A sneak peek at Update 24’s dungeons … and beyond

[LeslieWest_GuitarGod]

Sad thing is this isn't limited to DDO take most any other mmo out there and they cater to casuals...hell look at Wildstar the game caters to endgame and challenge and look how badly that is going.

Dunno but I think it's better to stop fighting a lost cause and walk looking forwards into the future instead of looking backwards.

Humpty Dumpty is broke......

Oh I agree with you! No question they needed to make the game more accessible to more people, and that its industry wide. Social media Zynga games and mindless mobile games are where the money is at nowadays. The MMO world HAD to adjust or else risk extinction.

Today's typical young MMO gamer has never seen a game instructional manual on paper. They don't read pdf files. They play a game for 2 weeks to 2 months and move on. And thats being kind

However, this is where Turbine in my opinion has shined for the most part, and made a few glaring errors. DDO still has such good combat, such a strong LFM feature, a huge variety of options for character creation and leveling, DIFFICULTY SETTINGS FOR EACH DUNGEON, built in VoIP, and is still designed from the ground up for groups. DDO has matured, by nature of the MMO world around it, the game people play who want more options then mindless mobile/zynga/facebook entertainment. Something they can sink their teeth into.

I think Turbine should haul together those that have been around the longest and ask them why the hell they keep playing. Then, ask new blood what they are looking for in this game. I can tell you that these two ends of the spectrum are not as far off as some might think. Very few in our guild have moved on because of anything Turbine has done, and the ones that did leave was because of their RL situations. Even then, often when their RL is in order, they come back.

Why? The answer is usually the core reasons DDO has been successful for so many years, among them the reasons I mentioned above.

[apacheizm23]

Oh I agree with you! No question they needed to make the game more accessible to more people, and that its industry wide. Social media Zynga games and mindless mobile games are where the money is at nowadays. The MMO world HAD to adjust or else risk extinction.

Today's typical young MMO gamer has never seen a game instructional manual on paper. They don't read pdf files. They play a game for 2 weeks to 2 months and move on. And thats being kind

However, this is where Turbine in my opinion has shined for the most part, and made a few glaring errors. DDO still has such good combat, such a strong LFM feature, a huge variety of options for character creation and leveling, DIFFICULTY SETTINGS FOR EACH DUNGEON, built in VoIP, and is still designed from the ground up for groups. DDO has matured, by nature of the MMO world around it, the game people play who want more options then mindless mobile/zynga/facebook entertainment. Something they can sink their teeth into.

I think Turbine should haul together those that have been around the longest and ask them why the hell they keep playing. Then, ask new blood what they are looking for in this game. I can tell you that these two ends of the spectrum are not as far off as some might think. Very few in our guild have moved on because of anything Turbine has done, and the ones that did leave was because of their RL situations. Even then, often when their RL is in order, they come back.

Why? The answer is usually the core reasons DDO has been successful for so many years, among them the reasons I mentioned above.

Nice post, very well said.

[FranOhmsford]

What is a power gamer??? Explain that to me?

A Power-Gamer is someone who wants to play the End-Game and only the End-Game - Someone who is happy to PAY to skip the rest of the game just to get to that End-Game!

I know of just the people who play the game, and than those that want the game and all its rewards handed to them easy and quickly. That's basically it. On another note, I don't blame the developers of these games for putting a price tag on getting what ya want in a game, for the most part that is. They gotta make money that's just the way it is. I been saying that for a long time Its about the $$$$$$ And it will always be about the $$$$$.

Casuals aren't interested in having "rewards" handed to them easily and quickly - They're interested in PLAYING THE GAME {at least at first - Until they realise that they absolutely need a certain level of character strength to do so!}.

Oh and for you're post saying "Casuals now are so much further away from EVER being maxed out than back then it's simply unbelievable!" That's cause the "Casuals" got game developers to help them come along more quickly in these games that its only made what you call "Power Gamers" gaming even easier.

It wasn't Casuals asking for Raid Timer Bypasses
It wasn't Casuals asking for BB
It wasn't Casuals asking for 8 {maybe 10 next year} MORE Levels!

No those were things asked for by Power-Gamers!
And they got them!
Despite what that did to the Casuals!


How many Casuals were there at End-Game pre MotU - Yes some of us had finally made it BUT it was the Power-Gamers who were begging for more!
You know why?
So they could leave us Casuals behind again!


