Tangleroot part IV: Whisperdoom's spawn

[ArkoHighStar]

Comments in red
Everyone is offering their strategies as if the OP and I can't beat the quest, lol. I've beaten TR more times than I can count. There's always at least 2-3 of the static rewards I want on every new toon I roll. What we wanna know is; WHEN THE HELL DID THEY CHANGE THE SPIDER????

I tried to find release notes, but there was definite dev confirmation that she got harder as people were able to kill her. I think it was when gianthold came out. Also the AI changes made all the old tricks not work as she no longer follows you up to the cliff.

[PurdueDave]

I tried to find release notes, but there was definite dev confirmation that she got harder as people were able to kill her. I think it was when gianthold came out. Also the AI changes made all the old tricks not work as she no longer follows you up to the cliff.

I'm pretty sure they made her harder to kill when they released the second Whisperdoom quest. Other than that, I'm not aware of any change either.

[moorewr]

I knew expeditious retreat and haste didn't stack....but I thought that striding equipment and haste did?

Since my cleric is always the slowest runner in the party I have had plenty of time to play with hasted and non-hasted speeds.

I'm pretty much convinced nothing stacks with Haste - except maybe the Barb sprint.

I ran Whiserpdoom's Spawn on hard the other day with my barbarian - I was the spider bait and I sprinted for the exit (no haste, just barb sprint). She kept up with me, and I had a nasty moment trying to climb the rocks with her swinging at me, but I made it out with a fair amount HP to spare.

I never seem to work the shrine trick. I'm too clumsy.

[Ron]

Regardless, for a ranger to have 280 hitpoints means you are level 14, or close to it. And in that case: Why didn't you just KILL Whisperdoom? She's not magically invulnerable or anything. She has AC, DR, and hitpoints, all of which a level 12+ warrior should be able to overcome by swinging a large sword.

Actually, I thought she WAS magically invulnerable. Wasn't that the change they made to her? That you CANNOT kill her? Maybe I'm wrong about that.

[ArkoHighStar]

I'm pretty sure they made her harder to kill when they released the second Whisperdoom quest. Other than that, I'm not aware of any change either.

Looking back through past posts it looks like she was made unkillable when evil resurgent came out although it is not listed in the release notes.

[Talon_Moonshadow]

I think she was made faster in the last update.....My friend has been the one trying to run from her a couple times recently....he never had trouble before.
She's not as damageing in normal, but the guy running her around last night still died pretty quick.
She also appears faster in Spawn of Wisperdoom as well.

[bandyman1]

Thx for the info Arko and Talon.

[Stonebread]

I agree, it must have been the last update. I used to "outrun" her without haste and maybe 5% speed boots (I imagine the other spiders got in her way). She'd get a couple of attacks in, but not hit enough to matter for my tank.

I'll have to check this out. It will make things more exciting.

[Mhykke]

Since my cleric is always the slowest runner in the party I have had plenty of time to play with hasted and non-hasted speeds.

I'm pretty much convinced nothing stacks with Haste - except maybe the Barb sprint.

I ran Whiserpdoom's Spawn on hard the other day with my barbarian - I was the spider bait and I sprinted for the exit (no haste, just barb sprint). She kept up with me, and I had a nasty moment trying to climb the rocks with her swinging at me, but I made it out with a fair amount HP to spare.

I never seem to work the shrine trick. I'm too clumsy.

I know the sprints definitely stack....

In terms of the striding though: I just remember back when the cap was 10, trying to test striders w/ haste. 2 of us rolled new characters, same str, same class, same equipment in backback threw striders on one and not the other, got someone to haste us, and the person who had the striders outran the one who didn't...........Weird.....

[Shade]

She was updated because shes meant to be impossible. They kinda failed in making her impossible tho:

http://img67.imageshack.us/img67/447...ot01470fg4.jpg

But really its ok. Because if done at an appropriate level she would be impossible.

AC: 30-40
DR: 30-40+ (In the SS i hit for 20 (with quad rage and bard buffs - I normally hit for 60+)
HP: More then most bosses in lvl13/14 elite quests. (Well probably not, but her regen is so insanely fast that you do end up doing that kinda damage)

It took me longer to kill her then it did killing Velah (only person attacking)

Tho when I was lvl6-7 I did kill her back in the day.. Fairly straightfoward on normal.. Then later on elite I was having a really hard time so I switch'd to a maladroit club and took her down on elite. So yea she was a bit too easy back then and not nearly impossible like she was sposed to be. Now I don't think i'd have a chance at lvl6-9.

[moorewr]

Say - since it's not a skill you can train, so the # isn't transparent - do the races have different base running speeds? I bet PnP would tell me that...

I know the sprints definitely stack....

I just remember back when the cap was 10, trying to test striders w/ haste. 2 of us rolled new characters, same str, same class, same equipment in backback threw striders on one and not the other, got someone to haste us, and the person who had the striders outran the one who didn't...........Weird.....

[RATRACE931]

I "ran" her last night on my 14th level Dwarf Paladin. (My job was to draw her away from the eggs so the rest of the party could pop the eggs.)

My AC is in the low 40's and my HP's are at 360. All saves 20+.

I could not outdistance her with Haste + Expeditious Retreat (clickie) + 20% Boots.

My normal strategy of run into a rest shrine and close the door didn't work because she followed me in. She drilled through my H.P.'s and both of my Lay on Hands (+120 each). I was sucking Cure Potions like they were water on a hot day.

