Champions!

[Lemdog]

No, this is not a champion complaint thread, it is in fact the opposite! (In a way)

As it stands, champions pose minor to no threat to me in heroic or even epic content. I feel that they should be much more dangerous to groups or soloers (or these could possibly be good ideas for reaper!) Here are some ways I would like to improve that:

1. Make Red-crowned champions. Champions that have all possible champion buffs plus a random special buff like a vorpal that ignores deathblock or deathward, and has no save for example. I don't see an issue with the proposed example of no save vorpal because anybody could die from it thus keeping even elite players on their toes (maybe) . Make red crowned champions spawn maybe 3% of the time. Maybe for reaper have red crown champions take the place of gold crown champions?

2. Give champions the ability to inflict no save debuffs on players (Yeah, they already do, but these debuffs should be more detrimental. For example, a debuff for 5 seconds that reduces the player's damage by 60%-80% or something like that). Yeah i know they kinda already have this via elemental and physical absorption buffs, but I'm talking a debuff that applies to all kinds of damage.

3. This idea will probably be the most hated, and i don't particularly prefer it, but give champions either insane amounts of damage (NOT one shot damage, but perhaps two or three shot depending on your PRR or health) or (eww) insane amounts of hitpoints.


These are just my ideas, so feel free to leave feedback or even be critical of my ideas. Perhaps this could be improved and actually turn into a possibility for Epic elite or theoretical Epic reaper difficulties.

[SiliconScout]

All I really want is that anything they make "Reaper" difficulty take at least a couple days, if not a couple of weeks for a solo completion. Hell it would be nice to see it take a couple days to a week to see a group complete to be honest.

Making yet another difficulty that is completable by the majority is simply a complete waste of dev resources IMHO.

[Vellrad]

copy pasting gif:

[UurlockYgmeov]

One Word: Goldilocks.

[Darkmits]

No, this is not a champion complaint thread, it is in fact the opposite! (In a way)

As it stands, champions pose minor to no threat to me in heroic or even epic content. I feel that they should be much more dangerous to groups or soloers (or these could possibly be good ideas for reaper!) Here are some ways I would like to improve that:

1. Make Red-crowned champions. Champions that have all possible champion buffs plus a random special buff like a vorpal that ignores deathblock or deathward, and has no save for example. I don't see an issue with the proposed example of no save vorpal because anybody could die from it thus keeping even elite players on their toes (maybe) . Make red crowned champions spawn maybe 3% of the time. Maybe for reaper have red crown champions take the place of gold crown champions?

2. Give champions the ability to inflict no save debuffs on players (Yeah, they already do, but these debuffs should be more detrimental. For example, a debuff for 5 seconds that reduces the player's damage by 60%-80% or something like that). Yeah i know they kinda already have this via elemental and physical absorption buffs, but I'm talking a debuff that applies to all kinds of damage.

3. This idea will probably be the most hated, and i don't particularly prefer it, but give champions either insane amounts of damage (NOT one shot damage, but perhaps two or three shot depending on your PRR or health) or (eww) insane amounts of hitpoints.


These are just my ideas, so feel free to leave feedback or even be critical of my ideas. Perhaps this could be improved and actually turn into a possibility for Epic elite or theoretical Epic reaper difficulties.

Champions are a bandaid fix in a much larger problem, player power creep. FotM builds have so much power in them that they simply don't allow monsters to get off 2-3 attacks before they die. Simply buffing enemies will make the game impossible for those who have not yet reached that power level. Toning down FotM builds, reducing the availability of instakill mechanics to players and toning down all self-sufficiency for damage-oriented builds should be at priority, but those would cause more anger amongst the playerbase.

Check items. Some items have budgets too high for their level. I take a very random example from U28: Epic Ship Kickers. Ins Dex +4 is definitely a +4 budget, if not higher. Riposte X is +10. Balance +20 is +10. Yellow augment +2, Green +3. And I'm not even including the set bonuses or possible mythic bonus. If such item dropped as random treasure, it'd have min level of 57. Or let's check Fellblade. +13 Enhancement is +13. Improved Banishing definitely at least a +4 (oh look, an instakill property). Sovereign Vorpal at least a +1 (oh look, another instakill mechanic). Axiomatic X is +10. Armor-piercing 20%... shall we say +2? Doublestrike 15% is definitely +5 at least. And +5 from augments. That's an item with +35 value when I've assigned outstandingly low budget values to some of its properties. Granted it comes from a raid, so it has to be more powerful than other items of its level. But look how much more power it grants! This is an item that even with Wondrous Craftsmanship, +2 Jewel, Guild bonus and Greater Dragonmark of Finding, you wouldn't see it drop in anything below a lvl60 quest. Or if we try to put it in other words, its an item designed to be used against CR 70+ enemies. What CRs are you fighting in EE quests? Highest I remember seeing is 69.

When they design the game to give extraordinarily powerful rewards to players, it should be of no surprise that content is roflstomped. Changing current content to accommodate this player power creep will only make it unbearable for those who haven't reached that point in power creep yet. They need to release new content to challenge such players, but that new content will have to also reward even better equipment. Which means even higher player power against previous content. Turbine let scaling go out of hand, and now they can't keep it in control.

[Robbenklopper]

No, this is not a champion complaint thread, it is in fact the opposite! (In a way)

As it stands, champions pose minor to no threat to me in heroic or even epic content. I feel that they should be much more dangerous to groups or soloers (or these could possibly be good ideas for reaper!) Here are some ways I would like to improve that:

1. Make Red-crowned champions. Champions that have all possible champion buffs plus a random special buff like a vorpal that ignores deathblock or deathward, and has no save for example. I don't see an issue with the proposed example of no save vorpal because anybody could die from it thus keeping even elite players on their toes (maybe) . Make red crowned champions spawn maybe 3% of the time. Maybe for reaper have red crown champions take the place of gold crown champions?

