Enchantment

[bigdmag]

Can you get your enchantment DC's high enough to be useful in EE? Has anyone tried charming EE mobs and letting them beat each other? Just curious what the highest DC achievable would be and if it would be reliably landed in EE. My original wizzy was specced for enchantment ( that was a few years ago, and has since TR's many times) and I used to enjoy watching large groups dance and/or be held while others beat on them. Was thinking about maybe TR'ing again but was curious about the CC abilities of such a build now a days.

[Thalone]

Charms do not work very well in epic (see Epic Ward), no matter your DC.

My Wizard runs with 64 Necro DC, 58 Conjuration, and 56 Enchantment. The effectiveness depends heavily on the quest CR. In anything EE in Eberron that isn't Gianthold, these are very solid. They also work in MoTU content. Starting in the High Road, I have to start using debuffs to help land Necro spells, but targeting weak saves still works well. However, I have found these DCs to be useless in EE Gianthold, even with debuffing. I haven't played Shadowfell and can't comment on that.

As for max DCs, see here. I believe this thread is maintained.

[Humperdink]

Charms do not work very well in epic (see Epic Ward), no matter your DC.

What Thalone said. More specifically:

"Epic enemies break out of charm-type spells faster than non-epic quests. Charms have roughly 1/8th to 1/16th their normal duration."

On Epic Normal and below, all the way down to Heroic Casual Charms/Suggestions/Dominate work as you remember- normal spell durations and behavior. In Epic Hard and above those spells only last about 15 seconds or less. This means their only real value in EH/EE is in emergency situations. Casting a quickened Mass Charm/Suggestion can shift agro and take a lot of monsters out of the fight which can allow actions like raise other players, follow up with Otto's Dancing Ball or Mass Hold.

In EE the mainstay of an enchantment focused arcane caster continues to be Mass Hold and Otto's Dancing Ball. What I tend to do on my enchantment focused pale master is cast mass hold followed by Area of Effect damage spells as hold boost spell damage 1.5 times. Combine with Energy Burst from Draconic Epic Destiny and it's a lot of fun.

On the very hardest mobs combine debuffs with your CC- Crushing Despair, Mind Fog, Hypnotism, Wail of the Banshee (it will catch a few of the mob you have gathered up and negative levels equals lower saves on the ones left alive) all lower the will save of the target and hence effectively increase your spell DC. In fast play I use Quickened Crushing Despair (-5 debuff) followed by Mass Hold Monster. Or I single target mobs with the Hypnotism and single Hold Monster SLA you get from the wizard Enchantment archmage focus. If staging for a tough stand off area I cast Mind Fog followed by Otto's Dancing Ball before the mobs appear/are gathered.

Read the guide Thalone linked. Focus on doing everything you can to max your Enchantment DC. If in doubt substitute the word Enchantment for Necro, as his guide is for a Necro focused Pale Master.

[PhotoRob]

Charms do not work very well in epic (see Epic Ward), no matter your DC.

"Epic enemies have massive amounts of experience against adventurers that form an Epic Ward against many attack types. "

Huh. Shouldn't *WE* have something like epic ward as well? I mean, we have "massive amounts of experience" against monsters by epic levels.

[Spoonwelder]

"Epic enemies have massive amounts of experience against adventurers that form an Epic Ward against many attack types. "

Huh. Shouldn't *WE* have something like epic ward as well? I mean, we have "massive amounts of experience" against monsters by epic levels.

I don't get experience if I die....why do mobs?