Anybody ever try a build like this? 3 rogue/ 4 Paladin / 13 Ranger

[Ragnborg]

I wanted to make a heavy armour, dual wielding ranger, that played somewhat like the ranger I played in BG/BG2. I like to solo, and be able to do a little of everything. This seems like it would work pretty well.

I'm somewhat familiar with D&D, but new to DDO, so please let me know if there is anything that I missed or could do better, or if there is something about this build that just won't work in this game.

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.10
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Level 20 Lawful Good Elf Male
(4 Paladin \ 3 Rogue \ 13 Ranger) 
Hit Points: 264
Spell Points: 175 
BAB: 19\19\24\29\29
Fortitude: 17
Reflex: 20
Will: 9

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Stats          Modified Stats
Abilities        (Level 1)             (Level 20)
Strength             14                    15
Dexterity            16                    20
Constitution         12                    12
Intelligence         12                    12
Wisdom               10                    10
Charisma             12                    13

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Skills         Modified Skills
Skills           (Level 1)            (Level 20)
Balance               7                    10
Bluff                 5                     7
Concentration         1                     8
Diplomacy             1                     3
Disable Device        5                    19
Haggle                1                     1
Heal                  0                     5
Hide                  3                    15
Intimidate            1                     1
Jump                  4                     8
Listen                2                     9
Move Silently         7                    16
Open Lock             7                    21
Perform               n/a                   n/a
Repair                1                     1
Search                3                    15
Spot                  2                    15
Swim                  2                     2
Tumble                7                    10
Use Magic Device      5                    16

Level 1 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Dodge
Enhancement: Rogue Damage Boost I
Enhancement: Aerenal Elf Melee Damage I
Enhancement: Rogue Faster Sneaking I


Level 2 (Rogue)
Enhancement: Elven Ranged Damage I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Accuracy I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training I


Level 3 (Ranger)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Human
Feat: (Selected) Toughness
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Rogue Disable Device I
Enhancement: Rogue Open Lock I
Enhancement: Rogue Improved Trap Sense I


Level 4 (Paladin)
Enhancement: Elven Dexterity I
Enhancement: Paladin Extra Smite Evil I
Enhancement: Paladin Toughness I


Level 5 (Paladin)
Enhancement: Paladin Armor Class Boost I
Enhancement: Paladin Attack Boost I
Enhancement: Paladin Charisma I


Level 6 (Paladin)
Feat: (Selected) Mobility
Enhancement: Elven Ranged Attack I
Enhancement: Paladin Bulwark of Good I
Enhancement: Paladin Extra Lay on Hands I


Level 7 (Ranger)
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
Enhancement: Ranger Dexterity I


Level 8 (Ranger)
Enhancement: Rogue Haste Boost I
Enhancement: Ranger Skill Boost I
Enhancement: Aerenal Elf Melee Attack I


Level 9 (Ranger)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Piercing Weapons
Enhancement: Elven Dexterity II


Level 10 (Paladin)
Enhancement: Paladin Extra Smite Evil II
Enhancement: Paladin Toughness II


Level 11 (Ranger)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Evil Outsider
Enhancement: Ranger Skill Boost II
Enhancement: Paladin Courage of Good I
Enhancement: Ranger Energy of the Wild I


Level 12 (Ranger)
Feat: (Selected) Spring Attack
Enhancement: Ranger Tempest I


Level 13 (Rogue)
Enhancement: Paladin Armor Class Boost II
Enhancement: Paladin Saves Boost I
Enhancement: Paladin Resistance of Good I


Level 14 (Ranger)
Enhancement: Ranger Dexterity II


Level 15 (Ranger)
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Focus: Piercing Weapons
Enhancement: Ranger Move Silently I
Enhancement: Ranger Energy of the Wild II
Enhancement: Paladin Extra Turning I


Level 16 (Ranger)
Enhancement: Aerenal Elf Melee Attack II


Level 17 (Ranger)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Giant
Enhancement: Paladin Attack Boost II
Enhancement: Paladin Saves Boost II


Level 18 (Ranger)
Feat: (Selected) Two Weapon Defense
Enhancement: Ranger Skill Boost III
Enhancement: Paladin Focus of Good I


Level 19 (Ranger)
Enhancement: Ranger Tempest II


Level 20 (Ranger)
Enhancement: Ranger Extra Action Boost I
Enhancement: Ranger Skill Boost IV

[Thriand]

You can't use evasion while in heavy armor.