2. Give champions the ability to inflict no save debuffs on players (Yeah, they already do, but these debuffs should be more detrimental. For example, a debuff for 5 seconds that reduces the player's damage by 60%-80% or something like that). Yeah i know they kinda already have this via elemental and physical absorption buffs, but I'm talking a debuff that applies to all kinds of damage.

3. This idea will probably be the most hated, and i don't particularly prefer it, but give champions either insane amounts of damage (NOT one shot damage, but perhaps two or three shot depending on your PRR or health) or (eww) insane amounts of hitpoints.


These are just my ideas, so feel free to leave feedback or even be critical of my ideas. Perhaps this could be improved and actually turn into a possibility for Epic elite or theoretical Epic reaper difficulties.

That won´t be enough. Please Change "Reaper" into "Reality" or "Corerules" and give them 1:1 all feats and abilitys we have and scale down their HP.

[MaeveTuohy]

Champions are a bandaid fix in a much larger problem, player power creep. FotM builds have so much power in them that they simply don't allow monsters to get off 2-3 attacks before they die. Simply buffing enemies will make the game impossible for those who have not yet reached that power level. Toning down FotM builds, reducing the availability of instakill mechanics to players and toning down all self-sufficiency for damage-oriented builds should be at priority, but those would cause more anger amongst the playerbase.

Check items. Some items have budgets too high for their level. I take a very random example from U28: Epic Ship Kickers. Ins Dex +4 is definitely a +4 budget, if not higher. Riposte X is +10. Balance +20 is +10. Yellow augment +2, Green +3. And I'm not even including the set bonuses or possible mythic bonus. If such item dropped as random treasure, it'd have min level of 57. Or let's check Fellblade. +13 Enhancement is +13. Improved Banishing definitely at least a +4 (oh look, an instakill property). Sovereign Vorpal at least a +1 (oh look, another instakill mechanic). Axiomatic X is +10. Armor-piercing 20%... shall we say +2? Doublestrike 15% is definitely +5 at least. And +5 from augments. That's an item with +35 value when I've assigned outstandingly low budget values to some of its properties. Granted it comes from a raid, so it has to be more powerful than other items of its level. But look how much more power it grants! This is an item that even with Wondrous Craftsmanship, +2 Jewel, Guild bonus and Greater Dragonmark of Finding, you wouldn't see it drop in anything below a lvl60 quest. Or if we try to put it in other words, its an item designed to be used against CR 70+ enemies. What CRs are you fighting in EE quests? Highest I remember seeing is 69.

When they design the game to give extraordinarily powerful rewards to players, it should be of no surprise that content is roflstomped. Changing current content to accommodate this player power creep will only make it unbearable for those who haven't reached that point in power creep yet. They need to release new content to challenge such players, but that new content will have to also reward even better equipment. Which means even higher player power against previous content. Turbine let scaling go out of hand, and now they can't keep it in control.

Bravo.

[PermaBanned]

That won´t be enough. Please Change "Reaper" into "Reality" or "Corerules" and give them 1:1 all feats and abilitys we have and scale down their HP.

There a whole bunch of high powered player made builds on these forums. They ought to use a good selection of 'em as Reaper Mode monster templates.

[gaffneyks]

no...please god no.....

Champions failed.......let's just face it and move on.

Last thing this game needs is something else to divide the community.......

Remove them and make a level for the "best of the best"....you can call it Reaper, or UBER or even Tom Brady if you want...I don't care...but
no more messing with champions trying to make roses out of a pile of dog ****.......

Please...please don't force Champions on everyone again......The forums would fill up for weeks.......

Can we just drop this.....geez....

[Dendrix]

Your suggestions are far too weak.

A single hit or damage spell from a champion should do 1/2 your maxiumum hit points + 1 irrespective of your PRR or MRR, that makes them appropriately dangerous.
You should only be able to save against champion spells if you roll a 20
Champions should only ever fail saves against your spells if they roll a 20

That makes DDO properly challenging for you.

[Lemdog]

Your suggestions are far too strong.

A single hit or damage spell from a champion should do 1/2 your maximum hit points + 1 irrespective of your PRR or MRR, that makes them appropriately dangerous.
You should only be able to save against champion spells if you roll a 20
Champions should only ever fail saves against your spells if they roll a 1

That makes DDO properly challenging for you.

ftfy

But in all seriousness, yeah i do want to make champions deal that much, but not every mob. That would be a little ridiculous.

[Lemdog]

no...please god no.....

Champions failed.......let's just face it and move on.

Last thing this game needs is something else to divide the community.......

Remove them and make a level for the "best of the best"....you can call it Reaper, or UBER or even Tom Brady if you want...I don't care...but
no more messing with champions trying to make roses out of a pile of dog ****.......

Please...please don't force Champions on everyone again......The forums would fill up for weeks.......

Can we just drop this.....geez....

Hey, you casuals have 3 difficulties. Casual, normal, and hard. They're there for a reason.

[gaffneyks]

Hey, you casuals have 3 difficulties. Casual, normal, and hard. They're there for a reason.

lol.....

No, I am just a veteran who doesn't think adding a bunch of hp punching bags to quest makes them more difficult to run or fun.


Maybe I had just played this game to long. What happened to the vale type quest.....how about adding some random traps? Some Random Puzzles to solve?

On second thought. Lets just make every monster a champion and have them drop fragments of the champion and if you collect 1 billion you get +5 tome.

That will make the game a challenge.