Redesign F2P and VIP Bonuses - Make more of your Game available for more people!

[Forcystus]

The codes ending today kind of makes me want to voice my probably for some people unpopular opinion, that DDO should change the rewards for VIPs and improve the F2P offering again.

Last year at the 15th Aniversary they released a bunch of classes, races and adventures. Honestly, the current Class and Race selection is okayish. My only wish there would be a Favor Based way to unlock Alchemist, e.g. via Margrave University Favor.

My real problem is Quests: Most notably how coming tomorrow new players are out of luck again and will be nickle and dimed for decade old content. By now you should have gotten your return on investment... so let me propose solething wild:

- All Quest Packs older than 2 years become F2P.
- All Expansions older than 5 years become F2P. (You sold everything till and including Sharn for 99pts, you probably are way past ROI there as well.)
- All Expansions, including Mini-Expansions, older than 1 year are available for VIPs.
- All newly released Quest Packs are available for VIPs.

This allows new players to not feel like they are locked out of much, gear up with efficient gear (Sharn + Sands still are effective gearsets) and will increase playercount. Also, that will give a wave of positive feedback right after giving out the code and will generate positive hype in the future, when paid content turns F2P regularly, e.g. when Feywild enters F2P.

[Eantarus]

they already re-designed VIP. When the new changes role out it will go from being a total rip-off to being a total rip-off with a stacking bonus to fletching.

[Cathimon]

I think VIP is in a weird spot. Back in the old days, I mean maybe 1-2 years after the game went F2P, me and my friends came to the game and all paid VIP to unlock the adventure packs, and I remember two of them left when the first expension was introduced and they had to pay for it, in addition to the VIP fee.

I came back with 3 friends earlier this year, and once again, we paid for VIP to unlock the adventure packs. And then all the content was made free through the coupons. We all dropped VIP.

At this point, I imagine 95% of the VIPs are paying MOSTLY for the 10% xp bonus. For me and my friend that is still playing, it's just not our cup of tea. And I really don't know, if I'm being honest, what would make me want to go VIP again at this point, besides maybe an HC league where I can't open elite.

[Aelonwy]

I think a good start would be to make everything that existed when the game went Free to Play to start... F2P now and forever going forward. Think about how many wilderness zones that would open up to adding NEW Pay-to-Play adventure packs or even EXPANSIONS. It would really open up the game to fresh additions when currently with the enormous list of P2P packs handcuffing so many design directions.

Examples:

• Steam Tunnels (?)
• Tangleroot Gorge
• Threnal
• Restless Isles
• Menechtarun
• Orchard
• Vale of Twilight
• Stormreaver's Refuge zones
• Shavarath

Most of these are decently sized zones which could fit further adventures. Some are smaller but could be expanded upon with new, unexplored areas. I actually love that they added new quests to Cerulean Hills and Searing Heights and sincerely wish more zones were unfettered for them to add new interests, new explorations, new adventure.

[Bjond]

I think a good start would be to make everything that existed when the game went Free to Play to start... F2P now and forever going forward.

IMHO, using access at all is a bad gate for a game with a dwindling supply of players. It makes it harder to group with people. In an ideal world, I'd do something like permit all players to have play access to all content, but not loot access; ie. you can group with anyone anywhere, but unless you're a paying customer, you can't wear anything but RNG trash drops or CC gear. If you go from pay to free, your gear falls on the floor (well, inventory).

That won't fly with DDO -- would likely need some fundamental code reworks to support it. But, they could do the more modern game approach: buying the latest expansion includes access to ALL older content. That kind of policy going forward greatly simplifies buy-in for new players and makes it easy for existing to "keep up".

DDO's current points v cash v packs v expansions system is well beyond byzantine. Boil it down to ONE CLICK buys it all. To buy or not to buy should be the question (not which/what/how to buy). It is nobler in the mind to set a price and keep it than to suffer newbies slinging an outrageous fortune only to learn it was all free days ago.

[mbartol]

I’ve stated previously that all content, including Expansions, prior to SSG taking over should be free (or possibly packaged into a single low-point bundle). It doesn’t make sense that anyone with an account while the free quest code is active gets all but one Adventure Pack, but a new player that starts tomorrow faces a huge paywall. Smooth out the curve, rather than a feast or famine situation.

[Oxarhamar]

I’ve stated previously that all content, including Expansions, prior to SSG taking over should be free (or possibly packaged into a single low-point bundle). It doesn’t make sense that anyone with an account while the free quest code is active gets all but one Adventure Pack, but a new player that starts tomorrow faces a huge paywall. Smooth out the curve, rather than a feast or famine situation.

Yeah that code should just continually be offered & be seriously advertised

[Forcystus]

I mean, if their new cycle is 1 HC rerun and new 1 HC leauge per year, why not make one or the other locked behind VIP to give it back value?

I think as a F2P it's fine only having 1 HC season when in exchange more of the game is available for them.

And yes, gatekeeping and seperating such a small playerbase, be it via Packs or via the server structure is a bad decision, but HC is more a fringe playstyle than the main game...

[mbartol]

I mean, if their new cycle is 1 HC rerun and new 1 HC leauge per year, why not make one or the other locked behind VIP to give it back value?

