WoW Solo Zones.

[BUpcott]

That's not even a serious question.

No I am being serious. I will even go as far as to repost Jello's questions

1. Do you think healers should have no charge for healing spells?
2. Should everyone in the DDO world be granted free XP potions just because Turbine needs to take the servers offline from time to time?
3. What do you think about these solo zones based off a WoW model?
4. How do you feel about being allowed to get raid level loot without going through a raid?

[tekn0mage]

No I am being serious. I will even go as far as to repost Jello's questions

1. Do you think healers should have no charge for healing spells?

A. That's a very constructive suggestion. I think it's definitely something I would like to see. Since we are forced to take the spells, I think there should be some discount to them. Or at the very least, a fast-cast animation.

2. Should everyone in the DDO world be granted free XP potions just because Turbine needs to take the servers offline from time to time?

No, but they have the worst reputation I have ever seen for "scheduled maintenance". Something needs to be done about this.

3. What do you think about these solo zones based off a WoW model?

I have been saying since day one that open explorable zones need to be in the game. The **** they put together with this "outdoor" technology is a joke. One-time completion bonuses at XP cap is as useless as two left feet. And the fact that you have to kill 10, then 15 more, then 25 more, then 50, then 100, then 200, then 350, then 750 monsters to get any XP is useless and cheap technology ripped from some crackhead source.

Especially if you die even once, the XP bonus gained for any of the previous thresholds except 750 kills or 1500 kills will net you a negative XP loss.

4. How do you feel about being allowed to get raid level loot without going through a raid?

OK I'm not in favor of this one. I think that might be a bit off. Raiding is raiding, but since all raid loot is getting nerfed anyways, I think Turbine should just forget about raids. Since frickin' robots with frickin' laser beams was a **** poor idea from the get-go I think they have lost the idea of what makes a good raid.

[PaintHorseCowboy]

One-time completion bonuses at XP cap is as useless as two left feet. And the fact that you have to kill 10, then 15 more, then 25 more, then 50, then 100, then 200, then 350, then 750 monsters to get any XP is useless and cheap technology ripped from some crackhead source.

If you think anything is as useless as two left feet, try looking at it from a different perspective once in a while. Perhaps expand your critical thinking capability and imagine it from the point of view of a four-legged animal. I highly doubt they would find two left feet "useless".

The same can be said about the experience gained from outdoor encounter areas. It is not useless. Anyone who has ever spent hours hunched over a table working their way through a module can tell you the following. The majority of your experience does not come from wandering packs of whatever while on your way to or from a quest. It comes from questing.

As your character increases in power and level, you should get fewer and fewer experience points for randomly wandering around the world and slaying packs of relatively low-level mobs. Rather than create an equation where they siphon off the amount of experience per kill, they made you have to kill an increasing amount in order to get your experience. Honestly, what is the difference if you only get 1/1000'th of an experience point for killing a kobald or having to kill 1000 kobalds to get your experience awarded? Well, one premise might be the historical way Dungeons & Dragons works. You finish an adventure, and experience is awarded. Finishing a set number of kills, awards you experience. It has a set precedent.

As for your comment about it being ripped <remainder deleted>, perhaps they saw this as a means to expedite new content instead of spending man-hours completely reworking something that already worked, even if it was not fully optimized.

Let's not forget the "why don't you go play another game" crowd as well. That's just petty.

Perhaps, after some application of critical thinking, you might realize that there are in fact certain times at which this comment is appropriate and more-so, actually warranted.

This game is not supposed to be another cookie-cutter MMO. Dungeons & Dragons has, quite literally, DECADES of history when compared to the other MMO's on the market these days. Regardless of what campaign you tended to play, be it Forgotten Realms, Dark Sun, Ravenloft, Eberron, or any others I've forgotten, there is a long standing history.

I'm going to say this in simple terms so that everyone understands it. It is not aimed directly at you Tekn0, although I used a couple of your points to help illustrate mine.

When you divulge from basic Dungeons & Dragons principles in such a manner as to be deemed by the majority of players as being too radical for the good of the game, two things will happen.

First, you're going to get a lot of people telling you that this is not a very good idea. They are going to give their opinions, some more and some less eloquently than others.

