Spell Point Increase for Clerics

[Mad_Bombardier]

Would a Cleric 13/Sorcerer 1 have more spell points by being able to get double bonus SP from items?

The double SP thing is probably the greatest reason I would make a Cleric 3/Sorcerer 4/MT over a Cleric 3/Wizard 3/MT if MT were ever added to the game.

No, you only get a percentage increase based on your percent Sorc levels.

[dragonruler]

ok after reading everything yall have to say about what i wrote i realize that its me that is having difficulties and that clrs do have enough sp. i think what it is is that im a little ocd so it makes me worry not seeing everyones health at full so im constantly tryin to keep everyones health full.

im gonna work on not tryin so much to keep hp at full. and the whole using 15 wands wasnt an exaggeration but stupid me forgot that that happened when i was doin a chain quest on a setting that i wasnt what i was prepared for.

i have another question is it better for a clr to take a lvl of sorcery? because i didnt know if it would be better to do that for the sp or not does it make that big of a difference? if so i might think of rerollin my new clr.

[Mercules]

ok after reading everything yall have to say about what i wrote i realize that its me that is having difficulties and that clrs do have enough sp. i think what it is is that im a little ocd so it makes me worry not seeing everyones health at full so im constantly tryin to keep everyones health full.

im gonna work on not tryin so much to keep hp at full. and the whole using 15 wands wasnt an exaggeration but stupid me forgot that that happened when i was doin a chain quest on a setting that i wasnt what i was prepared for.

i have another question is it better for a clr to take a lvl of sorcery? because i didnt know if it would be better to do that for the sp or not does it make that big of a difference? if so i might think of rerollin my new clr.

Here is a tip. Find out how many HPs each person has. Next, heal them according to the circumstances. Fighter at 3/4 health in WWs with an Ogre in melee, you might want to top them off. Fighter at half health and no mobs in sight, you might want to get them to 3/4. I still use CLWs even at level 13. CLWs with my Enhancements and Empower Healing, will bump most casters up a significant amount. I've actually used a CLW wand I was given in a level 14 Elite quest to top people off after other healing.

For me Divine Healing is a god-send, no pun intended. I can slap it on a melee in combat to keep them constantly topped off and just use Cure spells when they drop significantly or the DH can't keep up. It also works VERY well on the hard to heal WF.

As for the Sorcerer splash on a Cleric. I've seen people do it, and it isn't horrible, but be aware it will push all your spells back a level. Level 5 Clerics are desired for Remove Curse, level 9 for Raise Dead, and so on. If a group knows they will have an easier time with a certain spell loaded, they will likely be looking for a Cleric that can have that spell. For example, running into a lot of Beholders means having a level 9 Cleric is nice. Scrolls could be used, but they are expensive and while you could run everyone back to a shrine, that means collecting stones under the eye of an angry Beholder.

Then again the Sorcerer splash offers SPs and a side effect of Arcane Wands which can increase utility including buffs you would normally look to an arcane caster for like Stoneskin, Heroism, Blur, all of which can make your Cleric's goal of keeping the team upright a LOT easier.

It is a trade-off.

[Riggs]

Paper D&D clerics got domain spells, ie 1 extra spell per day.

That gave them more spells per day than wizards, and nearly as much as sorcerers. So...by that math, clerics shold be having 20-25% more spell points than a wizard of equal level.

Forget play styles, forget how many buffs you hand out. Clerics HAD more spells than a wizard, it was just that wizard spells were generally more powerful. Why in DDO do they not?

(before someone brings up wizards specializing in a school - that adds some spells, but limits the other spells they can cast, domains do not - its extra spells on top)

[JosephKell]

Paper D&D clerics got domain spells, ie 1 extra spell per day.

If that's all you have to really "boost" the power of PnP Clerics... well, you're funny.

Google "CoDzilla."

-JK

[Klattuu]

I strongly believe that the devs should increase the clerics spell points. i mean being a cleric is hard when your having to spend a ton of money on wands because you dont have enough spell points to heal throughout a quest. I mean on my lvl 5 clr that i recently made, I have given her every possible item to increase her spell points but its still not enough to last through a quest. i went through almost 15 cure mod wands because her spell points run out so fast. When i made her i gave her the highest possible wisdom so as to get more sp. Also i believe there should be a race that gives a +2 to wisdom just like how other races give a +2 to other stats. That would make things a little better for when you go to make a cleric.

Maybe the problem isn't the limits of the Cleric but the demands the party puts on the cleric through the I-can-be-as-reckless-as-I-want-because-the-cleric-can-patch-me-up playstyle.

If the cleric does not have money for wands or the party won't chip in to properly equip their cleric, the party has to work withing the constraints the healer can heal or fail the quest.

It can be done.

[MysticTheurge]

Without getting into the entire debate, I find it interesting that most of the reasons that people present for why clerics have enough spellpoints now are the exact same reasons people gave for why clerics had enough spellpoints before the increase.

[Cowdenicus]

Without getting into the entire debate, I find it interesting that most of the reasons that people present for why clerics have enough spellpoints now are the exact same reasons people gave for why clerics had enough spellpoints before the increase.

Yeah that irony was not lost upon me either.

[Elfvyra]

Paper D&D clerics got domain spells, ie 1 extra spell per day.

That gave them more spells per day than wizards, and nearly as much as sorcerers. So...by that math, clerics shold be having 20-25% more spell points than a wizard of equal level.