It is funny to me reading these attacks on "Casuals" who are supposedly now blasting through EEs Solo - Those people AREN'T Casuals!
They're Power-Gamers!

Casuals are still running EN in GROUPS!

[SilkofDrasnia]

No player I've ever seen in 4 years playing this game who's levelled that fast could in any way be considered "Casual"!

And simply getting to 28 will only level 2 {maybe 3 destinies} - On Most characters this actually means NO COCOON!

Levelling to 28 itself will take a "Casual" MONTHS!
E-TRing to complete destinies adds weeks possibly months on to this time!
And you ignore 2nd and 3rd Life too!

And gear:

1) Most Random Loot in Epics is Vendor Trash! OR double-up {Having 3 items with +5, +6 and +7 Str on them is utterly pointless but that's what people who rely on Random Loot end up with!

2) Named Loot requires a certain amount of Grind - If levelling fast you'll get very little actual named loot that's useful for YOUR character.

3) Augments are P2W - P2W despite what some people seem to believe suits Power Gamers far more than Casuals!

4) Levelling fast you'll pick up plat at a steady rate but by 28 you'll still have less than 1 million unless you've been playing the AH.
And you can forget AS unless you're willing to P2W!
1 Million Plat won't get you much these days - And if you've been filling up on Pots, Scrolls and Wands as you level that number will be much lower!


ACTUAL Casuals do ask for DDO to be made easier BUT what the Devs have given us over the past 2 years has catered almost exclusively to Power Gamers.
Ghostbane being a notable EXCEPTION that was aimed at Newbies after the Devs read some exit surveys rather than at "Casuals"

Newbie, Casual, Power-Gamer, Hardcore and many other designators AREN'T mutually exclusive.
A Hardcore Gamer may only play DDO once a Month!
A Casual Gamer may play DDO every day!
Which one of these has more use for P2W?
It's NOT the Casual:
The Casual doesn't need 1 Heroic and 3 Epic Otto's Boxes to bypass the levelling process so they can get straight into the End-Game!
The Casual doesn't need to throw money at getting Augments or Raid Timers so she can gear up as fast as possible!

What the Casual DOES need however is people to play with at the level that Casual is capable at and with BB, Timer Bypasses and Destinies the number of people willing to run anything other than Elite has not so much dwindled as CRASHED & BURNED!

Go ahead - Tell the Casual he/she HAS to solo the lower difficulties in a game based on Dungeons & Dragons {Possibly the most Teamwork oriented hobby ever invented!} AND in a Massively Multiplayer Online RPG!
See that Casual RUN from the game!

What are you talking about?

~ You do not need to etr, just do the first 3 or 4 levels of each destinies for fate points and then when you have the amount of fate points you want max out destinies you plan on using as your mains ~ it is not rocket science and isn't "difficult", as for times it will depend on how often you play but even only playing weekends it will not take that long. Even if it does take months that has nothing to do with it being "casual".

~ TRing is a fun diversion but it brings no where near as much power to chars as ED, it is something you do when you get tired of running "endgame".

1. Hogwash, named items are no where near a requirement like they used to be to make any build work, hell you can get ml-15 + 8 stats items pretty quickly from the u19 quest rewards. I wont even mention the easy to get "welfare" named item sets from eveningstar.

2. Again hogwash, named items are fun and can give you an edge but they are not something you "need" to grind for if you can't be bothered. Just take em as they come.

3. lol augments are not required either, even if they are a nice way to fit in an extra stat or something you are having difficulty placing on a gear set up.

4. I never play the AH and do not use the asah. I do on occasion buy from the AH but there's not usually much interesting on it. Plat is only useful to pay repair bills and buy pots and certain scrolls, if you spend it all on wands and other such junk you are doing something wrong. It is good for that very very occasional good item that shows up in the AH.

The devs have made the game much much more casual friendly with the rise of self healing and all the power creep and lowered difficulty. There is no denying this lmao.


Newbie, Casual, Power-Gamer, Hardcore and many other designators AREN'T mutually exclusive. ~ no kidding but by the same token you can say "power gamers are much more likely to grind for thing and acquire them in game vs casuals that will need to "buy these things. Ofc that's not a hard rule but that how it tends to go.