And second, if the proposed changes ARE in fact installed when the majority of players, who likely have countless thousands of hours playing Pen & Paper Dungeons & Dragons, have already stated it is a horrible idea, you will likely see a mass exodus of the core players who support the online version of this game because of an affinity for its pen and paper history. When that happens, the amount of funding for new ideas goes right through the bottom-line. When the funding drops, less new content and fewer bug fixes are produced.

It's basic capitalism 101. The corporation exists to make a profit for itself and its shareholders. When profit is adversely affected, the company has two choices, expand in a new area and allow the income of "operation 2" to support "operation 1" until "operation 1" becomes profitable again, or close down "operation 1" and cut liabilities in order to increase profitability elsewhere. Ultimately, it comes down to the decision of "Do we have greater profit potential leaving "operation 1" running while subsidizing its continued development into profitability with "operation 2" or, do we have greater profit potential if we were to close "operation 1" down and focus solely on "operation 2"." And that will be decided by an accountant who is looking at things such as tax law that can be used to retain more earnings for the corporation.

So, for the sake of DDO, perhaps the "go play elsewhere" comment is actually a valid suggestion. Because again it boils down to profitability. Are they better to lose a few monthly subscriptions of players who did not find the game to their liking or are they better to keep the larger core group of Dungeons & Dragons players who have carried monthly subscriptions for the majority of this game?

[ChaosTheEternal]

Since we are forced to take the spells, I think there should be some discount to them. Or at the very least, a fast-cast animation.

Wrong.

Clerics are "forced" to take those spells because it represents their spontaneous casting ability.

Spontaneous Casting
A good cleric (or a neutral cleric of a good deity) can channel stored spell energy into healing spells that the cleric did not prepare ahead of time. The cleric can "lose" any prepared spell that is not a domain spell in order to cast any cure spell of the same spell level or lower (a cure spell is any spell with "cure" in its name).

If they didn't "force" us to take them, clerics would have one less spell slot on every level. Since we aren't given Domain spells, that'd mean a cleric gets, at most, 5 slots per spell level. We have, at most, 5 assignable per level, because one slot (the 6th) is taken by the level appropriate Cure spell.

Since there is no change in how clerics cast in PnP when they spontaneously cast a Cure spell in place of a regular spell, they shouldn't change how we cast a Cure spell in DDO.


Under the same regard, when druids are introduced, they'll have Summon Nature's Ally X "forced" for each level, because that's their spontaneous casting spell.

[MacDaddy89]

In other words if the topic of a thread incites your own anger or rubs you the wrong way, resist the temptation to go in there and post.

Look, if someone is posting an 'Im leaving' thread. Don't go in there and kick the person while they are down.

You don't see me hunting threads with a 10,000+ post count looking for a fight. I follow threads that actually have a chance of getting Turbine's attention.

I see you in far too many threads you don't belong in, however.

QFT - if only other posters had half as much sense.

But since the point was clearly missed, I will spell it out: if you have more time in the forums than you do in game, then frankly your opinion does NOT matter.

[Shamguard]

I find this thread very interesting and quite of its original topic.

I do not have the fortitude to read through all of Dingo's threads of "interesting" sugestions, but I have caught the theme of his posts and was curious about one thing.

Has anyone bothered to explane to him that this is Dungeons and Dragons Online. I realize that this never has been or never will be the same as PnP, but there is still the need to manage resources. That is part of the tactics of D&D. To do otherwise would be a significant change to the game. In DDO we do have more resources than our PnP counter parts and that is just part of the nature of the online version of this game, but to give us unlimited resources would affect the tactics of this game.

The main reason for limited resources is to increase the difficulty of the game. If we wanted an easier game we'd all run off and play WoW or LoTRO, but we don't because we like a game that challengres us to not waste resources. I know there are players who will not manage their resources well, recalling out to regain SP or to heal up, but the game punishes this type of play by reducing the amount of XP they receive for quest completion. So either they learn to let the fighters get some of the kills and save mana or they have to work harder to make their levels.

I mostly play in PuGs so I have seen alot of different "styles" of play. I've seen different groups, of the same level, do the same quest one group will burn out every bit of the cleric's resources and another group do the quest and the cleric has mana to spare. So I know what can and cann't be done in this game.

I think Dingo is trying to make sugestions that he thinks will improve this game. The problem is I don't think Dingo understands that the things he wants to change are what help make this game unique. If this game is to survive it won't be by becoming like every other MMO. It will survive by what makes it different from every other MMO.

