always wanted repeater build, please comment

[Ormagnag]

Maybe first introduce myself

I am former euro player.
I have four char a 11 full paladin, 14wiz/rog halfling dragonmarked(not sure i wanne continue this char), 12 wiz/rog wf(can semi melee and cast as the best), 7 exploiter dwarf(not sure i wanne continu this one)

I was always intrested in making a ranged build using repeaters and bows. My problem with the following build that i am not sure of:

-I think it will only start to work out very late and even then me not sure
-I hope my to hit will be enough since all my level up go to int.
-I am not sure about powerattack any other suggestions?
-I went with ranger cause i like all the free feats i get, i like the little bit of spells i can cast(ram's might and the plus spot spell and resist are among the ones that intrest me the most), fighter for bonus feats and extra str(could have gone 13 ranger but would not give much nor would 9 rogue), rogue 7(mechanic 1 and sneak attack 3)
-i am aware that i have 8 wis so no spell, but all ranger spells are rather long lasting buffs so i will switch an item just to cast)

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.34
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Baelrath 
Level 20 True Neutral Elf Female
(2 Fighter \ 7 Rogue \ 11 Ranger) 
Hit Points: 242
Spell Points: 245 
BAB: 18\18\23\28\28
Fortitude: 13
Reflex: 17
Will: 4

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
Abilities        Base Stats          Modified Stats
(32 Point)       (Level 1)             (Level 20)
Strength             16                    17
Dexterity            16                    20
Constitution         12                    12
Intelligence         16                    23
Wisdom                8                     8
Charisma              8                     8

Tomes Used
+2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 7

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Skills         Modified Skills
Skills           (Level 1)            (Level 20)
Balance               7                    28
Bluff                -1                    -1
Concentration         1                    24
Diplomacy             3                    22
Disable Device        7                    33
Haggle                3                    22
Heal                 -1                    -1
Hide                  6                     8
Intimidate           -1                    -1
Jump                  5                     5
Listen               -1                     1
Move Silently         6                     8
Open Lock             7                    16
Perform              n/a                   n/a
Repair                3                     8
Search                7                    33
Spot                  3                    23
Swim                  3                     3
Tumble                7                     9
Use Magic Device      3                    22

Level 1 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+4)
Skill: Diplomacy (+4)
Skill: Disable Device (+4)
Skill: Haggle (+4)
Skill: Hide (+3)
Skill: Jump (+2)
Skill: Move Silently (+3)
Skill: Open Lock (+4)
Skill: Search (+4)
Skill: Spot (+4)
Skill: Tumble (+4)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+4)
Feat: (Selected) Point Blank Shot


Level 2 (Ranger)
Skill: Concentration (+2)
Skill: Diplomacy (+0.5)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Undead


Level 3 (Ranger)
Skill: Concentration (+2)
Skill: Diplomacy (+0.5)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Exotic Weapon Proficiency: Repeating Heavy Crossbow


Level 4 (Ranger)
Skill: Concentration (+2)
Skill: Diplomacy (+0.5)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 5 (Ranger)
Skill: Concentration (+2)
Skill: Diplomacy (+0.5)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 6 (Ranger)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Diplomacy (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Giant
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Focus: Ranged Weapons


Level 7 (Ranger)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Diplomacy (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 8 (Ranger)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Diplomacy (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 9 (Ranger)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Diplomacy (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Mental Toughness


Level 10 (Ranger)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Diplomacy (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 11 (Ranger)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Diplomacy (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Evil Outsider


Level 12 (Ranger)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Diplomacy (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Ranged Weapons


Level 13 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+3)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Diplomacy (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+4)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 14 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+3)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Diplomacy (+3)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+2)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 15 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+4)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Diplomacy (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+3)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Toughness


Level 16 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+5)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Diplomacy (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+2)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 17 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Diplomacy (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+3)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+3)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 18 (Fighter)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Improved Critical: Slashing Weapons
Feat: (Selected) Rapid Reload


Level 19 (Fighter)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Power Attack


