to things in general.

Friendly fire would simply be the same quest as before, except you can hit people in your party. You would not be able to stand in the same spot as others, or pass through your party. You could beat the heck out of each other on purpose if you wanted to -- not really a PvP mode, but I can see people using it for that.

It seems to be this type of thing would add a huge challenge to the game ... no more wildly spamming cone of cold or fireball ... no more ranging from behind the party ... two handed fighters being give a lot more space to avoid the splash damage ... lots more communication and strategy involved ... etc.

I'm pretty sure I remember hearing that Turbine experimented with something like this along the way. While it isn't new content, it sure would make content new

[M1A1]

And yes I do like this idea, it would be fun and give old quests new life (as long as it was optional)

[Tenkari_Rozahas]

for some reason i see casters being mainly buffbots in these kind of parties. too many of their spells are AoE.

[Belfalcon]

i think this would make it harder for the casters and we dont need it any harder the it already is ... and i haveing 2 clerics i would not like to heal FF dam ether the mobs do a nuff..

but i do like this but it would buff fighters,pallys,rangers,barbs and nurf our casters

[M1A1]

i think this would make it harder for the casters and we dont need it any harder the it already is ... and i haveing 2 clerics i would not like to heal FF dam ether the mobs do a nuff..

but i do like this but it would buff fighters,pallys,rangers,barbs and nurf our casters

I seem to have gotten away from firewall/fireball/etc and converted to FOD/PK/Dominate/FtoS/ETC so in MY groups anyway, it wouldnt change (much).

[Belfalcon]

ok i can see that then. i must rolled a sorc and is now lvl 8 almost 9. but No WoF at all?

[Tenkari_Rozahas]

heh... make everyone dance with the disco ball! I wonder if fascinate would work on party members as well....

[M1A1]

ok i can see that then. i must rolled a sorc and is now lvl 8 almost 9. but No WoF at all?

Its just that I dont use it so much. So I think it would impact MY game little. That being said, if this did come to pass, when I cast WoF, WATCH OUT! Its just trying to add a PnP (turn-based) feel to DDO (Real Time) dont know, could work and I wouldn't mind if they put it in.

[Shadow_Flayer]

i think this would make it harder for the casters and we dont need it any harder the it already is ... and i haveing 2 clerics i would not like to heal FF dam ether the mobs do a nuff..

but i do like this but it would buff fighters,pallys,rangers,barbs and nurf our casters

Well, yes the point would be that it would be a different, and harder, way of playing -- for all characters. No more summoning comets by the cleric, to land on the mob he's standing next to Watch out on the swings when mugging that mod -- those dual rapiers might hit that guy next to you (and on your team) when the mob dies. All that greater cleave splash damage. Those rangers that can shoot through everything in the way (ouch ouch ouch). No more caster standing in his max-empowered-crit firewall waiting for the mobs to die. Otto's dance ball on the doorway?

[Riddikulus]

i think this would make it harder for the casters and we dont need it any harder the it already is ... and i haveing 2 clerics i would not like to heal FF dam ether the mobs do a nuff..

but i do like this but it would buff fighters,pallys,rangers,barbs and nurf our casters

Hard? Casters? You must not be playing the same game I am. Once you get past the super squishy levels, casters rule. I've been able to do stuff with my caster that I would never dream of attempting with a melee character.

Friendly fire _is_ D&D. I can still remember the first time I lobbed a fireball at some mobs down a hallway, only to find that the explosion radius still included myself and my party.

Making things a bit more difficult for casters would bring some missing balance back into the game. A caster being able to lay down a 150 per tick firewall and run through it repeatedly is not what D&D is about.

I fully believe an extra party option as Friar has stated, or as I've advocated a "Nightmare" setting to quests which includes friendly fire, perhaps a little better XP & loot would add a whole new dimension to the game. Key is that it should be optional, for those who really want to try true D&D.

[Ustice]

This is not a bad idea, although there are some challenges to overcome. The biggest problem that I see with this is casting times. Having a Friendly Fire group would be closer to PnP, but the game wasn't designed with this in mind. As a result, the casting times are slower than their pnp counterparts. In pnp, it is relatively easy to get off one or two fireballs if you win initiative before the mobs close, but in DDO, it is likely that by the time you have cast it at where they are, they have already closed the gap, and have engaged the party.

Here are some of the changes that I think would need to be made to make this work (and I would LOVE to see it work).

Casting times increased by 100%.

XP Death Penalty reduced by 50%.

Prevent splash damage by Cleave and the like (you are supposed to be able to use it near a party member in pnp).

Critical Failures on attack rolls could result in hitting adjacent party members.

Don't remove the ability to walk through party members, but give a -4 to attack when you do. This is to allow for party member to move by, while discouraging overlap.

I would ALMOST say + 15% XP, but I am not sure if that is a good thing. It would mean that more parties would go this route, despite some people being uncomfortable with it. On the other hand, greater risk should be accompanied by greater reward.

Make sure that when a group leader converts to a FF group that it is announced, and MAYBE even accepted. Approval is optional, since you can always drop group if you do not like it.

Change the name to something like Expert Mode, since that sort of reflects the added difficulty.


Great idea. Its a much better PvP idea than I have seen elsewhere.

[M1A1]

Great idea. Its a much better PvP idea than I have seen elsewhere.

I pretty sure his intent was about making quests more challenging, etc., not really geared to go in a quest, kill the mobs, fight each other.

[Ghoste]

This idea is why I had to stop playing NWN with friends. We couldnt actually get through the first chapter without it turning into a big PvP slaughter fest.

[Wulf_Ratbane]

I love the idea, and would switch over to "Friendly Fire" as quickly as possible.

I think guilds would love it-- it's the perfect way to test teamwork with trusted fellows. (Goofball PUGs, not so much. )

It is instant "new content."

However, I wouldn't support it at all if it wasn't a "turn-key" solution. As soon as you start adding all kinds of qualifiers to what sorts of things should or shouldn't be included, you've lost me.

It's either as simple as "turning it on" or it isn't worth the Dev time.

[Memnir]

I really like this idea - and would love to give it a try. It'd certainly change up some tactics people use, that's for sure. I bet we'd see 90% less Firewall then we do now.

[Wulf_Ratbane]

I really like this idea - and would love to give it a try. It'd certainly change up some tactics people use, that's for sure. I bet we'd see 90% less Firewall then we do now.

Put it in a doorway and shield block on the other side of it-- assuming the AI is still too stupid to step out of a raging fire-- and you still have a decent tactic.

I also saw a wizard making excellent use of Mass Hold Person and Firewall.

The white dragon would be a different fight than I am accustomed to seeing, however.

[blakbyrd]

I am all for this idea added as an option when entering a quest.

[Memnir]

Oh, don't get me wrong - I think it'd still be a highly used spell. But, it would be cast much less than it is now since you'd be unable to cast & hide in it.

[Dragonhyde]

Hmmm no more caster standing in his own firewall....now make it to where if you recall out no getting back in while the quest is active . There could be a challenging game.

[deepshadow]

Would love to see this added atleast as an option