Dunno maybe no one has told you this before but playing casually doesn't= playing stupidly, it just means you need to focus more if you want to get anywhere, ofc if you going to dabble with 15 or so alts on various servers then ya maybe it'll seem to you that you need to be some hardcore diaper wearing power gamer to get thing done but then that just means you trying to do too many thing at once.

Otto boxes, I have never used any and never will I really do not see why you bring this into it, it a cheesy way for those in a hurry to get that quick PL, it doesn't really have anything to do with being casual or not.

Everyone needs people to play with, sadly DDO has gone to a group heavy gameplay to a more solo friendly gameplay and that is due to the changes to make the game more "casual" friendly.

Pugs I used to pug all the time now I hardly bother with it as more often than not I will be done a quest before people join or I have to wait longer than the quest takes for them to get to it. As to elite being the norm again see lowered difficulty due to casualization of the game.

IF you can find just 1 friend/buddy/guildy to play with you casually you can ream your way through this game, even on a first life, unlike back when they had leveling sigils and the like. lol

Oh about the only thing I would pay for, as a premium, with real money on a new char is maybe a greater tome of learning and "maybe"a tome or two as straight up + tomes do not drop as often as they used to due to being polluted with the x to x tomes.

[apacheizm23]

A Power-Gamer is someone who wants to play the End-Game and only the End-Game - Someone who is happy to PAY to skip the rest of the game just to get to that End-Game!



Casuals aren't interested in having "rewards" handed to them easily and quickly - They're interested in PLAYING THE GAME {at least at first - Until they realise that they absolutely need a certain level of character strength to do so!}.



It wasn't Casuals asking for Raid Timer Bypasses
It wasn't Casuals asking for BB
It wasn't Casuals asking for 8 {maybe 10 next year} MORE Levels!

No those were things asked for by Power-Gamers!
And they got them!
Despite what that did to the Casuals!


How many Casuals were there at End-Game pre MotU - Yes some of us had finally made it BUT it was the Power-Gamers who were begging for more!
You know why?
So they could leave us Casuals behind again!


It is funny to me reading these attacks on "Casuals" who are supposedly now blasting through EEs Solo - Those people AREN'T Casuals!
They're Power-Gamers!

Casuals are still running EN in GROUPS!

Good post and thanks for clearing that up for me. Than from what u said there I guess I am a "Power Gamer" because I really only enjoy the end game to see just how good my character can be, at the very highest level in the game. I don't care much for the lower levels tho I'm happy they have added a great deal to that part of the game. I do wish they add more mid level content for the TR process. Example: level 15 quest's etc.

I don't know if I understand you correctly but I don't want to leave anyone behind and have nothing against any style of player. I know of many players like myself who only play for the end game and I can assure you that's not what they're thinking nor talking about.

I know that the game has gotten quite easier than it used to be that's for sure. And that's from experience because I been playing a long time. I agree that if they make it easy for everyone than its certainly going to be real easy for the "End Gamers"

[apacheizm23]

What are you talking about?

~ You do not need to etr, just do the first 3 or 4 levels of each destinies for fate points and then when you have the amount of fate and max out destinies you plan on using as your mains ~ it is not rocket science and isn't "difficult", as for times it will depend on how often you play but even only playing weekends it will not take that long. Even if it does take months that has nothing to do with it being "casual".

~ TRing is a fun diversion but it brings no where near as much power to char as ED, it is something you do when you get tired of running "endgame".

1. Hogwash, named items are no where near a requirement like they used to be to make any build work, hell you can get ml-15 + 8 stats items pretty quickly from the u19 quest rewards. I wont even mention the easy to get "welfare" named item sets from eveningstar.

2. Again hogwash, named items are fun and can give you an edge but they are something yuo "need" to grind for if you can't be bothered. Just take em as they come.

3. lol augments are not required either, even if they are a nice way to fit in an extra stat or something you are having difficulty placing on a gear set up.

4. I never play the AH and do not use the asah. I do on accasion buy from the AH but there not usually much interesting on it. Plat is only useful to pay repair bills and buy pots and certain scrolls, if you spend it all on wands and other such junk you are doing something wrong. It is good for that very very occasional good item that shows up in the AH.

The devs have made the game much much more casual friendly with the rise of self healing and all the power creep and lowered difficulty. There is no denying this lmao.