[Bosco]

I wanted to make a heavy armour, dual wielding ranger, that played somewhat like the ranger I played in BG/BG2. I like to solo, and be able to do a little of everything. This seems like it would work pretty well.

I'm somewhat familiar with D&D, but new to DDO, so please let me know if there is anything that I missed or could do better, or if there is something about this build that just won't work in this game.

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.10
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Level 20 Lawful Good Elf Male
(4 Paladin \ 3 Rogue \ 13 Ranger) 
Hit Points: 264
Spell Points: 175 
BAB: 19\19\24\29\29
Fortitude: 17
Reflex: 20
Will: 9

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Stats          Modified Stats
Abilities        (Level 1)             (Level 20)
Strength             14                    15
Dexterity            16                    20
Constitution         12                    12
Intelligence         12                    12
Wisdom               10                    10
Charisma             12                    13

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Skills         Modified Skills
Skills           (Level 1)            (Level 20)
Balance               7                    10
Bluff                 5                     7
Concentration         1                     8
Diplomacy             1                     3
Disable Device        5                    19
Haggle                1                     1
Heal                  0                     5
Hide                  3                    15
Intimidate            1                     1
Jump                  4                     8
Listen                2                     9
Move Silently         7                    16
Open Lock             7                    21
Perform               n/a                   n/a
Repair                1                     1
Search                3                    15
Spot                  2                    15
Swim                  2                     2
Tumble                7                    10
Use Magic Device      5                    16

Level 1 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Dodge
Enhancement: Rogue Damage Boost I
Enhancement: Aerenal Elf Melee Damage I
Enhancement: Rogue Faster Sneaking I


Level 2 (Rogue)
Enhancement: Elven Ranged Damage I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Accuracy I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training I


Level 3 (Ranger)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Human
Feat: (Selected) Toughness
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Rogue Disable Device I
Enhancement: Rogue Open Lock I
Enhancement: Rogue Improved Trap Sense I


Level 4 (Paladin)
Enhancement: Elven Dexterity I
Enhancement: Paladin Extra Smite Evil I
Enhancement: Paladin Toughness I


Level 5 (Paladin)
Enhancement: Paladin Armor Class Boost I
Enhancement: Paladin Attack Boost I
Enhancement: Paladin Charisma I


Level 6 (Paladin)
Feat: (Selected) Mobility
Enhancement: Elven Ranged Attack I
Enhancement: Paladin Bulwark of Good I
Enhancement: Paladin Extra Lay on Hands I


Level 7 (Ranger)
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
Enhancement: Ranger Dexterity I


Level 8 (Ranger)
Enhancement: Rogue Haste Boost I
Enhancement: Ranger Skill Boost I
Enhancement: Aerenal Elf Melee Attack I


Level 9 (Ranger)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Piercing Weapons
Enhancement: Elven Dexterity II


Level 10 (Paladin)
Enhancement: Paladin Extra Smite Evil II
Enhancement: Paladin Toughness II


Level 11 (Ranger)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Evil Outsider
Enhancement: Ranger Skill Boost II
Enhancement: Paladin Courage of Good I
Enhancement: Ranger Energy of the Wild I


Level 12 (Ranger)
Feat: (Selected) Spring Attack
Enhancement: Ranger Tempest I


Level 13 (Rogue)
Enhancement: Paladin Armor Class Boost II
Enhancement: Paladin Saves Boost I
Enhancement: Paladin Resistance of Good I


Level 14 (Ranger)
Enhancement: Ranger Dexterity II


Level 15 (Ranger)
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Focus: Piercing Weapons
Enhancement: Ranger Move Silently I
Enhancement: Ranger Energy of the Wild II
Enhancement: Paladin Extra Turning I


