UPDATE 58 PREVIEW 1 - Blightcaster Druid

[Ultinoob]

Couple of questions:

You changed the core 6 in seasons herald. Does it mean it does not give to caster level anymore but only max caster level? Also it seems like you give +1W to shillelagh. This is already in core 3. does this mean that shillelagh if taking all cores gives +3w for wooden staffs?

Spike growth seems to be worth casting with these changes. Maybe even in endgame. Is there any chance you can change the visuals? When I used it in raids people got upset cause it meant they could not see anything…

What tree from druid do you loose when selecting this archetype? Seasons herald?

In hive keeper from level 4 you get “Your reflex saves are increased by 1 for every 3 druid levels”. Is this also the case in the upgraded version?

[Torc]

I didn't assume but wanted to check if it was a math oops or the way it was intended.

In game, Defile also states that it heals you for 1d2 per CL while standing in it if you have death eater and does not. Guessing as it's not in the patch notes this was a scrapped idea that the text made into the preview? Should probably be removed. From what I'm finding playing it, it doesn't need the extra sustain power anyway. Death Eater is EXTREMELY strong. So much so I would almost suggest bringing it down to max of 3 stacks.

Ya after play testing Death Eater's temp HP mechanic we cut that heal out. That string is out of date. Death Eater is kinda crazy when it comes online at level 6. It is meant to be one of the signature abilities of the tree. We'll keep an eye on it.

-T

[WiseFreelancer]

I'm going to focus my previewing on the ranger tree as I am just too excited about it (and I don't really play druid-type classes much) but I have to say I really love the flavour and distinctiveness of this new druid. The first three classes we got were cool and all but this really seems like a gear-shift in terms of taking a class in a different direction.

[Torc]

Couple of questions:

You changed the core 6 in seasons herald. Does it mean it does not give to caster level anymore but only max caster level? Also it seems like you give +1W to shillelagh. This is already in core 3. does this mean that shillelagh if taking all cores gives +3w for wooden staffs?

Spike growth seems to be worth casting with these changes. Maybe even in endgame. Is there any chance you can change the visuals? When I used it in raids people got upset cause it meant they could not see anything…

What tree from druid do you loose when selecting this archetype? Seasons herald?

In hive keeper from level 4 you get “Your reflex saves are increased by 1 for every 3 druid levels”. Is this also the case in the upgraded version?

1. The core 6 in SH should do exactly the same thing it did plus prevent certain spells from burning up. There may be a transcription error if it appears to be missing anything.

2. Spike Growth's entity is getting look at for a few things (sometimes it floats). We can probably shorten it easily enough.

3. as stated at the top of the post you lose the nature's protector (bear tree) and you get no bear form.

4. The upgraded version of the Hive gets it every 2 druid level (+10 at level 20 druid). It's missing from the post (will fix).

[SWCarter]

Is there any chance of adding the option to heal from negative healing (which in turn reduces positive healing)? Thematically, it seems viable for this archetype to have that option.

I run with an undead group and having to splash 3 levels of Wizard or 3 levels of Dark Apostate to fit in really takes the "oomph" out of the core class. If you want to add a universal tree that adds support for negative healing instead, that'd be even better .

[cru121]

In the Hive Keeper form, Biting Poison Imbue does not deal any damage.
When I swap to plague wolf, I can now see the damage.

[Rehmlah]

You changed the core 6 in seasons herald. Does it mean it does not give to caster level anymore but only max caster level? Also it seems like you give +1W to shillelagh. This is already in core 3. does this mean that shillelagh if taking all cores gives +3w for wooden staffs?

I think this is just a misconception regarding notation. Looking at the notation used for the Blightcaster tree, "Core 6" refers to the core unlocked at level 6 (the third core). As Torc said, the only thing changing about it should be the addition for spells to not be burned up.

This archetype looks really exciting, and I can't wait to try it out!

[Zeklijan]

Ya after play testing Death Eater's temp HP mechanic we cut that heal out. That string is out of date. Death Eater is kinda crazy when it comes online at level 6. It is meant to be one of the signature abilities of the tree. We'll keep an eye on it.

-T

I definitely agree that healing would be a bit crazy. I think 5x ability score is good, I like where it stands. It will be amazing for leveling, and still great at cap.