[Luthen]

This is the second time today I've been in this thread having to delete posts, you guys. Feel free to discuss the topic, but do it WITHOUT the insults and profanity. Thanks.

-Meghan

Freedom of speech is the concept of being able to speak freely without censorship. It is often regarded as an integral concept in modern liberal democracies. The right to freedom of speech is guaranteed under international law through numerous human rights instruments, notably under Article 19 of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights and Article 10 of the European Convention on Human Rights, although implementation remains lacking in many countries. The synonymous term freedom of expression is sometimes preferred, since the right is not confined to verbal speech but is understood to protect any act of seeking, receiving and imparting information or ideas, regardless of the medium used.

In practice, the right to freedom of speech is not absolute in any country, although the degree of freedom varies greatly. Industrialized countries also have varying approaches to balance freedom with order. For instance, the United States First Amendment theoretically grants absolute freedom, placing the burden upon the state to demonstrate when (if) a limitation of this freedom is necessary. In almost all liberal democracies, it is generally recognized that restrictions should be the exception and free expression the rule; nevertheless, compliance with this principle is often lacking.

If you want the whole thing go here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom_of_speech

Just some food for thought for everyone as related to more and more "Hey watch what you say" posts.

[LordFancyPants]

Luthen, you know I think very highly of you,

But freedom of speech DOES NOT extend to a privately-owned forum such as this one.

I mean, I agree that Turbine should be less willing to nuke post that are critical of them... but it is their right to do so. The bill of rights has nothing to do with these forums.

Now, if you want to go to Turbine's office and protest outside it... that would be considered freedom of speech. I'll pick you up at the airport... let me know what time your flight arrives

~LFP

[Luthen]

Luthen, you know I think very highly of you,

But freedom of speech DOES NOT extend to a privately-owned forum such as this one.

I mean, I agree that Turbine should be less willing to nuke post that are critical of them... but it is their right to do so. The bill of rights has nothing to do with these forums.

Now, if you want to go to Turbine's office and protest outside it... that would be considered freedom of speech. I'll pick you up at the airport... let me know what time your flight arrives

~LFP

Love you too buddy. I refer you to the following excerpt.

It is often regarded as an integral concept in modern liberal democracies. The right to freedom of speech is guaranteed under international law through numerous human rights instruments, notably under Article 19 of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights and Article 10 of the European Convention on Human Rights, although implementation remains lacking in many countries.

I am not saying I want perfect freedom of speech. I don't dispute your POV on anything in particular. I think that forums should be moderated but that moderation should be done in moderation (I almost made a funny... see that?). What I disagree with is the heavy handed nature which is used to moderate our speech on these forums.

If I call your mother a **** ****** ***** (Note: asterix's were placed intentionally for effect and no actual cursing took place so as to avoid being "nuked") then I should be consequenced. If I call you a **** *** **** (Note: see above note) then I should earn infractions. However if anyone feels strongly about a topic and their verbal mutterings get a little out of hand then warn them or say "Hey guys... tone it down a little and keep it somewhat civil". You shouldn't have to worry, constantly, about getting points or your posts deleted. I mean the game is rated "T" for Teen by the ESRB. So assumably the vast majority are at least young adults capable of handling some harsh words now and then.

If they want true moderation on these forums then they need to go out and hire one of every type of personality to moderate these forums so that every point of view is represented and people are not "edited" because the moderators don't like their tone or how they express themselves.

I give you a quote that I have always loved and is as true today as it has always been:

"America isn't easy. America is advanced citizenship. You gotta want it bad, 'cause it's gonna put up a fight. It's gonna say "You want free speech? Let's see you acknowledge a man whose words make your blood boil, who's standing center stage and advocating at the top of his lungs that which you would spend a lifetime opposing at the top of yours." -President Andrew Shepard (An American President)

[Dane_McArdy]

In America, Freedom of Speech means the government shall not pass anylaw prohibiting anyone from speaking out against it.

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.

It does not mean you can say whatever you like, when and where ever you like. Otherwise, there would be no libel and slander laws.

It's been a standing rule of the forums, since they started that you can complain about Turbine, but posts that are just attacks, without feedback, and no, saying Turbine Sucks is NOT helpful feedback, can and will be deleted.

