Death to Normal

[Knightrose]

What is Turbines true reasoning for Difficulty Levels of quests?

Why can't we scale everything to Elite, and then erase the difficulty settings?

It's nice being able to speed through the VONs on normal, sure. But shouldn't they be a one-time deal anyway? Like some of the other fun raids (Titan/Reaver)? Especially with the new changes coming to the Dragon. I have fear and doubt.

Anyway, I say Death to Normal. Hard can follow it to the grave as well.

Savy?

[wundernewb]

What is Turbines true reasoning for Difficulty Levels of quests?

So that people running quests with un- or barely twinked characters, parties running less than 6 players, or group makeups that are less than optimal for their playstyle, or people that just aren't 1337, or people with gimped characters that they love, can play the game and enjoy it too

Why can't we scale everything to Elite, and then erase the difficulty settings?

Why should we? Is there some reason you want to expend even a minimal amount of programmer time to deny the choice of Normal to those that use it?

Anyway, I say Death to Normal. Hard can follow it to the grave as well.

Savy?

As well as all the non-leet players who don't like Elite.

Anyway, why do you want an Elite-only setting? You mention "fear and doubt", but do not explain in any form what it is that you fear and doubt. Please do so.

[moorewr]

It's been a while since you had untwinked characters and had to PUG, hasn't it?

Seriously, though, I wish Turbine would drop the unlocking requirement. Just let us pick how hard we want to run so we don't idle around waiting for someone to unlock elite on favor runs...

At least unlock them if you are n levels above the quest level - say +1 for hard, +3 for elite...

My cleric missed a lot of low level stuff (he was my first character after all), and if I'm soloing running, say, Redfang three times to get elite favor can really kill the gaming mood.

[Laith]

normal difficulty is generally "just right" for an appropriate leveled party's first run through. many parties will still fail.

a month later, after dozens of runs and a thirst for content (and loot), it's understandable that elite becomes the standard... but that doesn't eliminate the need for normal.

[Impaqt]

If you want to run everything on Elite go ahead.....

Whats the point of this thread?

[Ziggy]

If you want to run everything on Elite go ahead.....

Whats the point of this thread?

I believe he just wants to run a quest once for maximum favor.

[Dirac]

I just spent a fair amount of time crafting a post on this issue in another thread where it was just a tangent, only to be confronted with this. I'll repeat some of myself here.

The normal setting should be for the group of 4 casual, non-min/max players using static reward (non-raid) loot.

Of course there is disagreement on how easy the game is and what a casual gamer really is. However, there can not be any doubt that the Normal difficulty has scaled faster than the quest level. The 8 level quests are harder for 8th level characters than 2nd level quests are for 2nd level characters. The Desert can be a downright challenge for this type of group even a level above the quest.

I would like to know if you think the dragons in the Stromreaver Pre-Raid can be done with four casual, non-min/max players on Normal.

Not only should Normal stay, the difficulty of Normal on the upper level quests needs to be scaled back. Increase the difficutly on Elite if you would like.

Edit: being allowed to open on elite if you are high enough level to get no xp for the quest is also not a bad idea to address that issue

[Gennerik]

I believe he just wants to run a quest once for maximum favor.

Because getting rid of different opportunities is what the game should be about. While I would like to get rid of unlocking the difficulties if you're over the level of the quest (+1/+3 sounds good to me), I like having the difficulty levels. Even on my capped characters, I sometimes don't feel like dealing with the gross overpowering of Elite. So yeah, Ziggy, I think you summed it up nicely.

[miceelf88]

slightly off topic, but my ongoing beef about scaling is that there's no way that elite is only 2 levels more difficult than normal for most quests. Soloing a level 8 quest on normal is MUCH easier than a level 6 quest on elite.

[Dariun]

Couldn't disagree more.

Fewer options = bad.

[arminius]

I propose we eliminate kindergarten, elementary school, junior high school, and high school. Everyone can then go to university, which is the best, right? Everyone should have the best. Why bother with anything else?

