I'll never defend Turbine again.

[theblaz]

First, let me start by apologizing to anyone who has criticized this game only to see me defending it and arguing with you.

Honestly, I'm sorry.

I've defended this game because my old PnP group was playing it, and because we met some cool people in the game. We all had fun doing our thing. We were so not uber, it was almost crazy. I'm done only 3 raids ever (VoN, Shroud, Reaver). Two capped characters, my main is still my first 28 pt build. Less than 2000 favor.

Our loot runs are From beyond the grave, sleeping dust, vale rares. Nothing special. A month ago I went ape**** when I won the Reaver Napkin on my main.

I say all that to give you an idea of how I play the game and how I'm not burned out, how I'm not at the very very end waiting for new content. I'm not a hardcore raider, I'm very casual.

Tonight, I've almost certainly made up my mind to leave the game.

First, we did the Shroud. Pug group, competent people. A couple of whiny people, but I expected nothing less (I know their guilds; bunch of crybabies). It was at least 5 times harder than it was before Mod 8. I had a 22k repair bill. It took us around 2 hours.

Yeah, I know uber people can beat it in 16 minutes, super duper. Don't care, shut up. This isn't about how awesome you are, this is about how a casual player with several good friends in the game is ready to leave when, yesterday, he spent much time defending this game.

So it took forever but we beat the Shroud.

Let's do reaver!

Yeah. Elite, wipe in like 2 minutes.

On normal, we manage to make it to the puzzle.

I'm the solver. I've spent hours practicing. I can solve the online version within 8 moves ALL the time, 6 moves most of the time.

I fail. Not because of the puzzle, but because the ****ing Air Elementals are tossing me around and I can't finish the puzzle.

We try again, can't even get to the puzzle (I think, I'm drinking at this point).

Again, we manage to get to the puzzle, the ****ing air ellies screw us again.

I'm not looking for Icy Rainments, I'm not looking to be crazy uber and 2 man the shroud by slapping my nuts on the keyboard, I'm just looking to have fun with the PnP group I used to spend my Thursday nights with before they all moved away.

Yeah, we can still play. Sleeping dust for the 50th time, what fun.

Running with the devils? Not after the ellie changes.

Ritual Sacrifice? Yeah, 25 runs and still fresh.

Rainbow? Screw that.

Coalescence? Screw that with a rusty railroad spike.

In their zeal to make things more "challenging" Turbine has made the game un-fun.

Even if we failed, I've ALWAYS had fun playing with my friends.

Tonight, we beat the shroud and it ****ing SUCKED.

Tonight, we failed like 4 times on the Reaver, and each one ****ing SUCKED.

So, undoubtedly getting more infraction points, thanks for nothing, Tubrine.

You ****ed up this game to the point where I will never ever defend it again.

And ask around, I defended the **** out of this game.

In closing, I'm almost certainly not re-upping my subscription. If I do, it's because my PnP group convinced me to until the tabletop online game comes out.

Way to go, Turbine. Way to not test anything, way to not take casual players into account, and in summation, way to **** up this game.

No more defenses from me, and no more dollars from me.

Big middle finger to you all.

[Aerniel]

nothing to say...

[manfredshw]

I have nothing to say too...

[theblaz]

Hehe, I'd rather you said something...

I don't care if NO one agrees with me, I'm not trying to convince anyone of anything.

It's just that after almost 2 years of playing this game, Turbine has made it "not fun."

If this sounds like whining, so be it. It kinda is.

But I loved this game, loved having a chance to playing D&D (sorta) with my old gaming group, loved meeting new people, playing new quests and having fun.

Tonight just ****ing sucked.

And I'm done with this game.

[Aerniel]

well if your night ****ing sucked dont post your rage on the forums ass... we dont need your complaints!

[Kistilan]

Pure Awesome.

I salute you Rameses!!!

[Fetchi]

It's starting to feel that way for me too man. The reason no one has anything to say is because they're all in the Subterranean lmao - losers...

[theblaz]

well if your night ****ing sucked dont post your rage on the forums ass... we dont need your complaints!

You're right. I shouldn't use the public forum to post my opinion.

Thanks for calling me an ass, too. You clearly have a lot of value to offer to the conversation.

/laugh

[boldarblood]

If it took 2 hours to run shroud, it was not a competent group. It happens, deal with it.

Reaver, the party has to change tactics, and it is still not to difficult. It was a good chance, it makes more of the party involved in the quest.

[stockwizard5]

I have posted and posted and posted and posted about the need for the developers to interact with players (e.g. Theblaz) to find out how they play and what they enjoy. Whatever they did to the reaver does nothing to challenge me - so its still a loot run. The casual player on the other hand - burned.

Now of course this is a drunken tirade (soon to be deleted) - but I have heard this basic sentiment about the changes (Reaver especially) for the last three days all over the server.

Note to Devs: Air Elemental Knockdown is NOT FUN

AD had a thread that explained why in some detail - taking something you know we think is NOT FUN and making more of it - why?

[Junts]

Hehe, I'd rather you said something...

I don't care if NO one agrees with me, I'm not trying to convince anyone of anything.

It's just that after almost 2 years of playing this game, Turbine has made it "not fun."

If this sounds like whining, so be it. It kinda is.

But I loved this game, loved having a chance to playing D&D (sorta) with my old gaming group, loved meeting new people, playing new quests and having fun.

Tonight just ****ing sucked.

And I'm done with this game.

The change was to the Reaver's air eles, not to elementals in general. Have run the shroud since the mod - it was no different, just laggy sometimes. It has not changed, except Damasze. The guys in RWtD are not elementals even though they have whirlwind graphics and they don't do the knockdown. They are unchanged.

