Oberas (3 Wizard/12 Monk/1 Rogue)

[UfirvwoHargoonis]

I doubt this is a very interesting build, but thought i'd just show what i was planning to do and see what people thought. This Character is already a lvl 3 wizard capped at 1 xp from lvl 5, waiting for the monk trainer. I started him before learning that concentration was important for a monk and had already invested some tomes into him so didn't wanna reroll. But i've adapted my plans and concentration won't be a problem. this only minor mistake I made was making him LN, screwing my chances with pure good weapons, but i've decided to take a lvl of rogue(at lvl 12) and invest in UMD to compensate... then i get the best of both worlds(immune to unholy npc weapons and able to use pure good... not to mention the many other benefits of having a decent UMD).

Current non enhanced stats(w/+2 STR, INT and WIS tomes)
STR 18
DEX 14
CON 14
INT 14
WIS 16
CHA 8

Feats:
1(wizard): Extend Spell
1(Human): Least Dragonmark of the Sentinal
1: Dodge
3: Weapon Focus (BLudgeoning)
4(monk): Stunning Fist
5(monk): Discipline
6: Lesser Dragonmark of the Sentinal
9(monk): Combat Expertise
9: Improved Trip
12: Skill Focus(UMD)
15: skill focus(concentration)

Skills:
@ 3: 3 Tumble, 3 jump, 3 Swim, 3 Balance
4: 7 concen, rest same
5: 8 concen, 8 Tumble, 4 Jump, rest same
6: 9 concen, 9 tumble, 9 jump, rest same
7: 10 concen, 10 tumble, 10 jump, 7 swim, rest same
8: 11 concen, 11 tumble, 11 jump, 11 swim, rest same
9: 12 concen, 12 tumble, 12 jump, 12 swim, 1.5 UMD, rest same
10: 13 Concen, 13 Tumble, 13 jump, 13 swim, 3 UMD, rest same
11: 14 concen, 14 tumble, 14 jump, 14 swim, 4 UMD, 4 balance
12: 15 UMD, rest same
13: 16 concen, 16 Tumble, 15 Jump, 16 UMD, rest same
14: 17 concen, 17 Tumble, 17 Jump, 15 Swim, 17 UMD, rest same
15: 18 concen, 18 tumble, 18 jump, 17 swim, 18 UMD, rest same
16: 19 concen, 19 tumble, 19 jump, 19 swim, 19 UMD, 4 balance

Monk Paths:
Inevitable Domination
Patient Tortoise
Water Stance (good for unblancing strike to get my +1d6 sneak attack)

LVL 16 self-applicable AC(not including any bonuses from stances):
10 base
6 dex (assuming +2 tome and +6 item)
10 WIS (assuming +6 item, all lvl-up ability boosts, and action points)
2 monk bonus
7 robe of armor (i'm pretty sure those exist right now, right?)
4 sheild spell
3 dodge (feat plus chaosguard)
4 sheild of faith (dragonmark)
3 barkskin (potion)
5 combat expertise
54 total

i know this isn't great AC and it basically useless against certian raid bosses, but it's a good ac for a mellee character in standard situations.

[Arianrhod]

Interesting....kind of having trouble seeing what the wizard levels are for, though (other than avoiding having to reroll....)

[saber7]

I believe 7 armor robes don't exist but i could be wrong.

[Dexxaan]

A few notes:

* Always best to Create your character as Rogue for level 1 Skill Points. (More so if a High INT is on the table) You are missing out on a TON of UMD, Jump, OL, DD, Balance, Spot and other skills. So many that I´d say it´s well worth losing the +2 Tomes invested.

* I happen to be building a Rogue 1 (Currently a Rogue 1 with 19,999 XP´s) and plan on going 1 Fighter OR 1 Wizard and 18 Monk (at L20 projection). I really can´t seem to justify 3 levels of Wizard, but 1 can be loads of fun and fall in line with my self-sufficient gameplay.

* My advice would be to do the math and compare the results to your wants and needs for gameplay, I mean by this if you and your guild-friends are powergamers, you may be found lacking an edge IMO. OTOH if you are a casual player...go with it...you have invested gear that a casual player rarely encounters and shouldn´t put it to waste.

Either way. GL.

[Talon_Moonshadow]

I don't really see what you are trying to do.

it doesn't take long to get to lvl 4......so I wouldn't worry about rerolling or wasting any thing there.

If you want a Rog/Mnk.....best to take Rog first.

