Dragontouched Armor rant

[Gol]

Yes, I'm ranting. Yes, I realize Dragontouched (DT) armor has other goodies on it. Other goodies I already have in other slots quite nicely. Any attempts to assuage my rant by commenting on other available bonuses of DT armor will be completely ignored.

/rant on

So, I REALLY REALLY had my hopes up to get rid of my KDS dress on my Dwarven Ranger and replace it with the Dragontouched armor. You guys (Turbine) did a pretty decent job with it, adding 2 armor to the metal armors and 2 dex to the non-metals...

Which means that from a strictly ARMOR perspective, the Kundarak Delving Suit is still the best Light Armor in the game for a humble-dex Evasion fighter type (22-28 Dex) (*cough* melee rangers *cough*).
Dragontouched Chain: 4 dex, 6 armor, +5 = 15
Kundarak Delving Suit: 6 Dex, 5 armor, +5 = 16

(for comparison)
Dragontouched Plate: 1 dex, 10 armor, +5 = 16
Vanilla +5 Mithral Full Plate: 3 Dex, 8 Armor, +5 = 16

Level 10 Mod 1 raid loot should not be the best at ANYTHING anymore. ANYTHING!!!!!

:mad:

[Gunga]

Still looks cool and is viable for a percentage of players.

Nothing wrong with that...didn't you just chastise Turbine for making the abbot docent less valuable, but now you want to make the KDS obsolete?

Are you drunk, too?

[Gol]

didn't you just chastise Turbine for making the abbot docent less valuable, but now you want to make the KDS obsolete?I don't know what the abbot docent even is, Gunga. KDS will never be obsolete because it is only level 10. DT armor is level 16 and is an option for people willing to sacrifice a irreplaceable point of AC with other goodies.

[Gunga]

I don't know what the abbot docent even is, Gunga. KDS will never be obsolete because it is only level 10. DT armor is level 16 and is an option for people willing to sacrifice a irreplaceable point of AC with other goodies.

I'm sorry, Gol. So many tools in the shed, it's hard to remember them all.

Isn't your best option the rainments and some ac 7 or 8 bracers?

[Gol]

I'm sorry, Gol. So many tools in the shed, it's hard to remember them all.

Isn't your best option the rainments and some ac 7 or 8 bracers?
KDS
8 dex (6 base, Dwarven AM 2)
5 armor
+5 enchantment
2 chaosgarde
20 total

8 armor bracers
8 dex
4 raiments
20 total

ritual would apply to them both, so it's a wash.

[Milolyen]

Yes, I'm ranting. Yes, I realize Dragontouched (DT) armor has other goodies on it. Other goodies I already have in other slots quite nicely. Any attempts to assuage my rant by commenting on other available bonuses of DT armor will be completely ignored.

/rant on

So, I REALLY REALLY had my hopes up to get rid of my KDS dress on my Dwarven Ranger and replace it with the Dragontouched armor. You guys (Turbine) did a pretty decent job with it, adding 2 armor to the metal armors and 2 dex to the non-metals...

Which means that from a strictly ARMOR perspective, the Kundarak Delving Suit is still the best Light Armor in the game for a humble-dex Evasion fighter type (22-28 Dex) (*cough* melee rangers *cough*).
Dragontouched Chain: 4 dex, 6 armor, +5 = 15
Kundarak Delving Suit: 6 Dex, 5 armor, +5 = 16

(for comparison)
Dragontouched Plate: 1 dex, 10 armor, +5 = 16
Vanilla +5 Mithral Full Plate: 3 Dex, 8 Armor, +5 = 16

Level 10 Mod 1 raid loot should not be the best at ANYTHING anymore. ANYTHING!!!!!

:mad:

DUDE ... KDS is better in only ONE aspect ... ac. The dragon touched go so far beyond the KDS and can think of many things that can be done with dragon touched that go beyond KDS as well. What is current belt? +6 str? +6 con? Greater false life? Lets say for instance you got the titan belt on +6 str of greater false life ... well you can put both those on the Dragon touched, grab a daggertooth belt and look same stats and you are now 1 ac over KDS and still have a third upgrade.