Newbie, Casual, Power-Gamer, Hardcore and many other designators AREN'T mutually exclusive. ~ no kidding but by bthi token you can say "power gamers are much more likely to grind for thing and acquire them in game vs casuals that will need to "buy these things. Ofc that's not a hard rule but that how it tends to go.

Dunno maybe no one has told you this before but playing casually doesn't= playing stupidly, it just means you need to focus more if you want to get anywhere, ofc if you going to dabble with 15 or so alts on various servers then ya maybe it'll seem to you that you need to be some hardcore diaper wearing power gamer to get thing done but then that just means you trying to do too many thing at once.

Otto boxes, I have never used any and never will I really do not see why you bring this into it, it a cheesy way for those in a hurry to get that quick PL, it doesn't really have anything to do with being casual or not.

Everyone needs people to play with, sadly DDO has gone to a group heavy gameplay to a more solo friendly gameplay and that is due to the changes to make the game more "casual" friendly.

Pugs I used to pug all the time now I hardly bother with it as more often than not I will be done a quest before people join or I have to wait longer than the quest takes for them to get to it. As to elite being the norm again see lowered difficulty due to casualization of the game.

IF you can find just 1 friend/buddy/guildy to play with you casually you can ream your way through this game, even on a first life, unlike back when they had leveling sigils and the like. lol

Oh about the only thing I would pay for, as a premium, with real money on a new char is maybe a greater tome of learning and "maybe"a tome or two as straight up + tomes do not drop as often as they used to due to being polluted with the x to x tomes.

Excellent and very well said.. You pretty much just said it all thank you.. I'm not going to go back and forth we these folks.. The game developers have to make money and with that have made the game a ton easier. Shi! you can even buy yourself to the end game.

[SilkofDrasnia]

A Power-Gamer is someone who wants to play the End-Game and only the End-Game - Someone who is happy to PAY to skip the rest of the game just to get to that End-Game!



Casuals aren't interested in having "rewards" handed to them easily and quickly - They're interested in PLAYING THE GAME {at least at first - Until they realise that they absolutely need a certain level of character strength to do so!}.



It wasn't Casuals asking for Raid Timer Bypasses
It wasn't Casuals asking for BB
It wasn't Casuals asking for 8 {maybe 10 next year} MORE Levels!

No those were things asked for by Power-Gamers!
And they got them!
Despite what that did to the Casuals!


How many Casuals were there at End-Game pre MotU - Yes some of us had finally made it BUT it was the Power-Gamers who were begging for more!
You know why?
So they could leave us Casuals behind again!


It is funny to me reading these attacks on "Casuals" who are supposedly now blasting through EEs Solo - Those people AREN'T Casuals!
They're Power-Gamers!

Casuals are still running EN in GROUPS!

What lol *shakes head*

Casual are running EN in GROUPS.... Palease I am in a casual guild we do not care about guild levels or whether someone logs in once every 3 months or everyday, we do not require them to run raids or even force them to run with the other guildies etc etc. Guess what none of us run EN even with a newbies that started 2 hours ago.

Any "casual" that needs to run EN in a group is really more a newbie that doesn't know any better and doesn't know how to play the game yet, heh quite frankly all of the casuals in my casual guild would be offended by your claim that casuals need to run EN in groups especially when most run EE when in groups and EH solo.

[FranOhmsford]

Good post and thanks for clearing that up for me. Than from what u said there I guess I am a "Power Gamer" because I really only enjoy the end game to see just how good my character can be, at the very highest level in the game. I don't care much for the lower levels tho I'm happy they have added a great deal to that part of the game. I do wish they add more mid level content for the TR process. Example: level 15 quest's etc.

You're willing to work for your levels {I assume as you've said nothing about Otto's] BUT you still want those levels to go by faster.

The Casual doesn't CARE how fast he/she levels so long as it's noticeable - The fun of the game is in the Playing NOT the Completion!

I don't know if I understand you correctly but I don't want to leave anyone behind and have nothing against any style of player. I know of many players like myself who only play for the end game and I can assure you that's not what they're thinking nor talking about.

Maybe not you - Maybe not your friends in game.
Maybe you are more "Hardcore" than "Power-Gamer" - Remember these are two different things - One can be both but one can also be a Casual Power-Gamer or a Hardcore Casual.

