The NEW metamagic system

[JelloMold]

I had another request which is sort of along the same line. It would be great if at the beginning of a mission we could set up a series of buffs (I'm thinking mostly of resists) that we want to cast on the party. For example, how many times have you been on a quest where the baddies throw electric, fire, cold & acid? If we could bundle these before the quest you'd only have to throw one "resist package" on each person rather than 4 resists on each one. In the grand scheme of things it really isn't much of an issue, but it would be nice.

[MysticTheurge]

I always imagined that the progress bar for metamagic "stances" was there to replicate the whole "Spontaneous casters take longer to cast spells when they're metamagic'd" thing. Since we are all pretty much spontaneous casters under the given system.

[Tavok]

Here's hoping that particular combination is impossible under the new system, since it would be a level 12 spell.

Hmm... thats kinda funny, because today I went and changed some ENHANCEMENTS.

This is not PnP, get over yourselves.

[dameron]

Hmm... thats kinda funny, because today I went and changed some ENHANCEMENTS.

This is not PnP, get over yourselves.

Cool, enjoy your 14th level spells while they last.

[Tavok]

Cool, enjoy your 14th level spells while they last.

Notice the sig, I don't even have an appropiate leveled caster to use those spells. Not sure how we went from a 12th level spell to a 14th level spell either. But with all the BS the casters have gotten (not saying they aren't good, just saying they have gotten the short end of the stick in reguards to their mana [non-sorc][IMO]), I think it would be unfair to implement that system. Not sure how this works, as I have never played PnP, but Maximized-Empower Firewall (a favorite of most casters I know) would go from a 4th level spell, to an 8th level spell, is kind of absurd. I think the spell point cost increase from metamagics is enough compensation from the fact that it doesn't again spell levels. Also given the fact that we can't reach level 20 yet, I think it would be unfair to make a fairly common spell combonation unavialable to spell casters now.

[dameron]

Notice the sig, I don't even have an appropiate leveled caster to use those spells. Not sure how we went from a 12th level spell to a 14th level spell either. But with all the BS the casters have gotten (not saying they aren't good, just saying they have gotten the short end of the stick in reguards to their mana [non-sorc][IMO]), I think it would be unfair to implement that system. Not sure how this works, as I have never played PnP, but Maximized-Empower Firewall (a favorite of most casters I know) would go from a 4th level spell, to an 8th level spell, is kind of absurd. I think the spell point cost increase from metamagics is enough compensation from the fact that it doesn't again spell levels. Also given the fact that we can't reach level 20 yet, I think it would be unfair to make a fairly common spell combonation unavialable to spell casters now.

Actually it would go from 4th to 9th (+2 for empower +3 for maximize), and yes, I greatly hope they implement a PnP type system with spell level caps, along with appropriate spell point costs for those spells so we'd be paying much less for the spells we can cast (empower would cost +10 spell points, maximize would add another +15).

Then maybe they can turn the monsters back into mere demigods.

[Tavok]

Actually it would go from 4th to 9th (+2 for empower +3 for maximize), and yes, I greatly hope they implement a PnP type system with spell level caps, along with appropriate spell point costs for those spells so we'd be paying much less for the spells we can cast (empower would cost +10 spell points, maximize would add another +15).

Then maybe they can turn the monsters back into mere demigods.

I could see this system in place for level 20, when we have access to more than just 7th level spells, as of now I think it would be unfair to limit spells to the power of level 7. Isn't PnP spells per day or whatever, so how exactly do you come up with the numbers of empower/maximize? Plus, whats the difference if we make spells weaker and monsters weaker, as opposed to making them both stronger, or keeping them status quo, seems to be no difference to me.

EDIT: Beating the dead horse - I know that many want DDO to move closer to PnP, I am not one of them, but I can tell you that that change does not start with the metamagic system.

[dameron]

EDIT: Beating the dead horse - I know that many want DDO to move closer to PnP, I am not one of them, but I can tell you that that change does not start with the metamagic system.

I fail to see how any normalizing of the mobs can happen while casters are still able to drop upwards of 1000hp of damage in an instant. You gotta start somewhere. To be fair they should probably hit melee simultaneously, by removing that extra attack and fixing stunning blow and maybe something like adding an encumbrance to each weapon so they can't carry +4 Greater Banes against every mob in the game, or maybe slow all PC weapon attack by 25%, stuff like that.

[MysticTheurge]

I know that many want DDO to move closer to PnP, I am not one of them

What!? No way!