Alot of times it is about choices and not about makeing something superior in all aspects of the game. I love the dragon touched armor and can't wait to get the upgrades I want on one for both ranger and fighter but specially for my cleric.

Milolyen

[Beherit_Baphomar]

DUDE ... KDS is better in only ONE aspect ... ac.


Level 10 Mod 1 raid loot should not be the best at ANYTHING anymore. ANYTHING!!!!!

He even highlighted it.

[rimble]

He even highlighted it.

And 5 exclamation points! Clearly the writings of a deranged mind...

[Kintro]

I'm looking forward to making a GFL, str6 and heavy fort armour for my non-ac builds so they can wear some more interesting items in other slots.

At the moment they don't look to be awesome for AC builds but they are very nice slot savers while not being any worse than +5 mith.

[Yaga_Nub]

He even highlighted it.

But just because he feels that way doesn't mean that it is.

I'm the only one that gets to decide what is important in DDO and what's not. ;)

[Gunga]

I'm looking forward to making a GFL, str6 and heavy fort armour for my non-ac builds so they can wear some more interesting items in other slots.

At the moment they don't look to be awesome for AC builds but they are very nice slot savers while not being any worse than +5 mith.

Yeah!!!!!!

(Six)

[Milolyen]

He even highlighted it.
And if you looked in my example I also pointed out a way that Dragontouched can end up with a higher ac. Even if he puts the belt on with the KDS he does not have the dex to fill out the extra dex bonus but would with the dragontouched. Also a melee focused str based ranger is usually pretty full up on equipment slots and would not always have room for the belt without giving other important stuff up.

Milolyen

[Vorn]

From what's been revealed so far, unless the dodge bonus was supposed to stack with chattering ring, for my fighter, it doesn't make me say, "wow, I can't live without that!" the way the shroud weaponry or the VoD plate made me feel. Now, maybe if one of the special combinations provided evasion, hee, hee, hee....:rolleyes:

Will reserve judgement, however, until the honored trailblazers have discovered more--in the meantime I still have yet to save the silly dragon.

[Gol]

And if you looked in my example I also pointed out a way that Dragontouched can end up with a higher ac. Even if he puts the belt on with the KDS he does not have the dex to fill out the extra dex bonus but would with the dragontouched. Also a melee focused str based ranger is usually pretty full up on equipment slots and would not always have room for the belt without giving other important stuff up.

MilolyenWhile your point is true in my specific case, it does nothing to address my OP: that mod 1 raid loot is still better for mid dex evasion tanks. You've proved that I need to adjust my dex range to 20-24 instead is all. I personally happen to have 26 so your daggertooth belt idea works for me. It just makes me have to switch in a str belt when doing stuff like Harry in Shroud when AC doesn't matter.

[Aerilyn]

I'm the only one that gets to decide what is important in DDO and what's not. (Yaga Nub)

Hey Yaga come out of the closet and visit and we'll decide if we want to listen:) When the mad god left Argo we found better and more forgiving god:) Our new master is Darkstrike (A Wonderful Totem) We found his parts in the harbor and crafted a wonderful being from Sabo's lost or traded in parts and now have a kinder and gentler being:) LOL

Bergeyon

[Gol]

From what's been revealed so far, unless the dodge bonus was supposed to stack with chattering ring, for my fighter, it doesn't make me say, "wow, I can't live without that!" the way the shroud weaponry or the VoD plate made me feel.
Yeah, that would have made me excited as well. I already have a Chattering Ring though, so I'm going to see what other tier 3 bonuses are available.

[Gunga]

While your point is true in my specific case, it does nothing to address my OP: that mod 1 raid loot is still better for mid dex evasion tanks. You've proved that I need to adjust my dex range to 20-24 instead is all. I personally happen to have 26 so your daggertooth belt idea works for me. It just makes me have to switch in a str belt when doing stuff like Harry in Shroud when AC doesn't matter.