Level 16 (Ranger)
Enhancement: Aerenal Elf Melee Attack II


Level 17 (Ranger)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Giant
Enhancement: Paladin Attack Boost II
Enhancement: Paladin Saves Boost II


Level 18 (Ranger)
Feat: (Selected) Two Weapon Defense
Enhancement: Ranger Skill Boost III
Enhancement: Paladin Focus of Good I


Level 19 (Ranger)
Enhancement: Ranger Tempest II


Level 20 (Ranger)
Enhancement: Ranger Extra Action Boost I
Enhancement: Ranger Skill Boost IV

If your putting those level up into points there really is no need for heavy armor, with the class and racial enhancements to dex and armor bracers your ac would be much better wearing robes. Then evasion would work also.

[Vormaerin]

The question has to be: What are you trying to accomplish? You can make a dual wielding ranger in heavy armor without all the multiclassing. Just pick up one level of fighter and you are all set on that score. You'll have stealth (nearly useless in heavy armor, but still), dual wielding, Spot and Search to find (though not remove) traps, and healing spells.

If you want to pick locks and the like, you need to ditch the idea of heavy armor. They are mutually incompatible, as Full Plate is something like -5 to all such skill checks and you can't use Evasion.

[Ragnborg]

The question has to be: What are you trying to accomplish? You can make a dual wielding ranger in heavy armor without all the multiclassing. Just pick up one level of fighter and you are all set on that score. You'll have stealth (nearly useless in heavy armor, but still), dual wielding, Spot and Search to find (though not remove) traps, and healing spells.

If you want to pick locks and the like, you need to ditch the idea of heavy armor. They are mutually incompatible, as Full Plate is something like -5 to all such skill checks and you can use Evasion.

Thanks for the feedback. I never played a rogue in any kind of D&D game, so I didn't realize that it would not work. I did initially want to have the heavy armour, but I only really care about survivability.

My thinking is somewhere along these lines. Number 1 is I wanted strong DPS (doesn't necessarily have to be top tier, but very good). I wanted to primarily be DW melee dps, but also do good ranged dps. I wanted to bring a little utility to a group and provide myself with some self sufficiencey. I got the idea, that It could work very well to add lvlv 4 Paladin in there for the smites and LoH.

I saw that a lot of people splash 1 rogue, so I looked into that. Since I like to solo a lot, I thought being able to pick my own locks and disarm traps could be quite useful. I think after looking over it seemed like what I would be getting with 2 more levels of rogue (a decent boost to sneak attack damage, and trap sense), would be better than what I would get from 2 more levels of ranger. And although, I don;t really understand why, in the character planner, if I started with 2 levels of rogue, I got alot more ability points to use with my ranger (I think if I did 1 rogue I would get 5 on my ranger, when I did 1st 2 levels rogue, I got 7).

So anyway if I wore light armour, would this be a viable solo/group dps/utility? Would it still work with medium armour?

I also have some confusion about UMD. I guess it is good for using healing wands,which is primarily why I thought it was important. Is it good for anything else and would a base 16 UMD be enough?

[Therigar]

The most survivable ranger builds combine monk and either rogue or paladin with ranger.

Ranger gets evasion as its own class feat so there is no need to take more than 1 level of rogue or 1 level of monk. The Exploiter is a well published ranger/rogue/monk build.

All of the builds rely on light or no armor and the ranger's DEX modifier for high AC. Adding in monk pulls in additional AC modifiers (monks allow your WIS bonus to add to AC if you are not wearing armor). Players whose rangers don't have a significant WIS score (left at base 8 or even 6 in the case of warforged) sometimes choose paladin instead of monk as a multiclass.

People choose rogue primarily for access to the Use Magic Device skill. This has lots of potential but sometimes it is more efficient to choose an arcane class instead. As a ranger you already have access to a lot of divine spells and you can use the wands that match those spells. If you take an arcane class as one of your multiclasses then you have access to all of the arcane wands -- all of them. The only thing you will need is to be a high enough character (total levels) so that you can use them.