I think Mnks get mosre skill points than Wiz, so a Wiz/Mnk should also take Mnk first.

Seems to me you are better starting over....prob as a pure Mnk. Unless you have a specific reason for the multi-class.

With Wiz multi-classed builds, I don't think you gain much from Wiz3......Wiz 1 or 5.....or something a lot higher IMO.

I do kinda like a Mnk/Wiz build, but not sure the best way to do one.

[UfirvwoHargoonis]

* I thought the reason for 1 lvl of wizard was pretty obvious... sheild! +4 ac that a monk couldn't otherwise get reallly. sure you could get a ring with a few 1 minute clickies... or with UMD a wand with 1 minute clicks (which costs money and inventroy if you want it running all the time). with this guy i get 6 minutes by spending a few spell points that are basically used for little else.

* the reason i went to lvl 3 wizard was for longer durations and 2nd lvl spells... can cast blur on myself plus any stat i don't yet have a +5 or +6 item for. what i'm really hoping is that they'll add practiced spell caster as a feat then my spells will last 7 minutes and i could have a 4x magic missle or a 2x scorching ray(assuming my character level is also at least 7).

* the character is really only taking the lvl of rogue to get the UMD skill up to a useful rank... and that useful rank doesn't exist for me until high level so i don't see the point in taking my 1 level of rogue at level one since i'd max it at 4 then waste sooo many skill points trying to keep it max rank. and i'm not playing a real rogue in any way so i don't see the point in open lock or disable device, and again... lvl 1 rogue at level one... i'd get 4 max ranks then have to spend lots of skill points keeping it maxed.

* three +2 tomes IS a lot of effort for me... so no rerolling

* yeah... no +7 armor robes.... make it +6 with black dragonscale robe... maybe they'll make monk tunics or whatever with armor bonuses? 53 ac

* if we're going to talk post lvl 16 possibilities... i'm not too sure. i could go 4 monk for class features or 4 rogue for sneak attack (not sure what i'd do with the skills... maybe hide and move silently). i don't see the point really in taking more lvls of wizard. stoneskin seems an attractive 4th lvl spell but i'll be able to use wands (purchased from the twelve). as far as 3rd lvl spells, haste and heroism will likely be provided for me.

[Gol]

I believe 7 armor robes don't exist but i could be wrong.

6 for White Dragonscale Robe and +1 with the Alchemical bonus from the ritual.

[UfirvwoHargoonis]

6 for White Dragonscale Robe and +1 with the Alchemical bonus from the ritual.

um... i didn't think those alchemical bonuses would work for stuff like that... the robes aren't a true armor enhancment bonus whihc is what the ritual would effect. i don't think alchemical bonus will effect items that aren't REALLY armor to begin with. i don't know... just what i was assuming.

[Gol]

um... i didn't think those alchemical bonuses would work for stuff like that... the robes aren't a true armor enhancment bonus whihc is what the ritual would effect. i don't think alchemical bonus will effect items that aren't REALLY armor to begin with. i don't know... just what i was assuming.

Robes provide the exact same type of armor bonus that armor does. I don't see any reason why it wouldn't work.

[wolfy42]

Um Ufir, you do know about lvl 5 SoF potions right?

It's 3 shield ac instead of 4 (1 less) but lasts far longer.

Also you can get 10 minute shield wands that are usable with UMD later on.

The lvl 5 SoF potions (caster lvl 6 but lvl 5 requirement) is I think 300 gold a pop...super cheap...you could buy like oh 5,000 of em easily for the cost of a +1 tome let alone a +2.

Heck you could buy enough barkskin, Sof, Owls wisdom and cats grace potions to keep you constantly buffed forever and a day for the cost of a +2 tome.

The wizard lvl is a complete was (I'm sorry it's the truth).

Rogue lvls make sense for UMD especially since your human. Just 1 rogue level can open you up for a few more useful skills and monks get a decent number of skill points. If you go with a 14 int thats 6 skill points per rogue lvl allowing you to max Search/DA and UMD. I forget if search is a monk skill or not...if it is you can keep spot maxed as well...if not you need a +2 int tome to keep spot maxed.

The concept of ditching a character after using 3 +2 tomes on it hurts me to even think about, but I really don't see any reason for you to make the character you were planning. Just a few wizard levels is going to be useless.

Therefore why don't you switch things around?

You only have wizard lvls so far, so make the character primaraly a wizard with maybe a few monk and rogue levels to add flavor?