You're a funny guy. :D

[Beherit_Baphomar]

And if you looked in my example I also pointed out a way that Dragontouched can end up with a higher ac. Even if he puts the belt on with the KDS he does not have the dex to fill out the extra dex bonus but would with the dragontouched. Also a melee focused str based ranger is usually pretty full up on equipment slots and would not always have room for the belt without giving other important stuff up.

Milolyen


Yes, I'm ranting. Yes, I realize Dragontouched (DT) armor has other goodies on it. Other goodies I already have in other slots quite nicely. Any attempts to assuage my rant by commenting on other available bonuses of DT armor will be completely ignored.

Highlighting is mine this time.

[Milolyen]

While your point is true in my specific case, it does nothing to address my OP: that mod 1 raid loot is still better for mid dex evasion tanks. You've proved that I need to adjust my dex range to 20-24 instead is all. I personally happen to have 26 so your daggertooth belt idea works for me. It just makes me have to switch in a str belt when doing stuff like Harry in Shroud when AC doesn't matter.

Well if +6 str is your current belt then what is stopping you from creating your armor with +6 str for the second lvl bonus (from tempest rune)? Then you could still get greater false life, +5 resist, or any number of other things for first lvl bonus (from eldrich rune) and free up some other slot. Then on the third teir upgrade (from sov rune) you could go for a guard effect and have it punish those that are able to hit you or if you have tharne's goggles you could go for the tharnes ghost touch and reduced threat that you get from the goggle bracer combo without haveing to wear the bracers. Many different possibilities out there with this armor.

Milolyen

[Gol]

Well if +6 str is your current belt then what is stopping you from creating your armor with +6 str for the second lvl bonus (from tempest rune)? Then you could still get greater false life, +5 resist, or any number of other things for first lvl bonus (from eldrich rune) and free up some other slot. Then on the third teir upgrade (from sov rune) you could go for a guard effect and have it punish those that are able to hit you or if you have tharne's goggles you could go for the tharnes ghost touch and reduced threat that you get from the goggle bracer combo without haveing to wear the bracers. Many different possibilities out there with this armor.

Milolyen
I'm going for item consolidation if I go with DT armor, I'm just trying to find a way to do it without losing AC. I have a very borderline AC on my Ranger - high 50s. Great for trash fights, but losing effectiveness when it matters. I think I have something working, I'm still cruching numbers. I'm going to have to adjust my regular raiding schedule and pick up some new peices, I think.

[rimble]

I see your Dragontouched Armor Rant and raise you a Dragontouched Shield Rant.

[Vorn]

I see your Dragontouched Armor Rant and raise you a Dragontouched Shield Rant.

Oooh...I thought about doing that too...but on the other hand, I finally saw the heal go off on my Levik's Defender last night, so yea!

[swooshrp]

Well the way they keeping adjusting previously old raids to make them more difficult to keep up the new lev cap, then old raid loot should be just as good.

But seriously I agree with the OP about any raid loot post the previous raid unless the same level of quest should be better items...

I was not happy with what they did with the Reaver...yes I understand their reasoning, but why make a raid harder than its original intent. Reaver may be bad example, but the idea of them changing the mechanics of a old raid for sake of making it more difficult to level capped players is stupid.

They changed VON some a while back and although still easy for the experienced group, Turbine needs to recognize the original level design for each raid....Von is a lev 10 raid and its mechanics should reflect that as such. I heard TS got harder when getting to the cave entrance due to the elementals...do you really think a level 10 raid group will enjoy running that quest when its set to a difficult more appropiate for the current level cap??? I

It makes it even worse to know that when we expect to see a lot of new players, those new players won't understand why they are not able to get pass an equal level raid to leveled group due to these constant changes Turbine implements to make the current high end gamers have a bigger challenge.

[gfunk]

At least you are stuck with some nice looking armor... the KDS is one if the nicest suits in the game.. though it probably looks alot nicer on my female drow elf rouge then it does on your dwarf ranger.

I just feel sorry for my dex ranger, who is stuck in the hideous icy raiments... i fear there will never be a better armor, so i might be stuck with fighting in pyjamas for the life of my character...

[Reisz]

I just feel sorry for my dex ranger, who is stuck in the hideous icy raiments... i fear there will never be a better armor, so i might be stuck with fighting in pyjamas for the life of my character...

