1 Stalwart Defender +9 Casters = . . .

[grodon9999]

turn off maximize/empower, as long as both casters are doing relatively equal dps should be fine.

nytherios wouldnt be a bad option either. bring in 4 casters, one to kite, two to dot, one to reconstruct the casters.

or if you have fleshies bring a divine or something. sobrien may be a better choice due to not having to complete part 1 of ToD every time you want to try it, but it seems like he has more hitpoints and therefore larger room for one to show more threat than the other.

Sobrien has about 76,000 HP. a lot less than the Netherios.

but silly question . . . what good does it do for a caster to actually increase their generated threat? What advantage does it give them?

[voodoogroves]

Sobrien has about 76,000 HP. a lot less than the Netherios.

but silly question . . . what good does it do for a caster to actually increase their generated threat? What advantage does it give them?

A different play style?

A way to take charge in a raid that is going south and turn it around without waiting for the other folks to ding?

Fun?

[budalic]

but silly question . . . what good does it do for a caster to actually increase their generated threat? What advantage does it give them?

Shieldblock tanking?

[grodon9999]

Shieldblock tanking?

That sounds like a good next test . . . anyone got a caster they think can do this and hold aggro over full-****** (or even 3/4-******) melees?

[ainmosni]

Sobrien has about 76,000 HP. a lot less than the Netherios.

but silly question . . . what good does it do for a caster to actually increase their generated threat? What advantage does it give them?

casters with threat gen and self healing ability make cool tanks?

oh-**** moments where you want to KNOW where the aggro goes, to a self-healing class that breeds experienced kiters?

causing people to answer questions with questions?

[grodon9999]

casters with threat gen and self healing ability make cool tanks?

I'm not so sure about that with the U11 raid bosses getting steroids. Currently? Heck yes.

oh-**** moments where you want to KNOW where the aggro goes, to a self-healing class that breeds experienced kiters?

Intimidate is really needed for that but yeah, it absolutely works. Nothing ends a "Benny Hill" moment like a good intim a burst of damage.

causing people to answer questions with questions?

Really?

[ainmosni]

Really?

doesn't it appear that way?

[budalic]

That sounds like a good next test . . . anyone got a caster they think can do this and hold aggro over full-****** (or even 3/4-******) melees?

Well, I've seen it done only once (mainly because I didn't raid much after u9) with a wizard in eChrono; but I know second-hand some guilds tanked elite ToD with FvS tanks. Probably any non-cleric caster can do it (I'm off the game atm... if you're testing in 2 days, I can copy my pale master to lamma) with eardweller, max, emp and max condemn stacks (so if you're testing with fvs, wait till some condemn stacks).

EDIT: When I say some guilds, I mean some guilds with really geared players, not Khortos League (granted, KL wouldn't get an idea like castertanking in first place).

[ainmosni]

Well, I've seen it done only once (mainly because I didn't raid much after u9) with a wizard in eChrono; but I know second-hand some guilds tanked elite ToD with FvS tanks. Probably any non-cleric caster can do it (I'm off the game atm... if you're testing in 2 days, I can copy my pale master to lamma) with eardweller, max, emp and max condemn stacks (so if you're testing with fvs, wait till some condemn stacks).

bah, a cleric could do it just as easily as a fvs or a sorc. just put points into intim and make sure your dps is on par with the next potential tank.

it's EASIER to dps with a fvs, but making a dps cleric is not out of the question. dots + holy burst [metal type and greater bane appropriate to the foe you face] weapons with divine might can be pretty substantial, especially with the tons of threat gen gear easily accessible these days.

[budalic]

bah, a cleric could do it just as easily as a fvs or a sorc. just put points into intim and make sure your dps is on par with the next potential tank.

it's EASIER to dps with a fvs, but making a dps cleric is not out of the question. dots + holy burst [metal type and greater bane appropriate to the foe you face] weapons with divine might can be pretty substantial, especially with the tons of threat gen gear easily accessible these days.

Well, I wasn't saying cleric wasn't good, but that I don't really know if cleric can do it without intim/condemn stacks/melee (no shieldblocking). And you use intim and melee in your example.