Level 20 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+3)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Diplomacy (+3)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+3)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Rogue Haste Boost I
Enhancement: Rogue Skill Boost I
Enhancement: Rogue Skill Boost II
Enhancement: Ranger Sprint Boost I
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Acid Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Explosive Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Force Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Force Burst Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Slaying Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Terror Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Dexterity I
Enhancement: Elven Dexterity II
Enhancement: Valenar Elf Melee Attack I
Enhancement: Valenar Elf Melee Damage I
Enhancement: Valenar Elf Melee Damage II
Enhancement: Elven Ranged Attack I
Enhancement: Elven Ranged Damage I
Enhancement: Elven Ranged Damage II
Enhancement: Rogue Electric Trap Lore I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Damage I
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Damage II
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Damage III
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Conjure +2 Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Conjure +3 Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Conjure +4 Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Conjure +5 Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer I
Enhancement: Rogue Mechanic I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training II
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training III
Enhancement: Rogue Disable Device I
Enhancement: Rogue Disable Device II
Enhancement: Rogue Open Lock I
Enhancement: Rogue Open Lock II
Enhancement: Ranger Energy of the Wild I
Enhancement: Ranger Energy of the Wild II
Enhancement: Ranger Dexterity I
Enhancement: Ranger Dexterity II
Enhancement: Fighter Strength I
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness I
Enhancement: Rogue Improved Trap Sense I

Any suggestions welcome.

[unbongwah]

The most obvious shortcomings I see:
(A) Rangers & crossbows aren't a great mix, as Bow STR & Manyshot don't work with crossbows.
(B) AA abilities don't apply to crossbows.
(C) You would only get sneak attacks with ranged weapons if you were within 30 ft of the target; and as a rogue / ranger, you'd do more DPS with TWF anyway. [Well, maybe once you had IPS you could do well shooting through mobs.]
(D) Switching ammo types mid-combat is a PITA, because IIRC you can't simply hotkey it to your toolbar; you have to open up your inventory and switch it manually.

So basically you're taking an AA ranger, pumping up your INT (to the detriment of your other stats), sacrificing your ranger capstone (which lowers your endgame ranged DPS), and burning two feats so you can do a bit more DPS with heavy repeaters (after lvl 17) when you don't want to use your longbow - which would probably still do more DPS as an AA even when Manyshot is on cooldown.

I'm not convinced heavy repeaters are worth it even with the U5 Mechanic changes. But if you do want a heavy repeater build, I would drop AA & ranger entirely, focus solely on repeaters, and do some sort of Mechanic / Kensai build, maybe with a monk splash. I would go halfling (for the SA bonuses), human (for extra feat), or drow (for extra INT) rather than elf.

[Ormagnag]

Thanks for the advice

I am aware that bow str and manyshot dont work with crossbow, also about the aa not working for crossbows.

I dont mind being within 30 feet to be honest.

The idea is to crossbow all the time unless multishot is up. i had a similar char on euroservers but this may be better.

I like ranger over fighter kensai. Cause as ranger i get almost all the feats for free. I dont have to have 19 dex. I also like the spells(rams might and the spot bonus spell come to mind) Rams might and favorite enemy give a decent boost to bow and crossbow damage unless i am wrong about that but pretty sure it adds.

I also like the fact i have lots of skills i like. And if the party does not like ranged i am capable of doing some twf.

However the fact i post the build here is certainly cause me still in doubt. It will probably not be an uber build but it could be ok i think, sure takes a while to mature.

I tried working out a rogue/figther mechanic kensai but it did not really appeal to me(on paper).
Maybe going human and forgetting about aa could work. But me not to sure what to take if i dont take aa.

Keep any tips or suggestions coming.

[Ormagnag]

As stated above i tried thinking out a kensai arcane archer build or repeater build but it could not please me.
But i still wanted to take into account the remarks i got.

So i tried to come up with something fully going for the repeater and dropping bow entirely.

I came up with a bard 14/rogue 6. Getting the nice buffs from bard lots of skills.
Drow cause then i can combine elven dex and rogue dex to enhance my dex and put my level up points in int.

Basically i can handle most traps i think, i have some decent buffing to hand out, i have very powerfull songs
and i can do some dps assistance with repeaters.