Let's ask what spells you are likely to use when you solo. Heal, cure whatever wounds, shield, invisibility, remove poison/curse/disease -- I'm sure there are others that people will suggest.

Almost all of these come in wand form. You can't get heal. But, if you are soloing and need to UMD a scroll to heal then you better not be in the middle of a fight in any case!

So, topping off hit points can be done using wands -- not as fast but just as effective. Plus, wands can be used while you turtle up and shield block so can get you through in the middle of a fight as well if you really need to. Same for most of the cure/remove type spells. Yes, scrolls and UMD might save some money -- but if you are soloing a lot then you may want to consider a more efficient choice.

Ultimately, it depends a lot on what you preplanned for the character. If you have a decent WIS and DEX score then ranger/monk/rogue or ranger/monk/paladin could be good for you. If you are relying on DEX for AC and plan to wear armor (and you can wear mithral breastplate which is light armor and still get your evasion) then you might consider ranger/wizard/rogue or ranger/wizard/paladin.

Note that a decent INT score nets you several things with any multiclass ranger build. First off it affects both search and disable device -- so if you are taking rogue as a second class it pays to have a decent INT. Second, it affects total skill points per level. Treating rogue as a cross class and assuming you put points into UMD, DD and search you need 5 skill points to keep these at maximum level. That is easy with a ranger (which is behind rogue in getting the most skill points per level) even with a low INT. But, INT not only increases success rate for search and DD and gives you skill points -- it also opens Combat Expertise as a feat. CE is useful when soloing for boosts to AC when you don't really need other feats active (like power attack).

So, there are benefits to a ranger/wizard/rogue build if you have an INT of 10 or more. First, you can still pursue UMD if you feel it is worthwhile -- if you have a low CHA this may not be such a good deal as it takes a lot of gear to make the UMD actually work. Second, you can use arcane wands. Third, you can double as a rogue for most quests. It is definitely worth considering if you have an INT of 14 or more.

There are also benefits to a ranger/wizard/paladin build if you have an INT of 10 or more. First, you can ignore the UMD craze and get most of what you will want from arcane wands and the cleric wands you'll be able to use as a ranger. Second, with paladin you can get a couple of boosts to AC and to saving throws by going to at least L3 paladin.

A really viable build is ranger 12/paladin 6/wizard 1 with the final level to L20 being up to you (there are +s and -s to taking the final level in each of the three classes).

Well, really long post so I hope you don't miss what I'm trying to get at. Good luck with whatever you choose.

[tihocan]

My thinking is somewhere along these lines. Number 1 is I wanted strong DPS (doesn't necessarily have to be top tier, but very good). I wanted to primarily be DW melee dps, but also do good ranged dps. I wanted to bring a little utility to a group and provide myself with some self sufficiencey.

A popular build that fits this criterion is ranger 18/rogue 1/monk 1, search "exploiter build" on the forums for more info.

[krud]

Almost all of these come in wand form. You can't get heal. But, if you are soloing and need to UMD a scroll to heal then you better not be in the middle of a fight in any case!
.

I do that all the time. It's not that hard to do. I just finished enter the kobold doing just that. Pots, wands and cure serious spell just won't fill back health fast enough. Everyone rolls a 1 every now and then, and -318hp from a failed save on a meteor storm will drop anybody's health bar real quick.

However, you really don't need 3 rogue levels to do it. You could go 15rgr/4pal/1rogue and pick up another favored enemy. You should have enough skill points to do what you need to do. For soloing without any quest knowledge beforehand, you'll need to keep umd, search, spot, dd, ol pretty high (if not max). You can skimp on open lock if you are short points. Alternatively, you can forget the trapsmithing, and just barrel your way through traps, relying on your high reflex save. Though, you should at least invest in open lock, and maybe search.

For armour you can go with armored bracers and robes, or use DT leather (good luck with that grind) or mithral chain shirts.

[whysper]

If you want to pick locks and the like, you need to ditch the idea of heavy armor. They are mutually incompatible, as Full Plate is something like -5 to all such skill checks and you can use Evasion.