2 monk levels will give your character wis bonus to AC and allow you to fight in various monk stances with specific weapons (it will also give you double toughness feats if you want to boost your max hp. You could fight in fire stance constantly for a +2 strength (Stacks with enhancements) as well.

2 monk levels also gives you evasion already.

Problem with the rogue levels to me is that you wont' have them at lvl 1....but you can't get UMD any other way which really blows.

I guess you can go with 2 monk levels and 1 rogue level (opening up rogue skills) and the rest wizard levels (hurts that your int is only 14, but you'll still be able to easily cast all wizard spells eventually by lvl 20 (17 is the required lvl for 9th lvl wizard spells).

Character will be best at using either non-save spells (magic missile/force missile/fog etc) buffs (haste/heroism/resist energy etc) and then meleeing away with a quarterstaff.

At least it won't be totally gimped

[Electric_Pulses]

Um Ufir, you do know about lvl 5 SoF potions right?

It's 3 shield ac instead of 4 (1 less) but lasts far longer.

Also you can get 10 minute shield wands that are usable with UMD later on.

The lvl 5 SoF potions (caster lvl 6 but lvl 5 requirement) is I think 300 gold a pop...super cheap...you could buy like oh 5,000 of em easily for the cost of a +1 tome let alone a +2.

Heck you could buy enough barkskin, Sof, Owls wisdom and cats grace potions to keep you constantly buffed forever and a day for the cost of a +2 tome.

The wizard lvl is a complete was (I'm sorry it's the truth).

Rogue lvls make sense for UMD especially since your human. Just 1 rogue level can open you up for a few more useful skills and monks get a decent number of skill points. If you go with a 14 int thats 6 skill points per rogue lvl allowing you to max Search/DA and UMD. I forget if search is a monk skill or not...if it is you can keep spot maxed as well...if not you need a +2 int tome to keep spot maxed.

The concept of ditching a character after using 3 +2 tomes on it hurts me to even think about, but I really don't see any reason for you to make the character you were planning. Just a few wizard levels is going to be useless.

Therefore why don't you switch things around?

You only have wizard lvls so far, so make the character primaraly a wizard with maybe a few monk and rogue levels to add flavor?

2 monk levels will give your character wis bonus to AC and allow you to fight in various monk stances with specific weapons (it will also give you double toughness feats if you want to boost your max hp. You could fight in fire stance constantly for a +2 strength (Stacks with enhancements) as well.

2 monk levels also gives you evasion already.

Problem with the rogue levels to me is that you wont' have them at lvl 1....but you can't get UMD any other way which really blows.

I guess you can go with 2 monk levels and 1 rogue level (opening up rogue skills) and the rest wizard levels (hurts that your int is only 14, but you'll still be able to easily cast all wizard spells eventually by lvl 20 (17 is the required lvl for 9th lvl wizard spells).

Character will be best at using either non-save spells (magic missile/force missile/fog etc) buffs (haste/heroism/resist energy etc) and then meleeing away with a quarterstaff.

At least it won't be totally gimped

oh my %!@$!#) ^&*! dude shield of faith is a deflection bonus not a shield bonus, sure the name might be decieving but i still thought it was pretty obvious cuz if u drink one n look in character sheet the ac layout shows that u have a deflection bonus and i htink it even says in descriptioon that it give a deflection bonus to ac, his build sounds smart to me n people qho ridicule it should rethink,he will be a kick beep power house monk that can buff, has good umd and can cast a few scorching rays for 50ish damage. sounds wonder ful to me, he can buff up run toward enemy, casty scorching ray then go into a monk stance n beat on the enemy

[UfirvwoHargoonis]

also wolfy, the sheild of faith i get is from my dragonmark... the duration and power of it increase with my character lvl as if i was a full lvl cleric... AND for some bizarre reason my extend spell feat extends it so at lvl 16 i'll have +4 sheild of faith for 32 minutes several times per rest (and i can give that to allies if i want to). and then i ALSO get the wizzie sheild spell which as electric pointed out is a sheild bonus not deflection. and yeah, there ARE 10th lvl sheild wands i would be able to cast but a) only 4 minutes longer than the one i cast on myself b) uses up inventory space and c) have to unequip weapons to whip out a wand then switch back whihc decreases my dps if i need to refresh mid-combat (so much easier to just hotkey the spell).

also if i continue the character as you suggest he'll have a **** cruddy INT for a wizzie.

