KotC is fixed in Update 7

[SteeleTrueheart]

No longer affects undead.

FYI

[Hokonoso]

that sux but not surprised. the devs have it in their mind that undead needs to be immune to everything (see monk touch of death nerf) so this just seemed natural.

[psymun]

I figure they just wanted to make abilities work the way they should.

Touch of Death to Undead? In that case you would be able to finger/destruct undead.

Knight of the Chalice is supposed to destroy Evil Outsiders... Hunter of the Dead is supposed to be the... Hunter of the Dead.

Stupid Devs for actually making changes that make sense...

[TigrisMorte]

I figure they just wanted to make abilities work the way they should.

Touch of Death to Undead? In that case you would be able to finger/destruct undead.

Knight of the Chalice is supposed to destroy Evil Outsiders... Hunter of the Dead is supposed to be the... Hunter of the Dead.

Stupid Devs for actually making changes that make sense...

The sarcasm is strong in this one!

[Bardicus]

It makes sense and matches the description, but what does it do to class balance?

With KoTC losing the undead DPS but Paladins gaining intimidate as a class skill are they pushing for fighters to be considered offensive and paladins defensive?

[Uska]

It makes sense and matches the description, but what does it do to class balance?

With KoTC losing the undead DPS but Paladins gaining intimidate as a class skill are they pushing for fighters to be considered offensive and paladins defensive?

The change to KoTC still doesnt hurt paladins much they still will be fighting more outsiders then undead

[78mackson]

It makes sense and matches the description, but what does it do to class balance?

With KoTC losing the undead DPS but Paladins gaining intimidate as a class skill are they pushing for fighters to be considered offensive and paladins defensive?

...and fighters makes better tanks then paladin anyway.. (duality). I'm glad my paladin will soon be tr'd into a DPS class, atm he feels a bit gimped tbh...

[LiquidShadow]

I'm glad my paladin will soon be tr'd into a DPS class, atm he feels a bit gimped tbh...

i wanted to say the same thing...

[psymun]

It makes sense and matches the description, but what does it do to class balance?

With KoTC losing the undead DPS but Paladins gaining intimidate as a class skill are they pushing for fighters to be considered offensive and paladins defensive?

Isn't that how it's supposed to be?

Fighters are the... Fighters...

Paladins are the defenders...

[KKDragonLord]

Isn't that how it's supposed to be?

Fighters are the... Fighters...

Paladins are the defenders...

no, Fighters are the big armored dudes with a load of tricks

Paladins are survivable Smiters

[LookingForABentoBox]

Does it now work vs native evil outsiders? Tieflings for example?

[psymun]

Does it now work vs native evil outsiders? Tieflings for example?

Unfortunately no.

I would like to see them make it so that any creature that takes damage from Greater Evil Outsider takes damage from Knight of the Chalice.

[Alternative]

Meh, going to hurt in epic wiz king a bit, and that's about it. Time to get real undead banes.

[LookingForABentoBox]

Unfortunately no.

I would like to see them make it so that any creature that takes damage from Greater Evil Outsider takes damage from Knight of the Chalice.

:( It's amazing how much faster bugs get fixed when they benefit players than bugs which are to a player's detriment

[psymun]

Meh, going to hurt in epic wiz king a bit, and that's about it. Time to get real undead banes.

Doesn't Green Steel do more damage than greater banes?

I have Min II, Lit II, Radiance II, and I'm working on Steam II...

If I'm not mistaken, the added DPS from each of these does much more damage than a simple 3d6 from a greater bane...

[Chai]

Doesn't Green Steel do more damage than greater banes?

I have Min II, Lit II, Radiance II, and I'm working on Steam II...

If I'm not mistaken, the added DPS from each of these does much more damage than a simple 3d6 from a greater bane...

+5 holy of greater undead bane will be a +9 weapon, + 5d6 (2 holy and 3 GEB) damage per hit.

[flynnjsw]

:( It's amazing how much faster bugs get fixed when they benefit players than bugs which are to a player's detriment

Correct me if I am wrong, but hasn't this bug been around for quite a while? Since the PrE first came out maybe?