You do not get the Armor Check Penalty on Search/Disable/other Roguey skills...it really affects Jump and Swim only, check the Compendium if you need further detail. Each armour also shows the applicable ACP on inspection.

However, the gist is correct in that Evasion does not work in Medium or Heavy armor, and it is pretty important. With a good Dex (20+) you will be OK in less armour too - the best kinds are Mithril Breastplates and Chain Shirts until you get to 28+ Dex at which point you can, depending on gear, just wear robes and armoured bracers or even Mage Armor instead.

[Therigar]

I do that all the time. It's not that hard to do. I just finished enter the kobold doing just that. Pots, wands and cure serious spell just won't fill back health fast enough. Everyone rolls a 1 every now and then, and -318hp from a failed save on a meteor storm will drop anybody's health bar real quick.

Yes Krud. But we know that you are special.

For a new player I'm just trying to suggest that he's probably not quite there yet and building for that right now may be less satisfying than building something a bit less ambitious but more likely to succeed in the early thru mid-level quests that OP is likely playing.

Once OP really has a handle on the game then they can make a choice the other way.

Of course, if they take any rogue levels at all and are primarily ranger they should have enough skill points to max UMD, DD, search and have plenty left over for. So, they can have the best of both worlds.

As I posted earlier, 1 rogue is enough and a 12/6/1 breakdown with the final level going to whichever class makes best sense (rogue likely) would be a better level break down. 15/4/1 also works and the differences really depend on how you value various class perks.

[Talon_Moonshadow]

I would go Pal3/Rog4.

Or Pal6/Rog3/Rgr11

Or Rgr15/Pal3/Rog2

[Ragnborg]

I would go Pal3/Rog4.

Or Pal6/Rog3/Rgr11

Or Rgr15/Pal3/Rog2

Why Paladin 3?

I figured I would rather have the Paladin spells, PAlly toughness 2, extra smites, turn undead. That seems a lot better than what I would get by going to Ranger 14, instead of 13. Am I missing something there?

Same goes for why I picked rogue 3. even though all I really get is extra damage to sneak attack, and a couple extra skill points, it seems like I don't really get anything worthwile at ranger 14. I can see some benefit to going to ranger 15, but I would lose, all the stuff I get from Pally 4, and rogue 3, and all I get in return is another favored enemy. Is that a worthwile trade?

Another question, I can find and disarm traps in heavy armour? I was not sure from a couple of the earlier posts.

If so is the only downside to using heavy armour with my 13 ranger/4 pally/3 rogue setup losing evasion? If so is, is it really worth not wearing heavy armour for Evasion? I'm obviously pretty new to this, but that just seems counter intuitive.

[whysper]

If so is, is it really worth not wearing heavy armour for Evasion?

You need Light or no armour for Evasion, and yes it is.

[Quikster]

Why Paladin 3?

I figured I would rather have the Paladin spells, PAlly toughness 2, extra smites, turn undead. That seems a lot better than what I would get by going to Ranger 14, instead of 13. Am I missing something there?

Same goes for why I picked rogue 3. even though all I really get is extra damage to sneak attack, and a couple extra skill points, it seems like I don't really get anything worthwile at ranger 14. I can see some benefit to going to ranger 15, but I would lose, all the stuff I get from Pally 4, and rogue 3, and all I get in return is another favored enemy. Is that a worthwile trade?

Another question, I can find and disarm traps in heavy armour? I was not sure from a couple of the earlier posts.

If so is the only downside to using heavy armour with my 13 ranger/4 pally/3 rogue setup losing evasion? If so is, is it really worth not wearing heavy armour for Evasion? I'm obviously pretty new to this, but that just seems counter intuitive.

Adding another FE gets you +to damage against all FE.

If you are soloing dont bother with three rog lvls just for 1d6 SA you will rarely see it.

Armor checks dont factor into trapping skills.

Evasion is the only reason to get two levels of rog, drop the heavy armor or drop the second rog level.

Turn Undead is really a weak ability in this game, I personally wouldnt do anything to help me turn undead.

14 ranger gets you access to 4th level spells, Mmmmm Freedom of Movement.