Forget play styles, forget how many buffs you hand out. Clerics HAD more spells than a wizard, it was just that wizard spells were generally more powerful. Why in DDO do they not?

(before someone brings up wizards specializing in a school - that adds some spells, but limits the other spells they can cast, domains do not - its extra spells on top)

And so do Specialist Wizards... so what's your point?

[Zenako]

Without getting into the entire debate, I find it interesting that most of the reasons that people present for why clerics have enough spellpoints now are the exact same reasons people gave for why clerics had enough spellpoints before the increase.

I felt I had enough before, and the increase obviously would not reduce that feeling. When playing smart, I had plenty, but if in a group that did not use tactics or party skills or synergy, then I would run out. A well balanced design should be manageable within nominal resources. On normal settings, this is pretty much always the case, on higher settings such as elite, sometimes unless you are very careful about the situation, extra resources will be needed.

[OKCRandy1]

Great thread and many good suggestions for clerics, much of it I've had to learn recently as I've brought my cleric up to lvl 9. I agree it can be expensive to run a cleric, but as many have said it need not be expensive.

I would disagree about PUG's. Although I'm guilded and mostly run with guild groups now and like many have had mixed experiences with PUGS, I find most individuals in DDO are good people and very eager to be cooperative in running a quest. I think perhaps that many people mistake lemmings mentality for rudeness by the entire PUG. For instance, if someone starts zerging through a quest sustaining crazy dmg, many people will think "ohh they know where they are going, I don't want to look like I'm holding them up"(I remember the day when I didn't know better either), and so they follow like lemmings to the inevitable party wipe. However, if they hear the voice of reason making the normal good quest suggestions (use your doorways, slow down and don't take so much damage, don't run out of healing range, be aware if you're blocked for healing, use your shields, utilize buffs, run the baddies through the crowd control spells, etc.), I've found that most people really want to be good sports and will listen. One bad apple can spoil the bunch (please someone give me less tired analogy).

One another side note. I don't think it's brought up often enough that fortification items are extremely important for saving healing and rez! I can tell when I'm running with a group with few having fortification items...when you're running a quest and hear over and over the refrain "Ohh I was critical'ed" immediately after they're red bar took a dive to death. Fort items are relatively cheap and easy to find. I've pulled countless for items myself.

[Material]

First, I have like 1200+ SP as a level 14 cleric. It is usually enough unless I get a little crazy and start killing everything in sight.

The problem with statements like these, is they don't answer anything. If you have 1200+sp, why not tell him your breakdown?

Level 14 would get:

600 base
80 magical training
230 bonus for 30 wis
100 for a magi item
----
1010 total

Where are your remaining 190+?

[Bacab]

I should get to upgrade my Silver Flame Trinket for reading through 2 pages of this thread before realizing...


NECRO POST!

[nivarch]

I should get to upgrade my Silver Flame Trinket for reading through 2 pages of this thread before realizing...


NECRO POST!

Started to read everything, and then realized they were talking of a recent SP increase, and noone even talked of Radiant servant...
That's when I realized it's a beautiful Necro

(And **** why am I bumping this up?)

[zeonardo]

My level 1 cleric has OVER 9000!!
C'mon! ¬¬

What's the point?
- Roll a 28pts, first toon, no player experience cleric.
- But you're not supposed to know how to play a cleric by then, you'd say!!
- Ok. Then roll 28pts, first toon, no player experience barbarian/fighter/ranger/paladin.
- Play sword and board with tower shield and dagger, dual wield those sonic bastard swords like a radio antenna without the feats, take power attack at first level... make devil happy and nobody will care. Nobody will tell you how to play it. You can have fun, take your time to learn by attempt and error.

Clerics can't do that on pugs because people depend on the clerics and not on themselves.
What's worse? Character creation says: Solo ability - Good!
What could possibly go wrong?

I say: roll a battle cleric, solo the hell out of it, have fun and post funny LFM to mock the ones looking for a healer for 2 hours. (Healer on vacation - I'm a battle cleric! - Looking for pikers to scale my dungeon - I can solo that! and so on)

Stats are:
18 str + lvlups
base DEX
16 con at least
base int
leftovers on wis
base cha

Dwarf or human for your first try, but any race would cut it.
Take Empower healling spell on lvl 1 or 3. Whatever other feat you'd like. Experiment. Take Improved Posion Resist! Sap! Or what not. Have fun! Reroll, do it over again!
Group up when you want, but don't feel bad if ppl decide to kill themselves.

Tired of people who play uber toons, with thousand alts to pimp it up saying that playing a cleric is easy.

That's why we don't have +2 wis race, only ONE +7 wis item, ridiculous spell selection, no dominion, no finished PrE (and still it's a healbot PrE), ridiculous enhancements...

All whe have is MOAR and MOAR uber weapons, khopeshes, Greatswords, +100 seeker gear, uberior element spells power ups, mainstream classes PrEs and elitism.

I spent zillions of plat on wands and scrolls and things I never used on my toons before I realize that It was not me doing it wrong.

I only play divines. And it's tons of fun, but took some time to realize it.
A few years later and my lower level clerics still run out of SP when I pug.

And you know what?
read the sig...

/rant off
blood.... preassure... going... back... to... normal...
Sorry, guys! I had to take this off my chest!

[davidolson22]

Arise thread of the dead. Arise!