[Arianrhod]

also wolfy, the sheild of faith i get is from my dragonmark... the duration and power of it increase with my character lvl as if i was a full lvl cleric... AND for some bizarre reason my extend spell feat extends it so at lvl 16 i'll have +4 sheild of faith for 32 minutes several times per rest (and i can give that to allies if i want to). and then i ALSO get the wizzie sheild spell which as electric pointed out is a sheild bonus not deflection. and yeah, there ARE 10th lvl sheild wands i would be able to cast but a) only 4 minutes longer than the one i cast on myself b) uses up inventory space and c) have to unequip weapons to whip out a wand then switch back whihc decreases my dps if i need to refresh mid-combat (so much easier to just hotkey the spell).

also if i continue the character as you suggest he'll have a **** cruddy INT for a wizzie.

Well, considering the tomes are already spent, I wouldn't want to reroll either. That being the case, your originally posted concept looks like as good a way to go as anything anyone else has suggested. I'd say go with it, see how you like it, and report back (we - well, some of us, anyway - do like seeing how unusual builds play out).

[Leyoni]

The only problem I see with your plan is that when you multiclass to rogue at L12 you won't be able to return to monk at L13. Once you stop training as a monk you can never progress further in that class. To work you would need to wait until L20 to take your 1 rogue level or take the rogue level at L4 and spend the double skill points to keep your UMD up.

[MrCow]

The only problem I see with your plan is that when you multiclass to rogue at L12 you won't be able to return to monk at L13. Once you stop training as a monk you can never progress further in that class.

DDO doesn't have these kinda of multiclass restrictions. If this were the case then you wouldn't see paladins starting off as a rogue at level one and picking up a second level around level 7+ for evasion and the skill points.

[Leyoni]

DDO doesn't have these kinda of multiclass restrictions. If this were the case then you wouldn't see paladins starting off as a rogue at level one and picking up a second level around level 7+ for evasion and the skill points.

I'm not on Risia so haven't seen what is possible there. Only pointing out what should be the rules. If they aren't (and I know DDO impliments some things different from the rules) then all is good.

[Depravity]

Neat. I like it, but then I'm building an intimitank that's 75% rogue, so I'm not adverse to "gimped according to the forum yahoos" builds.

Please post back about how the build progresses, especially the interaction of monk abilities and sneak attack. I think I may have a ninja in my future.

[Garth_of_Sarlona]

few things:

- yes, you can apply the +1 alc AC bonus on robes and pyjamas
- there is a dominion based finishing move that makes a target vulnerable to sneak attacks, so combining monk with rogue might be quite interesting.

Garth

[UfirvwoHargoonis]

i love it!

at lvl 6 i can get up to a 36ac, for 6 minutes before needing to refresh some of the buffs:

10 base
6 WIS (w/ spell, 6mins)
4 DEX (w/ spell, 6 mins)
4 Armor (spell, 16mins)
4 SHeild (spell, 6 mins)
3 Sheild of Faith (dragonmark, 12mins)
3 Barkskin (potion, 6 mins)
1 dodge feat
1 centered bonus (see below)

in water stance my WIS mod(and therefore my ac) goes up another 1, making it 37. i'm usually in the fire stance though since this high ac isn't necessary in the quests i'm running so the extra damage and ki gen is favorable. i can also use my human versatility to get a nice +3 to that ac for 20 seconds. and the barkskin potion is the only part of that equation that isn't provided by my character's abilities. also i now have the lesser dragonmark of the sentinal which gives me 72 energy protection for 12 minutes (or until discharged of course). but what's the deal with that centered bonus? it's not listed anywhere on my class feats and i'm not a lvl 5 monk yet. anywho, here's the few problems i'm having in learning to play this build effectivly:

a) gotta remember to switch to my combat bar when i'm done using my buff bar... hate running into a fight and casting sheild AGAIN.
b) gotta pay attention not only to my enemies, my ki and my HP... gotta watch those buff timers... if you let your buffs wear off in the middle of a fight... you're going to have a bad time.
c) my two stances i'm focusing on are fire and water... but apparently there is no finishing move for fire/water combos! and water/dark is humonoid only! and my wallet is too small for all my fifties! and my golden shoes are too tight!

also a little side note... my sp bar appears yellow to everyone when i'm in a party... wanna get that fixed turbine? i know it's not a priority but c'mon! can it reallt be that hard?