I think as a F2P it's fine only having 1 HC season when in exchange more of the game is available for them.

And yes, gatekeeping and seperating such a small playerbase, be it via Packs or via the server structure is a bad decision, but HC is more a fringe playstyle than the main game...

I think having the “new” HC League available to VIP only would be fair, since it would provide value to the VIP subscription and make the earliest access available for paying customers. Making the rerun available to FTP/Premium allows anyone to earn the cosmetic prizes at a later date.

This scenario would be similar to Expansion packs being available for points after being sold in the cash store for a period of time first.

Edit: I say this as a Premium player. I dropped my VIP sub after SSG dropped the ball in January, and won’t consider re-subscribing until SSG provides some REAL value—not the proposed updates presented in February.

[Uruk-hai]

I think having the “new” HC League available to VIP only would be fair, since it would provide value to the VIP subscription and make the earliest access available for paying customers. Making the rerun available to FTP/Premium allows anyone to earn the cosmetic prizes at a later date.

This scenario would be similar to Expansion packs being available for points after being sold in the cash store for a period of time first.

I second HC being VIP only. Would pickup a lot of VIP accounts at least for those HC months.

[thegreatcthulhu]

So...

Yes, I agree VIP and the store both need redesigning. As they stand, they don't seem to provide enough IMO to help alleviate the inevitable boredom of doing the reincarnation & reaper grind... And buying tons of Ottos is not my idea of a fair exchange.

[Oxarhamar]

I mean, if their new cycle is 1 HC rerun and new 1 HC leauge per year, why not make one or the other locked behind VIP to give it back value?

I think as a F2P it's fine only having 1 HC season when in exchange more of the game is available for them.

And yes, gatekeeping and seperating such a small playerbase, be it via Packs or via the server structure is a bad decision, but HC is more a fringe playstyle than the main game...

I was cool with HCL locked behind VIP

I believe that they are expecting more store purchases from more accounts on HCL

Still there are F2P that complain they can’t open Elite on HCL but don’t want to go VIP



I’m not convinced HCL lockout would increase VIP subscription


VIP needs its value seriously repaired

[Eantarus]

I was cool with HCL locked behind VIP

I believe that they are expecting more store purchases from more accounts on HCL

Still there are F2P that complain they can’t open Elite on HCL but don’t want to go VIP



I’m not convinced HCL lockout would increase VIP subscription

I don't care one way or the other about HCL, but I think the fact that they made it available for F2P demonstrates it wasn't the VIP-seller SSG was hoping for. People weren't willing to buy it for access OR elite unlocks, so what else is there?

VIP needs its value seriously repaired

Yes, but to do that, they've had to take the radical step of actually listening to the player base. Their attempts to do it without any sort of player feedback are doomed.

[Oxarhamar]

I don't care one way or the other about HCL, but I think the fact that they made it available for F2P demonstrates it wasn't the VIP-seller SSG was hoping for. People weren't willing to buy it for access OR elite unlocks, so what else is there?



Yes, but to do that, they've had to take the radical step of actually listening to the player base. Their attempts to do it without any sort of player feedback are doomed.

Meh I think they wanted to open the HCL store to more players instead of just VIP

I wouldn't purcharse VIP for HCL



not that radical they listen from time to time we (mostly) didn't get the builder spender nonsence in Epic Destiny revamp due to player feedback

[Aelonwy]

Meh I think they wanted to open the HCL store to more players instead of just VIP

I wouldn't purcharse VIP for HCL

not that radical they listen from time to time we (mostly) didn't get the builder spender nonsence in Epic Destiny revamp due to player feedback

Hmm well as anecdotal info, my hubby went VIP to have access to the first HC season (played alone or PuGged), and he was VIP again for elite opening in a later season - the Archon one IIRC (we played together), and then I went VIP for HC 6 to be able to open elite (played with family and made new friends). However, we don't buy tomes or A$ roll to level on HC or reroll chests at all. The gambling factor on HC makes investing in a character that may die and be inaccessible just not reasonable for us.

[SoVeryBelgian]

I'd just like more use of spaces already created, expanding on further low level options to intrigue new players, seeing as most make a character and get bored in the first 30 minutes, dropping a decrepit game where all you do is scuttle through sewers for the the first 5 levels.

Re-boot the Korthos storyline, update the visuals for Korthos and the Harbor. Make the market feel more expansive. Add more lowbie quests that introduce mechanics you see later in games.


And use maps that were under-utilized. Searing Heights is STILL quite empty. Refurbish Restless Isles & Sorrowdusk. Make it possible to get older expansions for free permanently. Keeping MotU and Shadowfell available.

[Oxarhamar]

Hmm well as anecdotal info, my hubby went VIP to have access to the first HC season (played alone or PuGged), and he was VIP again for elite opening in a later season - the Archon one IIRC (we played together), and then I went VIP for HC 6 to be able to open elite (played with family and made new friends). However, we don't buy tomes or A$ roll to level on HC or reroll chests at all. The gambling factor on HC makes investing in a character that may die and be inaccessible just not reasonable for us.

That’s fair but I’d wager that players spend store on HCL which is the main reason that they opened it up to non VIP to get more spending otherwise it would just be better to keep it VIP only