...but I can tell you that that change does not start with the metamagic system.

Why not? Such a change would require a reworking of quite a few systems, and it has to start somewhere.

[Cambo]

Sublte Backstab....

Learn something new everyday, I thought that was a passive enhancement.

Lol... no wonder I dint notice any difference in Agro...

[Dkmafia]

Why don't they just make Metamagic feats action abillities you can bind to a key; like Block. This way you could simply hold down the key for which Metamagic Feat you wish to use and then press the key for the spell you want coupled with it. Once you release the metamagic-feat-key it's no longer active. Just like Block.

Or perhaps Metamagic Feats could be a screen or a 'layer' that's applied to a specific hotbar that's color coded, letting you know which spells you wish to have used with that Metamagic Feat. Perhaps even multiple layers of different Metamagic Feats could apply to the same hotbar.

Either way I think Metamagic Feats should be something more easily used and deffinitely quicker in response.

In pen & paper you decide a head of time which spells you want affected by certain feats. Or some allow you to simply choose on the spot which spells will be affected by the metamagic feats.

By the way, I've never played a caster in DDO.

Big fan of that idea! And/or I would like a menu to select what spells would be affected by my meta's. I drag a heal into my hot bar I dont want it affected by hieghten, just empower spell, or maybe a copy of it could be affected by both etc.. Basically you choose for each spell or drag it to menu etc.. But his idea is better, shift click and done ..

[Dkmafia]

I fail to see how any normalizing of the mobs can happen while casters are still able to drop upwards of 1000hp of damage in an instant. You gotta start somewhere. To be fair they should probably hit melee simultaneously, by removing that extra attack and fixing stunning blow and maybe something like adding an encumbrance to each weapon so they can't carry +4 Greater Banes against every mob in the game, or maybe slow all PC weapon attack by 25%, stuff like that.

While I agree 1000000%, it will never happen. To hard to take stuff away. We are gods and people still cry if they get hit,tripped,stunned,held etc..

[Gimpster]

Here's hoping that particular combination is impossible under the new system, since it would be a level 12 spell.

That would be somewhat nice, as wizards should not be such powerful "nova" fighters, able to dump 20% of their daily spellpoints into a single mega-blast.

However, the concept of restricting metamagics to increased spell level wouldn't work in DDO, because level 1 wizards can only cast level 1 spells. Yet they are entitled to a free metamagic feat.

[Staedtler]

As long as we're wishing for things to happen to the metamagic system: I'd love it if still spell was added.

Feel free to quote me on this: if still spell is added to the game I will take my full-plate wearing wizard and do nothing but /hug people for an hour.

[MysticTheurge]

However, the concept of restricting metamagics to increased spell level wouldn't work in DDO, because level 1 wizards can only cast level 1 spells. Yet they are entitled to a free metamagic feat.

It would if they simultaneously released some of the metamagic feats which don't increase the level of the spell.

[JayDubya]

A simple, and fairly straightforward technique, although too limiting for some, I'm sure, would be to create 7 "spell combo slots" just like the existing weapon combo slots. You could drag a spell, and then drag a metamagic into the square, and that combo would be something you could drag to your toolbars.

For example, heighten and otto's resistable dance. or Maximize and Scorching Ray.

I know it isn't perfect, ideally you could have multiple metamagics on the same spell. And 7 isn't necessarily the right number either. But this would go a long way towards reducing the accidental casting of maximized FoD, or heightened Heal.

Also - potential favor/Enhancement point use: to buy additional combo slots. Just a thought.

[HumanRogue]

I hope that this improvement means that the math involved in the metamagic enhancements gets fixed. As currently implemented, if you used the 12 action points (2+4+6) to get a 20% discount to your maximize spells and you cast a magic missle (normally costs 10 sp, maximized without enhancements costs 30 sp) you save 2 sp...
So 12 action points means that if you spend 420 sp (15 casts at '20% discount') worth of maximized magic missles to cast ONE extra maximized magic missle. (So a 20% discount for 12 action points equates to about a 6% discount in reality)
I just hope the math gets fixed to make those a little more useful is all...

[Spookydodger]

Why don't they just make Metamagic feats action abillities you can bind to a key; like Block. This way you could simply hold down the key for which Metamagic Feat you wish to use and then press the key for the spell you want coupled with it. Once you release the metamagic-feat-key it's no longer active. Just like Block.

This has long been my preferred fix. I would love to be able to bind metamagic feats to keys.

Though the configured-shortcut bar version would be an acceptable alternative.