It's called constructive critism. Meaning, you state the issue, how the issue effects you or your game play. Do not make threats of quitting, do not use any negative terms to describe the game, staff or whatever.

It's really not that hard to understand.

And yes, this is a private forum board, and can be edited and have posts deleted, legally, at any time.

[Luthen]

In America, Freedom of Speech means the government shall not pass anylaw prohibiting anyone from speaking out against it.

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.

It does not mean you can say whatever you like, when and where ever you like. Otherwise, there would be no libel and slander laws.

It's been a standing rule of the forums, since they started that you can complain about Turbine, but posts that are just attacks, without feedback, and no, saying Turbine Sucks is NOT helpful feedback, can and will be deleted.

But is it OK to say "Turbine sucks and here's why...... Now this is how I think it should have been done..."? Because I have seen a number of such posts deleted because they got labled attacks. That, by your definition Dane is not an attack. It is criticism. However if we don't submit to a specific style of voicing our grievences we are subject to deletion or other sanctions. I am not looking for a fight, this time , but I am looking for a bit more even handed moderating from our service provider.

[BUpcott]

In America, Freedom of Speech means the government shall not pass anylaw prohibiting anyone from speaking out against it.

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.

It does not mean you can say whatever you like, when and where ever you like. Otherwise, there would be no libel and slander laws.

It's been a standing rule of the forums, since they started that you can complain about Turbine, but posts that are just attacks, without feedback, and no, saying Turbine Sucks is NOT helpful feedback, can and will be deleted.

It's called constructive critism. Meaning, you state the issue, how the issue effects you or your game play. Do not make threats of quitting, do not use any negative terms to describe the game, staff or whatever.

It's really not that hard to understand.

And yes, this is a private forum board, and can be edited and have posts deleted, legally, at any time.

Oh joy to be Canadian, eh;

FUNDAMENTAL FREEDOMS.
2. Everyone has the following fundamental freedoms:

(a) freedom of conscience and religion;
(b) freedom of thought, belief, opinion and expression, including freedom of the press and other media of communication;
(c) freedom of peaceful assembly; and
(d) freedom of association.

[Shamguard]

In America, Freedom of Speech means the government shall not pass anylaw prohibiting anyone from speaking out against it.

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.

Oh joy to be Canadian, eh;

FUNDAMENTAL FREEDOMS.
2. Everyone has the following fundamental freedoms:

(a) freedom of conscience and religion;
(b) freedom of thought, belief, opinion and expression, including freedom of the press and other media of communication;
(c) freedom of peaceful assembly; and
(d) freedom of association.

Where did these ideas come from, oh yes something call the "Magna Carta written in 1225 before the USA or Canada were even discovered by the Europeans. I also think the Brits got there ideas from some old Greeks.

But honestly folks this is a private forum and we all agreed to the rules when we joined. Part of these rules are if Turbine doesn't like what you say they can delete it and even ban you from posting again. You are in someone else's house behave like you want to stay or you can expect to be asked to leave and they will call secutrity if you don't go quite.

[Dingo123]

Love you too buddy. I refer you to the following excerpt.



I am not saying I want perfect freedom of speech. I don't dispute your POV on anything in particular. I think that forums should be moderated but that moderation should be done in moderation (I almost made a funny... see that?). What I disagree with is the heavy handed nature which is used to moderate our speech on these forums.

If I call your mother a **** ****** ***** (Note: asterix's were placed intentionally for effect and no actual cursing took place so as to avoid being "nuked") then I should be consequenced. If I call you a **** *** **** (Note: see above note) then I should earn infractions. However if anyone feels strongly about a topic and their verbal mutterings get a little out of hand then warn them or say "Hey guys... tone it down a little and keep it somewhat civil". You shouldn't have to worry, constantly, about getting points or your posts deleted. I mean the game is rated "T" for Teen by the ESRB. So assumably the vast majority are at least young adults capable of handling some harsh words now and then.

If they want true moderation on these forums then they need to go out and hire one of every type of personality to moderate these forums so that every point of view is represented and people are not "edited" because the moderators don't like their tone or how they express themselves.