[cru121]

Changes to Nature's Warrior: - (Not in this build, coming next preview)

• Howl of Winter renamed: Hunter's Howl to make it agnostic to Blighted Wolf or Winter Wolf
• Great White Wolf Gets a multi selector with the alternate called Doom Wolf - 10/20/30 acid spell power, 10/20/30% Acid Resistance
• Jaws of Winter get's renamed "Feasting Jaws" - Gain 10 times your character level in temporary HPs for 30 seconds after using Jaws of Winter or Jaws of Doom
• Cold Breath damage will be updated to match current spell damage formulas

Consider unlocking some animal/wolf-only abilities also for plants (and elementals maybe).

[Ipsum]

Some initial thoughts:

* The theming is really cool, glad to have a dot/poison caster
* Glad the DOT spells are getting an adjustment
* I wish we had nature's protector or something else tanky to go with the "Thorn Knight" theming - i'm honestly not sure season's herald makes sense as a tree in this archetype

bugs so far:

* You can double up on "efficient metamagic: maximize" due to a lack of anti-requisites in Blight Caster
* Carrion swarm doesn't apply "spread the blight"

[Arkat]

Blight Druid...yes!

Finally, a use for the Blightstaff!

[Xezom]

So here are some pieces of feedback. My current set up I'm running a thorn Druid. Very single target focused, but seems pretty decent, with no trouble in the sustain department:

1) Splinterbolt has a shorted natural range than Thorn Strike. It's a higher level spell version of thorn strike so should probably have the double range of thorn strike as well.
2) Splinterbolt is for some reason having a double proc when it hits (more on that in a sec). It does a small mount of damage upfront with the larger full damage following. I'm not sure what's causing it to do that. Checked it with and without the Imbues and makes no difference.
3) The Thorn Spells need some work with targeting. They are very prone to hitting the floor or objects that are actually slightly larger in there hit box than they would suggest. Jump casting is almost mandatory on short characters as most of the thorns crash into the ground only feet in front of you. I'm wondering if this is an issue with how large the projectiles are since they are significantly fatter than most with their hit boxes.
3.5 edit) the thorn spells also have little to no target tracking. (ie. they don't follow targets). Combined with point 3 this makes them a little tricky to pull off very efficiently. Maybe consider adding tracking to them.
4) Thorn Bloom is VERY close range. Like less than touch range with enlarge for it to be reliable. I think this might be in part related to point 3? Maybe the collision is occurring too fast with the ground or something? I'm not entirely sure but if it's not a collision issue I would suggest upping the range a bit, it's even harder to use than the Acid Spray/Burning Hands spells at present. It also has the same issues as the rogue's Time Bomb. If you are fighting something on uneven ground, it is very likely to go off and not hit them.
5) Death Eater is EXTREMELY powerful. I know Torc, you stated that it's one of the signature abilities of the tree. That it is. It is basically a permanent 5x wisdom temp HP shield that full refreshes on kill no matter how low your temps get. Even If you have a paltry 50 wisdom and 5 stacks (250 temp HP shield) and you are down to 1 temp HP remaining and get a kill, it resets to 250. It's not uncommon to be running around late game with 400+ permanent temp HP. I would suggest bringing this down to maybe 3 stacks max, or make it when you get a kill, you gain 1 stack worth of temp HP back not a full refresh to 5.
6) The T5s are... okay. They're not bad. The immunity strip makes poison actually viable so that is good, but for me it's just missing a certain Je ne sais quoi. Maybe add something related to your animal or elemental form sorta like the mini Anger of noonday sun/Icy Mantle but death aura-ish?

Something like:
While in Wolf form gain: Nearby enemies take 1d6 poison damage per caster level (to a maximum of 20d6 at level 20) every 3 seconds. Fortitude save halves.
While in Thorn Form gain: Nearby enemies take 1d6 piercing damage per caster level (to a maximum of 20d6 at level 20) every 3 seconds. Fortitude save halves.
While in Hive Form gain: Nearby enemies take 1d6 acid damage per caster level (to a maximum of 20d6 at level 20) every 3 seconds. Fortitude save halves.

No metamagics on them and be the same range as Body of the Sun. Would give some extra touch of solidifying the identity of your shape, A t5 that altered based on your form, and play into the death and decay spreading druid fantasy.


So far, I really like this tree at lot and the playstyle. It's definitely different but familiar. With some tweaks it could cross the line into great. Just my first play through thoughts

Further Edit: Splinter Bolt and thorn Strike are both doing pierce damage according to combat log, but mephits take reduced damage from Splinterbolt but not from Thorn Strike.