I'm probably a Hardcore Casual as I've played multiple hours daily for 4 years!

A Casual Power-Gamer is what everyone's railing at on these forums - The guy who can't be bothered to do any of the work - He wants it all and he wants it now!
But the fact is that player is still a POWER GAMER!
He doesn't care one jot about the levelling, about the lore, about the phenomenal explorer zones!
All he cares about is being at the TOP!

I know that the game has gotten quite easier than it used to be that's for sure. And that's from experience because I been playing a long time. I agree that if they make it easy for everyone than its certainly going to be real easy for the "End Gamers"

A lot of that is actually just from experience you know.

I've already stated that I used to run quests multiple levels over on Elite prior to BB.
Since BB I now run those same quests at BB Level - So yes the game is easier for me now than it was then!

However: I've got BETTER - The game hasn't got EASIER!

[apacheizm23]

What lol *shakes head*

Casual are running EN in GROUPS.... Palease I am in a casual guild we do not care about guild levels or whether someone logs in once every 3 months or everyday, we do not require them to run raids of even force them to run with the other guildies etc etc. Guess what none of us run EN even with a newbies that started 2 hours ago.

Any "casual" that needs to run EN in a group is really more a newbie that doesn't know any better and doesn't know how to play the game yet, heh quite frankly all of the casuals in my casual guild would be offended by your claim that casuals need to run EN in groups especially when most run EE when in groups and EH solo.

Agreed.

[FranOhmsford]

What lol *shakes head*

Casual are running EN in GROUPS.... Palease I am in a casual guild we do not care about guild levels or whether someone logs in once every 3 months or everyday, we do not require them to run raids of even force them to run with the other guildies etc etc. Guess what none of us run EN even with a newbies that started 2 hours ago.

Any "casual" that needs to run EN in a group is really more a newbie that doesn't know any better and doesn't know how to play the game yet, heh quite frankly all of the casuals in my casual guild would be offended by your claim that casuals need to run EN in groups especially when most run EE when in groups and EH solo.

What we have here is more a problem with descriptions than anything else.

You consider yourself a "Casual" because you are in a "Casual Guild"

Yet a "Casual Guild" is quite different from a "Casual Player"

And one problem with DDO is the insistence on grading players into so few categories {an insistence on grading players at all in a D&D based game is wrong but it's human and can't be helped}.


Also: Again with the attacks on "lesser" players - Why do people have to do this?

I've seen plenty of players who couldn't possibly be described as "Newbies who don't know any better" who run EN in Groups!


P.S. I'm a very Casual Player yet I care very much about my Guild - if someone in my Guild doesn't log in at least once a month they're gone!

[apacheizm23]

You're willing to work for your levels {I assume as you've said nothing about Otto's] BUT you still want those levels to go by faster.

The Casual doesn't CARE how fast he/she levels so long as it's noticeable - The fun of the game is in the Playing NOT the Completion!



Maybe not you - Maybe not your friends in game.
Maybe you are more "Hardcore" than "Power-Gamer" - Remember these are two different things - One can be both but one can also be a Casual Power-Gamer or a Hardcore Casual.

I'm probably a Hardcore Casual as I've played multiple hours daily for 4 years!

A Casual Power-Gamer is what everyone's railing at on these forums - The guy who can't be bothered to do any of the work - He wants it all and he wants it now!
But the fact is that player is still a POWER GAMER!
He doesn't care on jot about the levelling, about the lore, about the phenomenal explorer zones!
All he cares about is being at the TOP!



A lot of that is actually just from experience you know.

I've already stated that I used to run quests multiple levels over on Elite prior to BB.
Since BB I now run those same quests at BB Level - So yes the game is easier for me now than it was then!

However: I've got BETTER - The game hasn't got EASIER!

Exactly, it is the playing that is enjoyable but to a lot of players, the completion is just as enjoyable as the journey, but I know what you mean. Yes they're are folks who purchase a lot of heroic and epic stones who are Gamers. I'm not one of them I assure you, as I rather spend my money at the Pub lol

I have a friend who buys 6 or more of those stones when ever they're available. He enjoys building new characters and playing them to End Game and want's to get there as quick as possible so he uses the stones. Plus the stones come with reincarnation timer reset and a few other goodies.