I give you a quote that I have always loved and is as true today as it has always been:

"America isn't easy. America is advanced citizenship. You gotta want it bad, 'cause it's gonna put up a fight. It's gonna say "You want free speech? Let's see you acknowledge a man whose words make your blood boil, who's standing center stage and advocating at the top of his lungs that which you would spend a lifetime opposing at the top of yours." -President Andrew Shepard (An American President)

so Turbine should honor your right to... what? Be abusive? No one said you couldn't post your point of view... but the Eula is pretty clear.

[tekn0mage]

Does anyone remember when Quarion/KK (yes they are the same people) first showed up on the scene?

How many people got banned (some on their first offense) .. it was completely out of hand. At least a dozen people from my guild were banned for very small infractions (no cursing, no swearing, just a thread or two that got out of hand in the server forums).

It led to the banning of hundreds of accounts during KK's iron grip. While I don't fault Turbine for exercising their right to moderate, I think they went overboard and contributed to the game's wounded state.

If people have criticism but they can't even post it for fear of infraction points (and yes it was THAT bad for a while around here) you're going to lose more people than you know what to do with, without ANY chance to recover them.

And yes, in my business if a customer is unhappy I want to hear about it and make EVERY effort (even at my own expense most of the time) to retain them.

[Luthen]

Does anyone remember when Quarion/KK (yes they are the same people) first showed up on the scene?

How many people got banned (some on their first offense) .. it was completely out of hand. At least a dozen people from my guild were banned for very small infractions (no cursing, no swearing, just a thread or two that got out of hand in the server forums).

It led to the banning of hundreds of accounts during KK's iron grip. While I don't fault Turbine for exercising their right to moderate, I think they went overboard and contributed to the game's wounded state.

If people have criticism but they can't even post it for fear of infraction points (and yes it was THAT bad for a while around here) you're going to lose more people than you know what to do with, without ANY chance to recover them.

And yes, in my business if a customer is unhappy I want to hear about it and make EVERY effort (even at my own expense most of the time) to retain them.

I had a long discussion topic I was going to post here but, and Im not being funny or ironic, I had to delete it because I fear I would get my third infraction and be permanantly banned for discussing infraction penalties.

[Dingo123]

Sigh. Another thread dingo? All i see here is bla bla nobody will group with me and mummy paid for a year's subs bla bla need something to do bla bla

...go away?

EDIT: I fear no infractions. I will take them for the team to get rid of this troublemaker :P

I'm not sure what makes me a trouble maker exactly. I post ideas, and yes, many people disagree with them. I've never suggested they should do otherwise.

I make an argument for my ideas but I do my best to keep it civil. You don't see me carrying on and on about how such and such is inferior, or ridiculous, or whatever.

In fact, *I* have been one of the least aggressive persons in my threads. I make an effort to keep it on discussion and ignore the comments such as yours.

But to call me a troublemaker? And to say you're out to get me, taking one for the team to get rid of me?

Maybe you just think differently than I do... but that sort of behaviour genuinely frightens me. That you would go to such length and sacrifce to injure someone in a video game forum who has done nothing wrong outside of post ideas you disagree with.

[Lorien_the_First_One]

I'm not sure what makes me a trouble maker exactly. I post ideas, and yes, many people disagree with them. I've never suggested they should do otherwise.

I make an argument for my ideas but I do my best to keep it civil. You don't see me carrying on and on about how such and such is inferior, or ridiculous, or whatever.

In fact, *I* have been one of the least aggressive persons in my threads. I make an effort to keep it on discussion and ignore the comments such as yours.

But to call me a troublemaker? And to say you're out to get me, taking one for the team to get rid of me?

Maybe you just think differently than I do... but that sort of behaviour genuinely frightens me. That you would go to such length and sacrifce to injure someone in a video game forum who has done nothing wrong outside of post ideas you disagree with.

I think you like to stir up the pot with controvertial ideas.

And I haven't agreed with one yet.

But trouble maker is going a bit far

You just have very different ideas that most of us...

[Arnya]

Lorien: I respect your opinions and always read what you post carefully. I apologise to anyone in the forum community who also sees my comments as going a bit too far.

It's just a way of life down here to be straight up and to call it like it looks...

/bow

[sigtrent]

You don't see me hunting threads with a 10,000+ post count looking for a fight. I follow threads that actually have a chance of getting Turbine's attention.
.

How true... you needn't do so since you seem to pick a fight in nearly every thread on the general and dev forum.

Do you really have no idea of the way most of the forum members see you due to your constant and petty complaining?