[Zeklijan]

5) Death Eater is EXTREMELY powerful. I know Torc, you stated that it's one of the signature abilities of the tree. That it is. It is basically a permanent 5x wisdom temp HP shield that full refreshes on kill no matter how low your temps get. Even If you have a paltry 50 wisdom and 5 stacks (250 temp HP shield) and you are down to 1 temp HP remaining and get a kill, it resets to 250. It's not uncommon to be running around late game with 400+ permanent temp HP. I would suggest bringing this down to maybe 3 stacks max, or make it when you get a kill, you gain 1 stack worth of temp HP back not a full refresh to 5.

You're making it sound better than it is. Druids can get thousands of temp HP at cap, with 100 wisdom death eater is 500. It's good but it's nothing game breaking. Perfectly fine for endgame. It will be amazing in the heroic range, but Torc already acknowledged that this is intentional because it's a signature ability of the tree.

Reminder, in endgame:
Shard storm 25% of total HP in temp HP.
Legendary Affirmation 1000 temp
Blood Feast 1200 temp
Winter's heart 8x wisdom temp
With a decent HP pool we're talking 3k-4k temp

Adding 500 isn't gonna be a huge deal at cap. Especially since you will lose blood Feast unless you are shifter, because Blight druid doesn't get rage of the beast.

The ability is fine as it is.

[cru121]

Blight caster druids gain access to the level 7 Elemental Body spell, but they are not eligible targets.

[Xezom]

You're making it sound better than it is. Druids can get thousands of temp HP at cap, with 100 wisdom death eater is 500. It's good but it's nothing game breaking. Perfectly fine for endgame.

Reminder:
Shard storm 25% HP in temp HP.
Legendary Affirmation 1000 temp
Blood Feast 1200 temp
Winter's heart 8x wisdom temp
With a decent HP pool we're talking 3k-4k temp

Adding 500 isn't gonna be a huge deal at cap. Especially since you will lose blood Feast unless you are shifter because Blight druid doesn't get rage of the beast. The ability is fine as it is

It will be amazing in the heroic range, though.

It's pretty dang good. Even at cap. Did a reincarnation on my capped druid to see what you can get up to temp HP wise. Legendary Elite you can make it so that you never take actual HP damage with all the stacking temp HP you can get. I run a shifter Druid, which for a blight caster is pretty dang good since you're not having to worry about the added caster levels from Draconic since they dont apply unless running acid. The thing that makes it ridiculous is it's permanent uptime, no cost and refreshing mechanics. Most of the temp sources you listed are "temporary" temporary hit points. 400-500 permanent full refreshing temp HP is strong no matter how you slice it. Not to mention that Blight Casters will undoubtedly be going Shard Storm in ED.

I definitely get that this is there sustain in lieu of direct healing spells and is it a never die mechanic with no effort? Hardly. You still have to score kills for the refresh.
Is it something that needs to have an eye kept on it? Absolutely. It's a very powerful ability. Especially for one that you receive at level 6.

[Xgya]

I'll say I'm a bit iffy on the T5 SLA.

It took YEARS of asking for Black Tentacles to become a spell other classes could use, the day it becomes available, it's available to Druids, that also get it as an SLA to boot.

If this patch didn't also come with a buff to basic Warlocks, it'd feel outright distasteful.

I'm not UNhappy it happened, I just think it feels off. Tentacles was deemed too strong to hand as a T5 in Feydark, and now it's a T5 for Druids.

[arkonas]

I was wondering could it be possible to add minor elemental forms to druid itself at 4? like 25% of what they get at 13? i think it kinda sucks to wait 13 levels to finally be water/fire elemental. just my thought.

[Xezom]

I'll say I'm a bit iffy on the T5 SLA.

It took YEARS of asking for Black Tentacles to become a spell other classes could use, the day it becomes available, it's available to Druids, that also get it as an SLA to boot.

If this patch didn't also come with a buff to basic Warlocks, it'd feel outright distasteful.

I'm not UNhappy it happened, I just think it feels off. Tentacles was deemed too strong to hand as a T5 in Feydark, and now it's a T5 for Druids.

Not going to lie, it makes them a better caster of it than Warlocks simply by nature of being an SLA. While you don't get all the crit damage boosts you can get from TS, you can stack a good chunk of crit chance between the two caster druid trees, AND you get free metas on it. It definitely feels like a t5 when you get it. Only, slight, saving grace is that it's pierce damage not bludgeon so it's resisted by more things, but when you take all the extra spell power and crit chance you can get on the druid... it's still better.