[grodon9999]

Well, I've seen it done only once (mainly because I didn't raid much after u9) with a wizard in eChrono; but I know second-hand some guilds tanked elite ToD with FvS tanks. Probably any non-cleric caster can do it (I'm off the game atm... if you're testing in 2 days, I can copy my pale master to lamma) with eardweller, max, emp and max condemn stacks (so if you're testing with fvs, wait till some condemn stacks).

EDIT: When I say some guilds, I mean some guilds with really geared players, not Khortos League (granted, KL wouldn't get an idea like castertanking in first place).

The falls under "believe it when I see it" for me. i would need to see a caster hold aggro over a "shade" type guy and I've never observed this in game.

[MownDown]

Do i need to hold aggro over night on his barb?

[grodon9999]

Do i need to hold aggro over night on his barb?

Soturi's barb? he is finesse-based.

[LeLoric]

The falls under "believe it when I see it" for me. i would need to see a caster hold aggro over a "shade" type guy and I've never observed this in game.

My wizzie will. It requires effective use of intim though to increase your threat. I've tanked suulu in tod several times with some high dps guys beating and held him.

[grodon9999]

My wizzie will. It requires effective use of intim though to increase your threat. I've tanked suulu in tod several times with some high dps guys beating and held him.

How do you get 65ish intim on a pure Wizard?

[Milfeulle]

It is not possibile to hold aggro over a fully geared and planned Sorc with no hate gear and enhancement. Once the two DoT spell reaches tier 3 with Eardweller and Awaken Elemental Weakness, you won't be able to hold aggro anymore. Conjoined Abishai Devastator is an exception, since it switches form and causes one type of elemental spell to heal itself thus won't be generating more hate from that type of spell.

[MrCow]

I'd seen a post on the forums about the supposed hidden effect on the Ring of Lies, but my search skills can't find any substantive discussion. Has this been tested or confirmed?

I did some testing out in Aussircaex's Valley with Frost Wolves. I used a cleric to cast Harm (being a nice consistent damage spell) to deal 127 damage to a frost wolf. Then I had a fist-fighting bard tap the frost wolf for about 3 damage at a time. When the bard hit 127-129 damage the frost wolf would aggro the bard.

I equipped the Ring of Lies onto the cleric and, again, used harm to deal 127 damage to the frost wolf. The bard then proceeded to punch on the dog lightly again. However, when the Harm was used in conjunction with the Ring of Lies it took the bard 142 or more melee damage to pull aggro of the wolf.

The hidden effect of +15% spell threat on the ring appears to be true.



Edit: Test Rahl's Might out using similar procedures. It does not appear to amplify threat from spell-based damage.

[voodoogroves]

I did some testing out in Aussircaex's Valley with Frost Wolves. I used a cleric to cast Harm (being a nice consistent damage spell) to deal 127 damage to a frost wolf. Then I had a fist-fighting bard tap the frost wolf for about 3 damage at a time. When the bard hit 127-129 damage the frost wolf would aggro the bard.

I equipped the Ring of Lies onto the cleric and, again, used harm to deal 127 damage to the frost wolf. The bard then proceeded to punch on the dog lightly again. However, when the Harm was used in conjunction with the Ring of Lies it took the bard 142 or more melee damage to pull aggro of the wolf.

The hidden effect of +15% spell threat on the ring appears to be true.

You sir, rock.

[voodoogroves]

I did some testing out in Aussircaex's Valley with Frost Wolves. I used a cleric to cast Harm (being a nice consistent damage spell) to deal 127 damage to a frost wolf. Then I had a fist-fighting bard tap the frost wolf for about 3 damage at a time. When the bard hit 127-129 damage the frost wolf would aggro the bard.

I equipped the Ring of Lies onto the cleric and, again, used harm to deal 127 damage to the frost wolf. The bard then proceeded to punch on the dog lightly again. However, when the Harm was used in conjunction with the Ring of Lies it took the bard 142 or more melee damage to pull aggro of the wolf.

The hidden effect of +15% spell threat on the ring appears to be true.

Just curious, when you test this are you dual-boxing?

I don't have that option, so I need to use silly hirelings.

[MrCow]

Just curious, when you test this are you dual-boxing?

Aye. I have another account that I used for these types of verification, among other things when I need to abuse fleshlings in a manner that I can control.