I finally got lucky and stumbled into a corner where she "bugged" and basically stopped attacking me. She and two of her daughters were right on top of me, but only swinging (or connecting) very rarely. I was able to recall out on my second attempt and found myself outside at 1 hit point.

This is a level 4 or 5 quest? The term "Elite" shouldn't negate the level. That was a 0 experience, supposedly "risk free" quest for me, and it was through pure dumb luck that I survived.

(But, it may be replicatable. I think it is her distance attack that is the most devastating. That will apparently drill through any AC and Saves and shred anyone. But, if you don't run, it appeared that she closes in too close to use it and relies on regular attacks that can miss.)

I've found that she still bugs when you run around the cave room, she'll get stuck on the wargs that are too stupid not to try and run through a wall at you. By the way Haste+ Expedistious Retreat+ Strider %20= %40 run walk bonus from haste alone, they do not stack, only barb increased speed (or monk) will allow you to run faster than %40 with haste alone, excluding of course sprint boosts. I did elite TR on my Sorc the other night with 2 friends... i decided that a lvl 14 sorc built strictly for damage output should be able to HARM her... i laid down 8 max-emp-extend firewalls in a box and one more going through it all in the place she'd have to run. She promptly killed me even though she was taking over 400 damage a second. Health bar barely moved.

[Strakeln]

Looking back through past posts it looks like she was made unkillable when evil resurgent came out although it is not listed in the release notes.

I recall the change in release notes as well, but I know for a fact that she is NOT unkillable currently. I killed her with my barbarian (solo) after whatever update said she was beefed up.

I do have a screenshot, but it doesn't prove when I killed her (no screenshot datestamps), so there's no real point in posting it.

[mgoldb2]

whisperdoom her self more powerful then in the past but overall the quest easier. Back pre-vermin nerf fighting those brown princes with a group of level 5-6's on elite was brutal.

[Plynx]

And in that case: Why didn't you just KILL Whisperdoom? She's not magically invulnerable or anything. She has AC, DR, and hitpoints, all of which a level 12+ warrior should be able to overcome by swinging a large sword.

I heard... though do not know from firsthand experience... that she was made completely invulnerable in Splinterskull at the time the Whisperdoom quest was added.

[Osharan_Tregarth]

280 hitpoints? What level are you?

Rangers are 8 hp/level, which comes to 112 at level 14. Say 22 con for another 6*14 = 84, or 112+84+20 = 216. So you've got to have Toughness and Dwarf Toughness on top of that.

Regardless, for a ranger to have 280 hitpoints means you are level 14, or close to it. And in that case: Why didn't you just KILL Whisperdoom? She's not magically invulnerable or anything. She has AC, DR, and hitpoints, all of which a level 12+ warrior should be able to overcome by swinging a large sword.

yup, level 14 dwarf ranger, toughness, and enhancements... No draconic vitality yet. 282 hitpoints, to be precise.

And on my (first) time through the room, I was just trying to break the eggs... Got through 18 of them before she killed me.

Self buffed with barkskin, defensive fighting, etc... At about 40 ac.

On my second time back in, I summoned my pet, broke the last two eggs while they killed her, hit my haste clickie, and ran for it. I made it out of the cave, but not to the locked door.

I'm not sure that something taking me down that quickly is anything I'd want to waste my time trying to kill...

It's not hard to get a high level character to that spot in the quest.. Why don't YOU go in and kill her, and let us know how it turns out? I was just finishing off some leftover favor quests that I'd missed while leveling.

I'm not really trying to get advice on how to kill the spider, or even better survival tips. I've been playing for a while now.... I've got a list of my own I could trot out.

I'm just trying to make sure people know that currently, the quest is a little on the imbalanced side in favor of the spider.

[Frodo_Lives]

I ran it on normal and did the whole run past the disarmed traps and jump off the cliff. I ran around the corner and tried to recall, she followed me, right off the cliff! I have run all kinds of characters through that and before I could survive as my lowly rogue, now she will kill my dwarven fighter with almost disgusting ease.

I have run tangleroot many times and I can say with confidence that she is a lot faster, stronger, tougher than before. Like the 6 million dollar spider. Da da da da da da daaaahhhh! (cheezy old sound effects)

It's crazy.

[Osharan_Tregarth]

/snip
I never seem to work the shrine trick. I'm too clumsy.

Heh.. That, plus in one of the recent updates they taught her to open doors...

[Neferi]

Comments in red
Everyone is offering their strategies as if the OP and I can't beat the quest, lol. I've beaten TR more times than I can count. There's always at least 2-3 of the static rewards I want on every new toon I roll. What we wanna know is; WHEN THE HELL DID THEY CHANGE THE SPIDER????

When did anyone say you couldn't beat the quest? Did you actually read the post, or do you just naturally take offense when someone tries to be helpful?

We've all beaten the quest, and SOME of us are trying to point out that there have been changes made to the spider that might necessitate different tactics. Nobody thinks beating that quest gives us license to brag... right?

[Riorik]

I always thought that even the original version of Whisperdoom was never intended to be beaten -I don't recall the specific update, but sometime around six months ago, Whisperdoom was upgraded a bit to make her tougher.

Something that's always been the case, however, is that she runs quickly - just like a few other creatures in the game that can keep up with hasted characters. A couple that come to mind would be the Named Scorpion in Threnal (just north of the original loot-run Giant Caves) and the Jariliths out in the GiantHold.

I am surprised, however, that you weren't still slightly faster. Could you have had your encumbrance up?