I'll say it again, the game has gotten a lot easier, but even still they're are some players that are still complaining.. I don't understand..

With that I am going to log in and Epic TR one of my characters. Have a good one people.

[apacheizm23]

I just want to clarify something I said earlier when I said the Game has gotten to easy and or easier. What I am referring to really is that you can buy stuff/things to make it easy. Named loot etc etc.. Honestly I'm not a big fan of that at all. oh well I understand.

[esojiul]

I think the solution for endgame, it´s MYTHIC Level (34) for CAP players (28 or 30 in the future). where monster do more damage (compare EE-imposible to solo it) and traps huge amount of damage. Not increase their hp. Include trap on all the quests.
Where you can upgrade your epic item (first forge epic item) using a drop call mythic augment example for sword of shadow: requires 10 heroism +1000cov+40 token to forge the item+1augment.

Example Sword of shadow
Epic Version
+10 Enhancement Bonus
Adamantine
2.5[2d6] + 10 Slash, Adamantine, Magic-Critical 18-20 / x3
Colorless Augment Slot
Red Augment Slot

Mythical Version
15+Enhancement Bonus
Metalline
3.5(2d6)+15,metaline,magic-critical 18-20 / x3
2 red augment

Epic time blade
2 [1d8] + 6 Slash, Magic critical 19-20 / x2
+6 Enhancement Bonus
Doublestrike 6%
Improved Paralyzing
Improved Slowburst
Feather FallingFeather Falling: This item is engraved with feathers and bestows a powerful magical effect. Whenever the wearer begins to fall from any height, this effect slows the decent dramatically, causing the wearer to fall like a feather.
Freedom of Movement
Red Augment Slot
Colorless Augment Slot

Mythic time blade
3 [1d8] + 10 Slash, Magic critical 19-20 / x2
+10Enhancement Bonus
Doublestrike 8%
Sovereign Paralyzing
Sovereign Slowburst
Feather Falling: This item is engraved with feathers and bestows a powerful magical effect. Whenever the wearer begins to fall from any height, this effect slows the decent dramatically, causing the wearer to fall like a feather.
Freedom of Movement
2 Red Augment Slot
2 Colorless Augment Slot

Epic Blood stone
Seeker +8

Mythic Blood Stone
Seeker +12
Exceptional Seeker +4
Purple Augment Slot

[SilkofDrasnia]

What we have here is more a problem with descriptions than anything else.

You consider yourself a "Casual" because you are in a "Casual Guild" I am a casual player, I enjoy the journey I just like to have a plan as I enjoy it. I do not play as often as I use too, I do not care about gear as much as before but more importantly I do not play as regularly as before. This is quite fitting and makes me a casual player. Look it up casual, casual doesn't just mean one thing it can mean a whole set of different things.

Yet a "Casual Guild" is quite different from a "Casual Player" Like proven above I said "casual" can mean different things.

And one problem with DDO is the insistence on grading players into so few categories {an insistence on grading players at all in a D&D based game is wrong but it's human and can't be helped}. There is nothing degrading about it, it is a way to loosely set a criteria so as we have an idea what the other person means when communicating, the problem arises when someone tries to subvert a term into a strict specific when said term has more and/or criteria.


Also: Again with the attacks on "lesser" players - Why do people have to do this? Attacks on lesser players? Sorry but newbies or newb is not an attack, it is not a derogatory term like noob is.

I've seen plenty of players who couldn't possibly be described as "Newbies who don't know any better" who run EN in Groups! Good for you, I am sure there are some that do but doesn't mean they need to like your statement implies, it will be because they choose to for some odd reason. It is false and plain untrue to make blanket statements that, "Casuals are still running EN in GROUPS!" like they have no other choice because OMG content is hard and caters to "power gamers". Btw I never said casuals are, "blasting through EEs Solo". I said casuals in my guild are soloing EH and running EE when they party.


P.S. I'm a very Casual Player yet I care very much about my Guild - if someone in my Guild doesn't log in at least once a month they're gone!

It's great you care about your guild, guess what so do I.

In fact since my guild is a "casual" guild we do not have such lofty requirements, as is often seen in hardcore endgame guild, as must log in xx per month etc, I am lucky that peeps in my guild are adult enough to know that people often play in cycles and often have real life commitments which can mean they get really busy and have periods where they can't play for a couple months/weeks etc.