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.34
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Level 20 True Neutral Drow Male
(6 Rogue \ 14 Bard) 
Hit Points: 202
Spell Points: 438 
BAB: 14\14\19\24
Fortitude: 7
Reflex: 20
Will: 10

                  Starting            Ending          Feat/Enhancement
Abilities        Base Stats         Base Stats         Modified Stats
(28 Point)       (Level 1)          (Level 20)           (Level 20)
Strength             14                 14                   14
Dexterity            18                 19                   23
Constitution         12                 12                   12
Intelligence         16                 23                   23
Wisdom                8                  8                    8
Charisma             10                 10                   12

Tomes Used
+2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 7
+1 Tome of Dexterity used at level 17

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Skills         Modified Skills
Skills           (Level 1)            (Level 20)
Balance               8                    29
Bluff                 0                     1
Concentration         1                     1
Diplomacy             4                    26
Disable Device        7                    33
Haggle                4                    24
Heal                 -1                    -1
Hide                  8                    10
Intimidate            0                     1
Jump                  5                     7
Listen               -1                     3
Move Silently         8                    10
Open Lock             8                    22
Perform               n/a                  28
Repair                3                     8
Search                7                    33
Spot                  3                    26
Swim                  2                     2
Tumble                5                     7
Use Magic Device      4                    24

Level 1 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Rapid Reload


Level 2 (Bard)


Level 3 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Point Blank Shot


Level 4 (Rogue)


Level 5 (Rogue)


Level 6 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Precise Shot


Level 7 (Rogue)


Level 8 (Bard)


Level 9 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Toughness


Level 10 (Bard)


Level 11 (Bard)


Level 12 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Ranged Weapons


Level 13 (Bard)


Level 14 (Bard)


Level 15 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Rapid Shot


Level 16 (Bard)


Level 17 (Bard)


Level 18 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Precise Shot


Level 19 (Bard)


Level 20 (Bard)
Enhancement: Rogue Haste Boost I
Enhancement: Rogue Skill Boost I
Enhancement: Rogue Skill Boost II
Enhancement: Bard Extra Song I
Enhancement: Bard Extra Song II
Enhancement: Bard Extra Song III
Enhancement: Bard Extra Song IV
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Attack I
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Attack II
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Damage I
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Damage II
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Damage III
Enhancement: Bard Lingering Song I
Enhancement: Bard Lingering Song II
Enhancement: Bard Music of Makers
Enhancement: Bard Music of the Dead
Enhancement: Bard Virtuoso I
Enhancement: Elven Dexterity I
Enhancement: Elven Dexterity II
Enhancement: Rogue Electric Trap Lore I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
Enhancement: Rogue Mechanic I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training II
Enhancement: Rogue Wrack Construct I
Enhancement: Rogue Disable Device I
Enhancement: Rogue Disable Device II
Enhancement: Rogue Open Lock I
Enhancement: Rogue Open Lock II
Enhancement: Bard Perform I
Enhancement: Bard Perform II
Enhancement: Bard Energy of the Music I
Enhancement: Bard Energy of the Music II
Enhancement: Bard Charisma I
Enhancement: Bard Charisma II
Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity I
Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity II
Enhancement: Rogue Improved Trap Sense I

The problems i see.
I can only use light repeaters unless rapid shot does not do much then i can switch that for heavy repeater.
The first few levels as rogue i cant use a repeater while i do take feats towards my goal of using a repeater. Maybe i should take exotic heavy repeater at three and then respec it at 9.
Improved precise shot i only get at 18.

Is this better then my first idea. I have no idea if it will be good enough but the bard appeals to me more then my first ranger idea.

Damage with repeater? lets say i got a +3 holy burst repeater flame bolts with flame arrow wand

1d8 + 3 + 2d6(holy) + 1d6(fire) + 6(songs) + 10(int) = 34 nothing uber but still nice i think probably could be more with better gear.
I also get to use various fun repeaters that are not about damage


maybe i could also go 12str 17 dex( would need +2dex tome) and 18 int. A bit more damage and another skill i can max out.

Suggestions welcome

[stormarcher]

As stated above i tried thinking out a kensai arcane archer build or repeater build but it could not please me.
But i still wanted to take into account the remarks i got.

So i tried to come up with something fully going for the repeater and dropping bow entirely.

I came up with a bard 14/rogue 6. Getting the nice buffs from bard lots of skills.
Drow cause then i can combine elven dex and rogue dex to enhance my dex and put my level up points in int.