1st level paly spells are not anything you will miss, there is only one you might actually use and it will only give you +1 to damage.

Paly toughness 2 is only 10 HP you can live without it.

If it were me I would go 15 ranger/3 paly/2 rog. 2 rog only because 16 ranger and 4 paly doesnt get you anything worthwhile IMO. Take the second rog level late to get the most out of skill points, and the first rog level first.

[Ragnborg]

A popular build that fits this criterion is ranger 18/rogue 1/monk 1, search "exploiter build" on the forums for more info.

seems interesting, but I think I personally rather have the paladin skills (Smite, LoH, Aura, immunities, etc, buffs), than the monk skills.

[Ragnborg]

Adding another FE gets you +to damage against all FE.

If you are soloing dont bother with three rog lvls just for 1d6 SA you will rarely see it.

Armor checks dont factor into trapping skills.

Evasion is the only reason to get two levels of rog, drop the heavy armor or drop the second rog level.

Turn Undead is really a weak ability in this game, I personally wouldnt do anything to help me turn undead.

14 ranger gets you access to 4th level spells, Mmmmm Freedom of Movement.

1st level paly spells are not anything you will miss, there is only one you might actually use and it will only give you +1 to damage.

Paly toughness 2 is only 10 HP you can live without it.

If it were me I would go 15 ranger/3 paly/2 rog. 2 rog only because 16 ranger and 4 paly doesnt get you anything worthwhile IMO. Take the second rog level late to get the most out of skill points, and the first rog level first.

Thanks, this is very helpful. I wasn't thinking about the ranger spellls at 14. I agree that the lvl 4 ranger spells would be better than the lvl 1 paladin spells.

[Ragnborg]

I redid the build as 15 Ranger/3 Paladin/2 Rogue

I will go light armour.

Not having played this game all the way through yet, are there any better enhancements/feats I should be trying to get, or any that don't really add any value, that I have selected. Also, is there any value in me adding points to bring my Strength up to 17 from 14 like I did, or is it better to just pump all those points into Dexterity? I beefed up my piercing damage, and was planning to dual wield Rapiers. Is there any reason not to do that?

And lastly how are my skills. Will what I have work well enough with this build or do I need to make some changes?

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.10
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Level 20 Lawful Good Elf Male
(3 Paladin \ 2 Rogue \ 15 Ranger) 
Hit Points: 254
Spell Points: 220 
BAB: 19\19\24\29\29
Fortitude: 16
Reflex: 22
Will: 9

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Stats          Modified Stats
Abilities        (Level 1)             (Level 20)
Strength             14                    17
Dexterity            16                    23
Constitution         12                    12
Intelligence         12                    12
Wisdom               10                    10
Charisma             12                    13

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Skills         Modified Skills
Skills           (Level 1)            (Level 20)
Balance               3                     6
Bluff                 5                     5
Concentration         1                     7
Diplomacy             1                     4
Disable Device        5                    21
Haggle                1                     1
Heal                  0                     5
Hide                  5                    15
Intimidate            1                     1
Jump                  3                     5
Listen                1                     9
Move Silently         7                    16
Open Lock             7                    23
Perform               n/a                   n/a
Repair                1                     1
Search                5                    16
Spot                  4                    16
Swim                  2                     3
Tumble                7                    11
Use Magic Device      5                    18

Level 1 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Dodge
Enhancement: Rogue Damage Boost I
Enhancement: Rogue Haste Boost I
Enhancement: Rogue Faster Sneaking I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training I


Level 2 (Ranger)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Human
Enhancement: Elven Ranged Damage I
Enhancement: Rogue Disable Device I
Enhancement: Rogue Open Lock I


Level 3 (Paladin)
Feat: (Selected) Toughness
Enhancement: Elven Dexterity I
Enhancement: Paladin Extra Smite Evil I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I


Level 4 (Paladin)
Enhancement: Paladin Charisma I
Enhancement: Paladin Toughness I
Enhancement: Rogue Improved Trap Sense I


Level 5 (Paladin)
Enhancement: Paladin Courage of Good I
Enhancement: Paladin Bulwark of Good I
Enhancement: Paladin Focus of Good I
Enhancement: Paladin Resistance of Good I