I thought all rangers were stuck in hideous barkskin...

[gfunk]

I thought all rangers were stuck in hideous barkskin...

well yeah, but so is anyone else who parties with me... though sometimes i'll cover it up with mass camo

[Gol]

I resume my RANT...

Apparently the only Light Dragontouched Armor is Leather, so KDS is still the best mid-dex Evasion build light armor, but now by a much larger margin.

Leather was: 2a/6d
DT Leather: 2a/8d

So figure a Dwarf mid-dex evasion tank.
KDS: 5a/6d. You'd have to have 28 dex to fill it out. How high must your dex be to fill out DT Leather? 8+3=11 ~ 32 Dex. Screw it, get a Robe.

[Yaga_Nub]

I resume my RANT...

Apparently the only Light Dragontouched Armor is Leather, so KDS is still the best mid-dex Evasion build light armor, but now by a much larger margin.

Leather was: 1a/7d
DT Leather: 1a/9d

So figure a Dwarf mid-dex evasion tank.
KDS: 5a/6d. You'd have to have 28 dex to fill it out. How high must your dex be to fill out DT Leather? 9+3=12 ~ 34 Dex. Screw it, get a Robe.

Gol wouldn't that be a 22 to fill out KDS and 28 to fill out DT leather?

[Angelus_dead]

Leather was: 1a/7d
What? Normal leather is 2a/6d. Darkleaf leath is 2a/7d. Padded is 1a/8d.

[Gol]

What? Normal leather is 2a/6d. Darkleaf leath is 2a/7d. Padded is 1a/8d.
Ah, my bad. point remains.

[EazyWeazy]

Gol wouldn't that be a 22 to fill out KDS and 28 to fill out DT leather?

I think he may be figuring armor mastery enhancements.

[Gol]

So figure a Dwarf mid-dex evasion tank.

I think he may be figuring armor mastery enhancements.;)

[nbhs275]

I'm looking forward to making a GFL, str6 and heavy fort armour for my non-ac builds so they can wear some more interesting items in other slots.

At the moment they don't look to be awesome for AC builds but they are very nice slot savers while not being any worse than +5 mith.

+5 mith FP is 13 ac, 3 dex

dragontouch FP is 15, 1 dex. Which means you don't need nearly as much Dex to fill it out. It also means that people who can add to the dex cap of their armor come ahead. Example. My dwarf paladin can only fit a 20 dex onto the build. Which means i needed 2 lvls of dwarf armor mastery to get a total of 18AC. With the new stuff, i can get a 19, and won't lose any dex AC from equiping a mith towershield. So im looking at an overall gain of 2 AC, nevermind the fact i could get the bonuses of a chattering ring, GFL, and +5 prot on top of it all.

[Yori_Firebeard]

Gol wouldn't that be a 22 to fill out KDS and 28 to fill out DT leather?

You are forgetting the armor mastery enhancements!

[Ranmaru2]

So this Dragontouched armore thing has gotten me curious...I've been trying to find a way to get my Dex-based Tank a great AC (No CE as she's praying real hard for a +3 Int tome >.> ) (Originally made for Wounding/puncturing weapons - Dont' have a WoP but I have good enough substitutes), would I be better off staying in my White Dragon Robe atm, or would I be better with a DT Leather?

Dex: 34 atm, 36 with a +3 tome

[Gol]

would I be better off staying in my White Dragon Robe atm, or would I be better with a DT Leather?

Dex: 34 atm, 36 with a +3 tomeIcy Raiments and +7/8 Armor bracers would be best for you.

[Junts]

Hey, I bet you can still gain 1 AC with dragontouched.

Arrange away your belt slot (even if you have a BOBS, you can get gfl/str 6 as your first two DT tiers), and replace it with a Daggertooth's Belt. Fighter Armor Mastery 2 = 2 more dex bonus from your armor.

That should net you 1 AC (doing htat will net my pally two AC, as he's presently got dex to get 3 AC out of MFP).

The slot compaction, should you not already use a BOBS or similar item, should also benefit you with the addition of another slot to work with.