_

[oronisi]

What is Turbines true reasoning for Difficulty Levels of quests?

Why can't we scale everything to Elite, and then erase the difficulty settings?

It's nice being able to speed through the VONs on normal, sure. But shouldn't they be a one-time deal anyway? Like some of the other fun raids (Titan/Reaver)? Especially with the new changes coming to the Dragon. I have fear and doubt.

Anyway, I say Death to Normal. Hard can follow it to the grave as well.

Savy?

Just because you zerg through dungeons with your twinked out min-maxxed characters doesn't mean that everybody does! Maybe you just don't understand that YOU don't fall into the normal category. Perhaps you should be grateful the DDO devs decided to label your difficulty 'elite' instead of 'play too much'.

And for the record, I play on elite....I'm just not so narrowsighted as you are.

[Mad_Bombardier]

I propose we eliminate kindergarten, elementary school, junior high school, and high school. Everyone can then go to university, which is the best, right? Everyone should have the best. Why bother with anything else?

Yet another person who must surely work in Higher Ed administration. Didn't we do this already in the U.S.?

[Knightrose]

Heh, just had to ask I guess.

[Devorpa]

I disagree with the OP.

I think we probably all did our first ever quest in stormreach on out first character on normal .... new players need the chance to learn with reduced risk - otherwise, they will die a lot and leave the game through frustration.

/gets on soap box
I do, however, *STRONGLY* support a system where experinced players can choose their level of difficulty without having to do the Normal->hard->Elite stupidity.

I was in a group of players running their fourth characters (the first three all passed 2000 favour some time ago) through Tangleroot last night. You know, Tangleroot is fun ... *ONCE* per character after your first character has done the Normal->hard->Elite stupidity.

Being a chapter based quest, you can not get your level 14s to open the subsequent chapters of Tangleroot on elite for you and we did not have anyone in the group who had done Tangleroot on these characters.

Its not like we need to do the quests three times for the experience .... I raised my third character to L14 by doing each quest from L1 upwards once on elite (and waiting to find a Guild member to run me through chapter quests on elite). I did the quests when I was 'at the level of the quest'.

Dear Turbine .... please remove the difficulty restriction for experienced players. Allow us the choice to enjoy the challenge while we are around the level of the quest .... not as L14s comeing back to do the L3 - 8 quests on elite for favour with *no* challenge or risk.

/gets off soap box

[CaptGrim]

I disagree with the OP.

I think we probably all did our first ever quest in stormreach on out first character on normal .... new players need the chance to learn with reduced risk - otherwise, they will die a lot and leave the game through frustration.

/gets on soap box
I do, however, *STRONGLY* support a system where experinced players can choose their level of difficulty without having to do the Normal->hard->Elite stupidity.

I was in a group of players running their fourth characters (the first three all passed 2000 favour some time ago) through Tangleroot last night. You know, Tangleroot is fun ... *ONCE* per character after your first character has done the Normal->hard->Elite stupidity.

Being a chapter based quest, you can not get your level 14s to open the subsequent chapters of Tangleroot on elite for you and we did not have anyone in the group who had done Tangleroot on these characters.

Its not like we need to do the quests three times for the experience .... I raised my third character to L14 by doing each quest from L1 upwards once on elite (and waiting to find a Guild member to run me through chapter quests on elite). I did the quests when I was 'at the level of the quest'.

Dear Turbine .... please remove the difficulty restriction for experienced players. Allow us the choice to enjoy the challenge while we are around the level of the quest .... not as L14s comeing back to do the L3 - 8 quests on elite for favour with *no* challenge or risk.

/gets off soap box

Great Idea, let us have a 2250 favor reward, of opening a quest on any diff, with any toon on that account.

[rikori2]

I love the multiple difficulty settings. But other than the first time xp rewards, there needs to be more rewards for doing harder difficulty quests. Also, I think it'd be great if all the quests had all difficulties unlocked!