Melee attacks on moving mobs

[crschoen]

Hello,

Sorry if this concern has been previously posted (I haven't been keeping up with the posts lately), but for what it's worth, I thought I would make a suggestion to fix some of the game mechanics with regards to melee fighting and moving mobs. I think these types of game mechanics are what makes one game stand out from another. And so far it has always been a big advantage of DDO. But lately it has been more and more frustrating, I think since some of the AI changes to the mobs. The particular problem is with the inability to attack moving mobs. There are 2 common scenarios (virtually every fight encounter) where this occurs:

(1) When a mob gets aggro on a target in the back line, most often a ranger, or a caster. Most rangers draw first blood and hit a mob before the fighters get within combat range The mob will run past the front line fighters. It's very difficult to get a registered hit on a mob moving past you like this. They seem to be almost immune to your weapon swings. The intimidate action doesn't seem to work very effectively here either. I think it worked better before when it took longer to invoke - at least it seemed to have a wider range of effect. I think every fighter has experience running after a moving mob that is chasing a ranger (who is backpedalling/kiting), and taking many swings at the mobs back without getting any dice rolls.

(2) The new AI causes a lot of mobs to "flee" away from you. The game mechanic here is seriously broken, as you don't seem to be able to register any attacks on a mob running from you. In reality you should get a HIGHER attack bonus because you're swinging at his unprotected back.


I think what makes some of this so frustrating is that it doesn't work in vice versa. When you are running from a mob, they have no problem at all registering hits on you, even when not within their attack radius.

[Riddikulus]

Yeah I've noticed this lately too. It seems they reduced the melee "reach" sometime recently so that a melee attack only registers on a mob that is right next to you.

Maybe this was done on purpose to equalize melee with ranged... I've been missing moving mobs ranged for a long time.

[FlyinS]

(2) The new AI causes a lot of mobs to "flee" away from you. The game mechanic here is seriously broken, as you don't seem to be able to register any attacks on a mob running from you. In reality you should get a HIGHER attack bonus because you're swinging at his unprotected back.

I have found this AI change to be quite annoying. I understand and agree that a mob that is ranged focused will try to get away from us, but not to the point of running across the entire world rather than just pulling out a sword.

Combine that with the idea that you don't seem to get an attack roll on them very often when you're chasing them it's just plain annoying.

What I would like to see is more mobs run, but run to go get friends or something. Seems like a more likely scenario than just running aimlessly and endlessly.

[akla_thornfist]

melee attack range has been reduced by at least 50%, ive noticed that you need to be standing inches from your target before an attack lands, forget about trying to hit a running mob its just plain stupid. what drives me nuts the most is rangers and casters in my party running mobs around and all the fighters chasing them around, i gave up chasing now they either kill the mob or the mob kills them.

[DSL]

You can get your hits on them, but you have to "lead" your swings a little by running at least partially alongside them rather than right behind them. WHat seems to happen is that the game registers your position when you start your swing, but checks the enemy position when you complete your swing, by which time a fleeing MOB is out of melee range unless you were closer to the MOB's center along the movement vector.

You should get bonuses to hit based on the MOB moving and you facing it's back, but this is offset by your taking a -4 penalty to hit because you're moving (unless you have Spring Attack).

It is certainly frustrating to have to chase these things halfway accross the map, but often they do move into areas that cause you to draw more aggro, and in any case, I've seen many occasions where PC rangers/casters ended up doing more or less the same thing (I've even done it while soloing with melee characters to try to isolate enemies), so it's not that strange a behaviour.

What is most annoying is that nearly everything you face seems to have the equivalent of barbarian fast movement or 15% striding.

[Riddikulus]

You can get your hits on them, but you have to "lead" your swings a little by running at least partially alongside them rather than right behind them. WHat seems to happen is that the game registers your position when you start your swing, but checks the enemy position when you complete your swing, by which time a fleeing MOB is out of melee range unless you were closer to the MOB's center along the movement vector.

It's worse than this tho... I can be right on the mobs back and it won't do a roll. If I'm swinging a 3' sword, and have an arm reach of about 3' the sword should still be able to connect with a mob up to 6' away...but it just doesn't. Actually at the distance the game requires you to be at to actually connect is not realistic in terms of actually being able to swing a weapon like that and connect unless you have really short stumpy arms.

[tihocan]

And, yes, it's been a regular complaint on these forums. I sure hope they'll try to do something to fix it, as it's quite annoying.

[Roguewiz]

It's worse than this tho... I can be right on the mobs back and it won't do a roll. If I'm swinging a 3' sword, and have an arm reach of about 3' the sword should still be able to connect with a mob up to 6' away...but it just doesn't. Actually at the distance the game requires you to be at to actually connect is not realistic in terms of actually being able to swing a weapon like that and connect unless you have really short stumpy arms.

**Just for the sake of arguement**

Negative. Base reach weapons is 5ft. This can only be modified by:
A. Being of Large or greater Size (not possible in DDO)
B. Having a reach weapon (do not exist in DDO)

[Riddikulus]

**Just for the sake of arguement**

Negative. Base reach weapons is 5ft. This can only be modified by:
A. Being of Large or greater Size (not possible in DDO)
B. Having a reach weapon (do not exist in DDO)

5' is fine. I don't think it's currently 5' in the game though.

[Strakeln]

You can get your hits on them, but you have to "lead" your swings a little by running at least partially alongside them rather than right behind them. WHat seems to happen is that the game registers your position when you start your swing, but checks the enemy position when you complete your swing, by which time a fleeing MOB is out of melee range unless you were closer to the MOB's center along the movement vector.

This is the real problem, and how to get around it until they (hopefully) fix it.

[kailus]

While my Barb can relate very well to the issues you are bringing up here I also want to point out that the opposite issue exists with casters.

My Wizard draws agro before the door is ever opened in most cases and almost immediately has to run. The problem is that when running with my back to the mob, I have to clear X amount of distance between me and the mob or when I turn to flip a fireball the mob is apparently "too close" and takes zero damage on a fireball.

So, essentially, if a mob is toe 2 toe w/me while I'm casting an AOE fireball, they take no damage. If I can keep one step between us, they do.

This is a HUGE problem for casters that draw agro just by drinking tea in the back row. Even with Subtle Spellcasting 3, I don't even have to cast to draw agro.