The Reaver isn't hard now, you just have to adjust your tactics - balls still work well, and DPS them with firewalls, don't just spam fail fingers.

[Valzoric]

I defend this critique.

Before the "mod" (notice that is in quotes, because this was a nerf, nothing else). I understand the reaver was way to easy...and the shroud may have been also.

However, I ran the reaver and the shroud once the mod was in, and with very competent groups...it's insane. I thought turbine wanted to make this game easier for people who never played an MMO or D&D? maybe with the newbie areas, but higher lvls, it's not even close.

What do they do, they nerf the **** out of the reaver, because the elite a-holes can run it in 5 /12 seconds (embellished). And instead of making it harder solely on elite, ALL versions are very difficult. Seriously on NORMAL, no CC works, no FoD, NOTHING. on NORMAL!! We've got a caster that has put a lot of focus into Spell Pen, and that doesn't even help.

Also, while nerfing the reaver, they make a subteranne boss a piece of cake, and now people are pulling +2 tomes on like an 8% chance. The run takes like 10 min...look at the LFM's...oh wait...nerf coming monday.

So, Turbine...who are you making this game for? Everyone? Not likely...more like gearing it to the top 5%...because it's too easy for them. Screw the casual people who don't have 7 maxed toons and can loot the **** out of a quest. Also, I know, I know...wah wah...but seriously...I work hard, I travel for long periods of time to my job. I unwind and relax with this game...but now, all the fun is gone. The people I play with are not the ubers....we just managed to get everyone flagged for reaver...and now...we can't run it.

I'm glad I play CoH....because I enjoy that game. Now...DDO has become a PoS....and I'm ready to cancel too. We didn't even get our full mod...where's our hirelings? Oh wait...they couldn't get that right either..activation date TBD. While they were busy Nerfing these quests, they couldn't fix some old bugs too...but wait...that's not important. Just keep catering to the people 5% of the player base that is waiting 3 days after a mod for the next. Screw the little guy.

God...i can't wait for 4e tabletop. I'm gonna go play CoH and some other things, and seriously ponder why I still pay for this ****.

[theblaz]

well it fits the person. besides... if your going to quit so quickly because your night sucked we dont really need your negativness..

Last I saw, the forums weren't just for kissing ass. Make sure you let me know if you find the rule that disputes that.

[Aerniel]

Last I saw, the forums weren't just for kissing ass. Make sure you let me know if you find the rule that disputes that.

werent you quitting? what're ya still doing here?

[GeneralDiomedes]

I will never understand the attitude of those who don't wish to adapt. Sure, you're all so D&D when they 'overpower' the players and things are a cakewalk .. but you sure ain't D&*******D when things are actually hard.

[Timjc86]

I made a post similar to this after my first VoN attempt a while back. My insight and feedback (and I feel my arguments too) were well warranted, however my tone was not, and I regret it.

The mod is not even a week old so absolutely none of these changes are set in stone. Let them know how you feel, but bear in mind your opinion is much more likely to be sincerely and objectively considered if it's not quite so... heartfelt.

Don't fall into the trap of defending every facet of the game because it is the game you play, or lambasting it in its entirety because you don't agree with some of the changes. The best thing you can do to help improve the game is to be as objective and specific as possible about both the things you enjoy and the ones that you don't.

As for the changes, aside from offering your feedback, the next best thing you can do is to keep practicing, it'll get easier. It sounds like it was just a bad day and the group didn't mesh quite like it should have. It happens.

[Valzoric]

The Reaver isn't hard now, you just have to adjust your tactics - balls still work well, and DPS them with firewalls, don't just spam fail fingers.

Balls don't work...not for us..not on Elite or normal. Maxed lvl 16 Sorc, wiz and bard. Are we talking casual players or people with full Tier 3 Shroud loot? I think the focus here is casual players.

And to the person who said don't come to the PUBLIC forums and complain. I think you need to look up the word PUBLIC. The elitists have their say...now we can have ours.

[Ringos]

I'll agree that it seems that stuff (like the new quests on normal even) seem to be geared toward the higher-end folks. I don't like it. I would rather have normal be more, well, normal. Scaling for hard and elite is fine. That's the way it should be.

As far as the Reaver goes, I have run it once with some decent folks (joined a PUG) and I think we had one death. We knew it had changed and went in prepared to change tactics. We adapted and overcame. I don't mind that at all. It used to be a cake-walk loot run, now folks have to work a bit for it on Elite. I don't have a problem with that. I will, however, be more selective of the company I keep in there. EDIT: I noticed balls working, at times. Destruction? FoD? Didn't land one or see one landed, though I could be wrong.

Hope you stick with it, at least to see if some changes are coming. Take care.

[Aerniel]

And to the person who said don't come to the PUBLIC forums and complain. I think you need to look up the word PUBLIC. The elitists have their say...now we can have ours.

i just think the complaining needs to stop... none of it is necessary.

[theblaz]

Stock, sorry I was a **** to you. I may not agree with you, but after tonight....

Christ.

I see more of your points.

And I love how people are saying, "It's not hard, just adjust...."

Yeah, we know.

We knew that going in. We never tried the old tactics, we tried all the new tactics everyone's babbling about.

RESIST, RESIST, RESIST.

We never just tried to Disco Ball and sit there watching, we fully expected it to be harder.

This was insane.

And the Shroud group we were in was competent, boldar.

On normal with 12 capped players (only ONE of whom had never run the shroud), we should NOT have had the problems we did. It wasn't a lack of DPS or healing or CC. I'm sure you're totally awesome at the game and rock everything because you're uber and all, but this was absolutely ridiculous.