[LookingForABentoBox]

Correct me if I am wrong, but hasn't this bug been around for quite a while? Since the PrE first came out maybe?

It has been around for a while but I was talking out of being annoyed and didn't really think about what I was saying (though in general it is true.) I guess I'm just jaded and bitter about no holy sword falchions :\ In any event I don't think it's a bug that KotC doesn't work against tieflings because tieflings are native outsiders not evil outsiders. But if that's the case then evil outsider bane working on tieflings would also be a bug...

[flynnjsw]

It has been around for a while but I was talking out of being annoyed and didn't really think about what I was saying (though in general it is true.) I guess I'm just jaded and bitter about no holy sword falchions :\ In any event I don't think it's a bug that KotC doesn't work against tieflings because tieflings are native outsiders not evil outsiders. But if that's the case then evil outsider bane working on tieflings would also be a bug...

I whole-heartedly agree with you on the no Holy Sword Falchions.

[psymun]

+5 holy of greater undead bane will be a +9 weapon, + 5d6 (2 holy and 3 GEB) damage per hit.

I think I just like seeing the crit bursts going off... Even with a 5d6 vs. Undead I think my Radiance II does more damage overall because of the critical burst damages, but I don't feel like doing the math so I'll just leave it at that lol...

[elraido]

If you want an undead beater go make a Triple Pos.

[KKDragonLord]

I think I just like seeing the crit bursts going off... Even with a 5d6 vs. Undead I think my Radiance II does more damage overall because of the critical burst damages, but I don't feel like doing the math so I'll just leave it at that lol...
what weapon is your radiance? rapier? khopesh? warhammer?

Before any considerations on damage, in Wiz king the most important weapon type is Blundgeon and fire is not as useful as other damage types. The skellys have DR 40/blunt the Wiz king himself has a similar if not greater DR, a very high AC and is virtually immune to fire. Most mummies cast protection from fire as soon as they appear. all these must be taken into account.

not to mention, critical bursts are always inferior to damage per hit.

a Min II rapier with good burst deals 1d6 damage per hit and an additional 3d6 every crit with the range 15-20/x2

do you think that is better than the 2d6 from Holy?

Holy = 3.5+3.5 = 7 *19 hits in 20 attacks (if character hits on a 2) = 133
Good Burst = 3.5 * 19 + 10.5 *6/20 = 66.5 + 3.15 = 69.65

[LookingForABentoBox]

If you want an undead beater go make a Triple Pos.

Except on epics where disruption doesn't work. And if you're referring to the damage part only an undead bane weapon will probably beat a Pos III

[elraido]

Except on epics where disruption doesn't work. And if you're referring to the damage part only an undead bane weapon will probably beat a Pos III

Who uses it for the disruption? I am taking about the ~15d6 points of burst damage.

[LookingForABentoBox]

Who uses it for the disruption? I am taking about the ~15d6 points of burst damage.

Do you mean blast damage? Because if you mean burst damage you get then on a Pos II

[Missing_Minds]

Unfortunately no.

I would like to see them make it so that any creature that takes damage from Greater Evil Outsider takes damage from Knight of the Chalice.

That is interesting. I noticed that ranger favored enemy (evil ousiders) will not kick in on tieflings, but weapon bane (evil ousiders) will. This is current on live, not lama.

[elraido]

Do you mean blast damage? Because if you mean burst damage you get then on a Pos II

Burst/Blast damage...symantics. Critical strikes.

[Slugnutty]

that sux but not surprised. the devs have it in their mind that undead needs to be immune to everything (see monk touch of death nerf) so this just seemed natural.

Kills me with laughter how people think that Touch of Death is suppose to mean Touch of 500-to-2000-points-of-untyped-damage.

Death as far as I can figure in this game is Negative Energy. They fixed it, get over it Francis -

[PopeJual]

not to mention, critical bursts are always inferior to damage per hit.


Halt Undead scrolls disagree with you.

Now, if you happen to get your hands on a +5 Holy/Holy Burst Maul/Greatclub/Quarterstaff of Greater Undead Bane, then by all means, use it. I haven't found one yet, unfortunately. With mindless undead being both vulnerable to Halt Undead and fairly common, the burst/blast damage is actually very relevant if it's the right type.