Thankfully the notes are wrong too. the notes say 1d6 (Evard's is 1d4). It is indeed 1d4 for the druid version too.

The amount of zone control these Blight Casters have is a bit nutty. Evard's 2, Earthquake, Web, Spike Growth, Acid rain, etc.

[Urklore]

Blight druids in D&D always had vermin as their wild form. I been asking for a bug form for years! Come on, gives us a fire beetle wild form


Also, now that we have a lot of thorn spells being added can we finally get a plant clerical domain? I been asking for this one as well for years. I want to play a plant cleric and be able to turn plant creatures!

[kpak01]

New Tree: Blightcaster
Replaces: Nature's Protector.

Wow, Druid can finally get 2 caster trees instead of 1 caster tree and 2 melee trees.

DRUID FEATURES REMOVED FROM SUBCLASS

• No Wolf Companion
• No Fire or Water Elemental Forms

No Basic Cure Wound Spells or the Heal Spell (you keep Vigor but get them 1 level later, no mass regeneration)
No Elemental Fire/Water Elemental Form Spells

Those are some huge huge hits.

Spells Added to the Druid spell book for Blightcaster

• 1st level - Night Shield, Thorn Strike, Chill Touch, Acid Spray
• 2nd level - Gets Contagion at level 2 instead of 3, Melf's Acid Arrow, Web
• 3rd level - Acid Blast, Thorn Bloom, Stinking Cloud
• 4th level - Fear, Acid Rain, Plant Growth, Wave of Fatigue
• 5th level - Negative Energy Burst, Blighted Breath, Cloud Kill
• 6th level - Negative energy ray, Jaws of Doom, Blighted Bite, Thorn Wave
• 7th Level - Acid Fog, Wave of Exhaustion, Horrid Wilting
• 8th level - Black Dragon Bolt, Thorn Lance
• 9th level - Acid Well, Wail of the Banshee, Rend the Soul, Blighted Charge

Some moderately interesting options, but can't make up for the huge huge hits.

Past Life

Blightcaster:

Past Life: x3 (stacks)

+5 Acid and Poison Spell Power

Meh.

BLIGHT CASTER TREE:

Whole tree is meh. It's no worse than crappy Season's Herald tree, but it's no better, either, and it would have to be a lot better to justify everything we have to give up.

Will continue to play my Druid as a normal Druid and be mostly invested in Feydark, which is a way better caster Druid tree than anything we have or is proposed.

These appear in BOTH base druid and Blightcaster books.

Thorn Strike- Level 1: Conjuration - Cost: 2 Sp, Cooldown 2.0 seconds. Sends a giant thorn toward the target doing 1d6+2 piercing damage per caster level (max 10d6+20 at caster level 10).

Thorn Bloom- Level 3: Conjuration, Cost: 15 SP, Cooldown 3.5. Point Blank AOE - Send a wave of thorns out from your body dealing 1d6+4 piercing damage per caster level (max 10d6+40 at caster level 10). Reflex save for half.

Plant Growth- Level 4: copy of Animal Growth for Plants (which the thorn knight form works with)

Thorn Wave- Level 6: Conjuration, Cost: 25 SP, Cooldown 4.5. Cone - Fires a wave of powerful thorns in a tight arc in front of you dealing 1d6+6 piercing damage per caster level (max 20d6+80 at caster level 20).

Grasping Roots- Level 6: Conjuration, Cost: 30 SP, Cooldown 20 seconds. Duration 10 seconds. Powerful thorny vines rip out of the ground siezing all enemies in the area. Enemies save vs Reflex or become entangled, with a Re-occurring Strength save to break free. Entangled targets also take 1d6 in piercing damage every 2 seconds (max 15d6). All enemy movement through the area is slowed by 30%, no save. Area of effect fire spells will destroy these vines and free any entangled creatures. Incorporeal creatures and oozes are naturally immune. Fire elementals and other fire creatures are immune because they burn through the plants.

Thorn Lance-Level 8: Conjuration, Cost: 20 SP, Cooldown 5.5. Bolt - Fires a single powerful thorn that pierces through targets for 1d6+8 piercing damage per caster level. (Maximum 20d6+160 at caster level 20.)

That's nice, at least.