The basic armor itself may have 1 ac less, but if you are creative it is better for everyone who does not use the Icys or who isnt maxing out on fighter dex bonus AP mods etc as it is (and I doubt that build is common)

[Ganak]

Please don't forget all the Mithral folks. Let's consider facts; mithral chain, BP, FP is highly popular. Would you agree from anecdotal evidence?

I'd go as far as suggest it touches most players with more than a few characters.

We saw the weapons selection improve after the launch of the Shroud. I hope a similar expansion in the future will be considered.

[alchilito]

this thread delivers

get your rant on G !!! !!! !!!

(nine)

[Gol]

Hey, I bet you can still gain 1 AC with dragontouched.

Arrange away your belt slot (even if you have a BOBS, you can get gfl/str 6 as your first two DT tiers), and replace it with a Daggertooth's Belt. Fighter Armor Mastery 2 = 2 more dex bonus from your armor.

That should net you 1 AC (doing htat will net my pally two AC, as he's presently got dex to get 3 AC out of MFP).

The slot compaction, should you not already use a BOBS or similar item, should also benefit you with the addition of another slot to work with.

The basic armor itself may have 1 ac less, but if you are creative it is better for everyone who does not use the Icys or who isnt maxing out on fighter dex bonus AP mods etc as it is (and I doubt that build is common)
1 AC and all I lose is Evasion? WIN!

[Junts]

I was of the impression you were comparing to the chainshirt (as that is the light armor option, breastplate being medium).

Is there a reason you lose evasion in a chainshirt that I'm not aware of..?

[Murderface]

Yes, I'm ranting. Yes, I realize Dragontouched (DT) armor has other goodies on it. Other goodies I already have in other slots quite nicely. Any attempts to assuage my rant by commenting on other available bonuses of DT armor will be completely ignored.

/rant on

So, I REALLY REALLY had my hopes up to get rid of my KDS dress on my Dwarven Ranger and replace it with the Dragontouched armor. You guys (Turbine) did a pretty decent job with it, adding 2 armor to the metal armors and 2 dex to the non-metals...

Which means that from a strictly ARMOR perspective, the Kundarak Delving Suit is still the best Light Armor in the game for a humble-dex Evasion fighter type (22-28 Dex) (*cough* melee rangers *cough*).
Dragontouched Chain: 4 dex, 6 armor, +5 = 15
Kundarak Delving Suit: 6 Dex, 5 armor, +5 = 16

(for comparison)
Dragontouched Plate: 1 dex, 10 armor, +5 = 16
Vanilla +5 Mithral Full Plate: 3 Dex, 8 Armor, +5 = 16

Level 10 Mod 1 raid loot should not be the best at ANYTHING anymore. ANYTHING!!!!!

:mad:
if you had a low dex say battle cleric or paladin then thats a pretty good plate for a min dex

[nbhs275]

if you had a low dex say battle cleric or paladin then thats a pretty good plate for a min dex

exactly.. It also means that a dwarf fighter could get a total AC of 22 from armor +dex, without needing a 28 (24 is much more realistic).

BTW, is there a DT docent?

[Tenkari_Rozahas]

BTW, is there a DT docent?

Yeah there is.... check the Agro section of the boards, and check the Sor'jek 3 man topic and look at the pics, one of the guys was a WF... sorc and one of the screenies in the topic shows his DT Docent off

[geoffhanna]

Level 10 Mod 1 raid loot should not be the best at ANYTHING anymore. ANYTHING!!!!!
:mad:

I disagree with the basic premise. I prefer that EVERY raid have something in it that will always be wanted.

[Gol]

I was of the impression you were comparing to the chainshirt (as that is the light armor option, breastplate being medium).

Is there a reason you lose evasion in a chainshirt that I'm not aware of..?
Sorry, I didn't see chain shirt anywhere in your post but I did see full plate mentioned...

Besides, Dragontouched doesn't come in a chain shirt. The only light armor option is leather, of which I have no hopes of "filling out" the dex.

[Mindspat]

OP, there are times where sacraficing a point or two in AC has benefits.