Level 6 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Mobility
Enhancement: Paladin Armor Class Boost I
Enhancement: Paladin Saves Boost I
Enhancement: Paladin Extra Lay on Hands I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Accuracy I


Level 7 (Ranger)
Enhancement: Aerenal Elf Melee Attack I
Enhancement: Ranger Dexterity I


Level 8 (Ranger)
Enhancement: Elven Dexterity II


Level 9 (Ranger)
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Finesse
Enhancement: Ranger Skill Boost I
Enhancement: Aerenal Elf Melee Damage I
Enhancement: Ranger Extra Empathy I


Level 10 (Ranger)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Evil Outsider
Enhancement: Elven Ranged Attack I
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Damage I
Enhancement: Ranger Energy of the Wild I


Level 11 (Ranger)
Enhancement: Ranger Dexterity II


Level 12 (Ranger)
Feat: (Selected) Spring Attack
Enhancement: Ranger Tempest I


Level 13 (Ranger)
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
Enhancement: Ranger Energy of the Wild II


Level 14 (Ranger)
Enhancement: Aerenal Elf Melee Damage II


Level 15 (Ranger)
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Focus: Piercing Weapons
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Damage II


Level 16 (Ranger)
Enhancement: Ranger Dexterity III


Level 17 (Ranger)
Enhancement: Ranger Skill Boost II
Enhancement: Ranger Tempest II


Level 18 (Ranger)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Piercing Weapons
Enhancement: Aerenal Elf Melee Attack II


Level 19 (Ranger)
Enhancement: Elven Ranged Damage II


Level 20 (Ranger)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Giant
Enhancement: Paladin Attack Boost I
Enhancement: Ranger Energy of the Wild III

[Aeneas]

Taking more than 2 paladin levels (and less than 6) is a mistake, take 2 for divine grace if you really want it, then make a triple neg shroud item for the immunities.

I personally would either want 14 or 15 ranger levels. 15 gives you an extra favored enemy and boosts your other FE's, but closes out the potential of taking 6 levels of another class for a first tier PrE. Taking 14 gives you all the right spells and TWF feats etc, and leaves the door open for something like paladin 6 for hunter of the dead and its inherent healing bonus and free ghost touch, or kensai 1 and it's weapon bonus, or frenzied berzerker 1 and extra damage potential coupled with some extra str and con while raging.


Just my 2 cp's.

[Talon_Moonshadow]

Why Paladin 3?

I figured I would rather have the Paladin spells, PAlly toughness 2, extra smites, turn undead. That seems a lot better than what I would get by going to Ranger 14, instead of 13. Am I missing something there?

Same goes for why I picked rogue 3. even though all I really get is extra damage to sneak attack, and a couple extra skill points, it seems like I don't really get anything worthwile at ranger 14. I can see some benefit to going to ranger 15, but I would lose, all the stuff I get from Pally 4, and rogue 3, and all I get in return is another favored enemy. Is that a worthwile trade?

Another question, I can find and disarm traps in heavy armour? I was not sure from a couple of the earlier posts.

If so is the only downside to using heavy armour with my 13 ranger/4 pally/3 rogue setup losing evasion? If so is, is it really worth not wearing heavy armour for Evasion? I'm obviously pretty new to this, but that just seems counter intuitive.

I often forget about enhancements in DDO when making builds.....which is of course a mistake. If there is something you wanted to go for, go ahead and make it.

Pal 3 give fear immunity.....nice. Nicer at lower lvls before you have other options to protect you from fear.

Pal 4 gives spells but weak versions of them and not that great IMO.
It give a weak turn undead....a very weak turn undead, and turn undead in DDO is weak as a geaneral rule anyway.....(and even when it works no one appreciates it )

Rog2 gives evasion. The best feat in the game IMO. Only works in light/no armor.
Works best with a high ref save.

Nothing wrong with Rog3 though....in fact more SA damage is always nice.

Having enough Rgr lvls to cast Fredom of Movement is nice.
Doing more damage to favored enemies is nice.