Basically i can handle most traps i think, i have some decent buffing to hand out, i have very powerfull songs
and i can do some dps assistance with repeaters.

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.34
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Level 20 True Neutral Drow Male
(6 Rogue \ 14 Bard) 
Hit Points: 202
Spell Points: 438 
BAB: 14\14\19\24
Fortitude: 7
Reflex: 20
Will: 10

                  Starting            Ending          Feat/Enhancement
Abilities        Base Stats         Base Stats         Modified Stats
(28 Point)       (Level 1)          (Level 20)           (Level 20)
Strength             14                 14                   14
Dexterity            18                 19                   23
Constitution         12                 12                   12
Intelligence         16                 23                   23
Wisdom                8                  8                    8
Charisma             10                 10                   12

Tomes Used
+2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 7
+1 Tome of Dexterity used at level 17

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Skills         Modified Skills
Skills           (Level 1)            (Level 20)
Balance               8                    29
Bluff                 0                     1
Concentration         1                     1
Diplomacy             4                    26
Disable Device        7                    33
Haggle                4                    24
Heal                 -1                    -1
Hide                  8                    10
Intimidate            0                     1
Jump                  5                     7
Listen               -1                     3
Move Silently         8                    10
Open Lock             8                    22
Perform               n/a                  28
Repair                3                     8
Search                7                    33
Spot                  3                    26
Swim                  2                     2
Tumble                5                     7
Use Magic Device      4                    24

Level 1 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Rapid Reload


Level 2 (Bard)


Level 3 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Point Blank Shot


Level 4 (Rogue)


Level 5 (Rogue)


Level 6 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Precise Shot


Level 7 (Rogue)


Level 8 (Bard)


Level 9 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Toughness


Level 10 (Bard)


Level 11 (Bard)


Level 12 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Ranged Weapons


Level 13 (Bard)


Level 14 (Bard)


Level 15 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Rapid Shot


Level 16 (Bard)


Level 17 (Bard)


Level 18 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Precise Shot


Level 19 (Bard)


Level 20 (Bard)
Enhancement: Rogue Haste Boost I
Enhancement: Rogue Skill Boost I
Enhancement: Rogue Skill Boost II
Enhancement: Bard Extra Song I
Enhancement: Bard Extra Song II
Enhancement: Bard Extra Song III
Enhancement: Bard Extra Song IV
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Attack I
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Attack II
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Damage I
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Damage II
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Damage III
Enhancement: Bard Lingering Song I
Enhancement: Bard Lingering Song II
Enhancement: Bard Music of Makers
Enhancement: Bard Music of the Dead
Enhancement: Bard Virtuoso I
Enhancement: Elven Dexterity I
Enhancement: Elven Dexterity II
Enhancement: Rogue Electric Trap Lore I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
Enhancement: Rogue Mechanic I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training II
Enhancement: Rogue Wrack Construct I
Enhancement: Rogue Disable Device I
Enhancement: Rogue Disable Device II
Enhancement: Rogue Open Lock I
Enhancement: Rogue Open Lock II
Enhancement: Bard Perform I
Enhancement: Bard Perform II
Enhancement: Bard Energy of the Music I
Enhancement: Bard Energy of the Music II
Enhancement: Bard Charisma I
Enhancement: Bard Charisma II
Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity I
Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity II
Enhancement: Rogue Improved Trap Sense I

The problems i see.
I can only use light repeaters unless rapid shot does not do much then i can switch that for heavy repeater.
The first few levels as rogue i cant use a repeater while i do take feats towards my goal of using a repeater. Maybe i should take exotic heavy repeater at three and then respec it at 9.
Improved precise shot i only get at 18.

Is this better then my first idea. I have no idea if it will be good enough but the bard appeals to me more then my first ranger idea.

Damage with repeater? lets say i got a +3 holy burst repeater flame bolts with flame arrow wand

1d8 + 3 + 2d6(holy) + 1d6(fire) + 6(songs) + 10(int) = 34 nothing uber but still nice i think probably could be more with better gear.
I also get to use various fun repeaters that are not about damage


maybe i could also go 12str 17 dex( would need +2dex tome) and 18 int. A bit more damage and another skill i can max out.

Suggestions welcome

This build looks like a much better build as you can self buff and get the Warchanter PrE