Btw replies in orange

[nibel]

And another thread slipped into Hardcore x Casuals. Sigh.

Please, read this Magic Player Profile article (Timmy, Johnny, Spike) that do a much better job explaining player nuances than the simple binarism that is "hardcore x casual". This article is almost ten years old, and is still spot-on for MOST multiplayer games.

Some people keep playing because they want flashy stuff. Some people play because they love to build new character concepts. Some people play because they like to master the system and be above all. Some people play because of challenge. Some people play because their friends are playing and they want to play with them. Some people just want to collect everything that is in game (pets, past lifes, named gear, whatever).

While you (general you, not directed at anyone) still believe that there is a mythical player that is hardcore because they ONLY care about being being top level running raids in the highest possible difficulty, and the other mythical player is only logging to play Khortos on casual, the discussion will never advance past attacks.

Colored text annoys me but I'll usually (though not always) read it. What I don't read are replies embedded within quote boxes. I scroll right by them without even skimming.

Ditto. Specially because you can't easily re-quote replies in quotes.

[96th_Malice]

The Temple of Elemental Evil.

Yep, we will be creating our own version of the original, classic Temple inside DDO. We’re very excited about adapting one of the most famous modules in Dungeons and Dragons history, and we hope you are too.

Very cool .... This I'm looking forward to BUT agreed take your time on this one

[janave]

The quests you designed are among the good ones,
looking forward to the new stuff

[Oxarhamar]

A Power-Gamer is someone who wants to play the End-Game and only the End-Game - Someone who is happy to PAY to skip the rest of the game just to get to that End-Game!



Casuals aren't interested in having "rewards" handed to them easily and quickly - They're interested in PLAYING THE GAME {at least at first - Until they realise that they absolutely need a certain level of character strength to do so!}.



It wasn't Casuals asking for Raid Timer Bypasses
It wasn't Casuals asking for BB
It wasn't Casuals asking for 8 {maybe 10 next year} MORE Levels!

No those were things asked for by Power-Gamers!
And they got them!
Despite what that did to the Casuals!


How many Casuals were there at End-Game pre MotU - Yes some of us had finally made it BUT it was the Power-Gamers who were begging for more!
You know why?
So they could leave us Casuals behind again!

It is funny to me reading these attacks on "Casuals" who are supposedly now blasting through EEs Solo - Those people AREN'T Casuals!
They're Power-Gamers!

Casuals are still running EN in GROUPS!

Sorry Fran your oppinions are far from accurate

PowerGamers are not the pay2skip crowd eating up OrtosBoxes just to get to the end.

To most PowerGamers that trip from 1-20 20-28 is trivial too trivial to pay out of pocket for a bypass

[Oxarhamar]

What we have here is more a problem with descriptions than anything else.

You consider yourself a "Casual" because you are in a "Casual Guild"

Yet a "Casual Guild" is quite different from a "Casual Player"

And one problem with DDO is the insistence on grading players into so few categories {an insistence on grading players at all in a D&D based game is wrong but it's human and can't be helped}.


Also: Again with the attacks on "lesser" players - Why do people have to do this?

I've seen plenty of players who couldn't possibly be described as "Newbies who don't know any better" who run EN in Groups!


P.S. I'm a very Casual Player yet I care very much about my Guild - if someone in my Guild doesn't log in at least once a month they're gone!

Would want to be in your guild that's an aweful way to manage the guild.

[LeslieWest_GuitarGod]

Yeah it should never be about casuals vs hardcore.

For one its impossible to distinguish. Our guild caters to those who prefer drama free and zerg-free adventures in a team atmosphere. If you join Tyrs Paladium, that's exactly what you are going to find.

Now, that said, we have members that have amazing amounts of game knowledge and player skill. We have others that play often, and those that play when they can around work/school hours. We have those that live in the end game and excel, others that are on the TR/completion train, and those that maxed their epic destiny options. We have those who have never run an EE or even a raid. And we have those that have run EVERY EE and raid countless times.

Yet, we have what many would define as casuals and hardcore. Funny enough we ALL get along.

We never use these terms in guild because none of them apply. Even "Mr Korthos Green" may become your guild's next accomplished raid leader or a monk guru for your guild's monks.

Dont sweat the Jones' small stuff. Just play the game!!