Remove the following useless Alchemist spells

[Dendrix]

2: Lesser Heartseeker Poison Imbue
2: Lesser Ice Chill Poison Imbue
2: Lesser Soulshatter Poison Imbue
2: Lesser Voidmind Poison Imbue
4: Heartseeker Poison Imbue
4: Ice Chill Poison Imbue
4: Soulshatter Poison Imbue
4: Voidmind Poison Imbue
6: Greater Heartseeker Poison Imbue
6: Greater Ice Chill Poison Imbue
6: Greater Soulshatter Poison Imbue
6: Greater Voidmind Poison Imbue

As far as I am aware there are no circumstances in which these are ever worth casting. There are always better spells to cast. Certainly once you can cast 3rd level spells Elemental Weapon is always more impactful than any these spells.
All they do is fill up the spellbook with extra pointless entries.
I can't even refuse to learn them as I level up

[archest]

dont put them in your tool bar.

[C-Dog]

I could name some Cleric spells that are pretty meh. As mentioned, just ignore them, problem solved.

[Enoach]

Interesting take. I enjoyed my life as an Alchemist Rogue assassin and those spells were great bonuses to me.

[JOTMON]

The worst part about alchemist (in my opinion) is the inability to buff other players with the assortment of alchemical potions available.
Alchemist doesn't brew regular potions they brew toxic 'Witcher' style concoctions that only they can drink and use.


Artificer in party:
Sure, here have some flame arrows and deadly to top up your damage. you get deadly and you get deadly and you get deadly...
DR bypass, Planar, Greater elemental, enchant .. sure here ya go.. buffs for everyone.


Players turn to Alchemist:
>_< what are you looking at me for.. (face pushes away player)

Potion of evolution... nah you can't handle this brew.. have you seen 'Witcher'.. this [expletive] will mess you up, go ask the druid to make you a berry cider.

Sorry I cant let you use any of these potions, every potion is timered like a quick fuse grenade as soon as I fill the bottle it actively volatile has to be thrown or will blow up in your face...
bag of molotov coctails... yeah, sorry these are custom designed with alchemical fingerprint recognition...

Weapon concoction... no sorry you cant dip your arrows in my bottle of poison imbue it only works for me...

[Firebreed]

The worst part about alchemist (in my opinion) is the inability to buff other players with the assortment of alchemical potions available.
Alchemist doesn't brew regular potions they brew toxic 'Witcher' style concoctions that only they can drink and use.


Artificer in party:
Sure, here have some flame arrows and deadly to top up your damage. you get deadly and you get deadly and you get deadly...
DR bypass, Planar, Greater elemental, enchant .. sure here ya go.. buffs for everyone.


Players turn to Alchemist:
>_< what are you looking at me for.. (face pushes away player)

Potion of evolution... nah you can't handle this brew.. have you seen 'Witcher'.. this [expletive] will mess you up, go ask the druid to make you a berry cider.

Sorry I cant let you use any of these potions, every potion is timered like a quick fuse grenade as soon as I fill the bottle it actively volatile has to be thrown or will blow up in your face...
bag of molotov coctails... yeah, sorry these are custom designed with alchemical fingerprint recognition...

Weapon concoction... no sorry you cant dip your arrows in my bottle of poison imbue it only works for me...

Great post.

[SilentRunning]

I have to agree with JOTMON on this one, some of the potions would do really good for group play. I mean it does say in the description on the wiki: Party member buffs, with powerful short-term effects.

Very short term if you ask me, I mean you'd have to be watching your alchemist to see when they switch modes to make use of those absurdly short buffs.

The poison imbues come in real handy imo. I tend to use Vile Chemist a lot on melee, crossbow, or thrown weapons.

[Dendrix]

Interesting take. I enjoyed my life as an Alchemist Rogue assassin and those spells were great bonuses to me.

Serious question. When and what were the circumstances that those potions were useful?
Were they really better than elemental weapon/greater elemental weapon?

[Enoach]

Serious question. When and what were the circumstances that those potions were useful?
Were they really better than elemental weapon/greater elemental weapon?

Elemental weapons are good. but there are many occasions where mobs are immune. However, it is the neg save and stat damage that was valuable. This damage helped me incapacitate mobs making assassinate easier to land, making them less dangerous to me, or weakening them to help party members. The main point was playing a melee alchemist.

I agree with JOTMAN that the lack of party buffs is really the drawback of alchemist.

[droid327]

The worst part about alchemist (in my opinion) is the inability to buff other players with the assortment of alchemical potions available.

The reason you arent allowed to buff party mates is because you want to

In other words, the whole reason Alch buffs are allowed to be so powerful (and thus you wish you could hit your teammates with them) is because they're self-only. If they werent, then Alch becomes a HUUUUUUGE force multiplier, and basically required for any high-performance party. The devs have always steadfastly steered away from designs that strongly promote a "perfect party" or might lead to people being rejected because "we need an alch"

Now you can definitely make a pitch for some certain Alch buffs to be party-compatible, but not just the whole spellbook en masse

[Melkazar]

OP has obviously not played a poison slinging alchemist.

And as for not avoiding then, the alchemist get to learn a couple of spells each level. I have avoided those just fine.

[JOTMON]

OP has obviously not played a poison slinging alchemist.

And as for not avoiding then, the alchemist get to learn a couple of spells each level. I have avoided those just fine.

?
How is it obvious the OP hasn't played a poison slinger
and how did you get to this being your response to the OP thread about what he feels are useless imbues which are applied to weapons and ranged damage not poison slinging pots.

I would infer from the OP post that he is a pot slinger as has finds no value to the weapon self only buff imbues.


From my perspective more spell options are better than no spell options even if they relatively suck for the build I am looking to play.
You only need to select from the inscribed list of available spells the useful ones.
I hit up the scroll vendors and inscribe every spell on the list, this way the only spells to select on level ups are ones i could not inscribe.

I hate that I have to inscribe them all individually each TR life instead of being able to purchase a whole spell book that encompasses all the spells the vendor has and only individually inscribe the ones not available from the NPC vendor.

[LuckyCuss]

2: Lesser Heartseeker Poison Imbue
2: Lesser Ice Chill Poison Imbue
2: Lesser Soulshatter Poison Imbue
2: Lesser Voidmind Poison Imbue
4: Heartseeker Poison Imbue
4: Ice Chill Poison Imbue
4: Soulshatter Poison Imbue
4: Voidmind Poison Imbue
6: Greater Heartseeker Poison Imbue
6: Greater Ice Chill Poison Imbue
6: Greater Soulshatter Poison Imbue
6: Greater Voidmind Poison Imbue

As far as I am aware there are no circumstances in which these are ever worth casting. There are always better spells to cast. Certainly once you can cast 3rd level spells Elemental Weapon is always more impactful than any these spells.
All they do is fill up the spellbook with extra pointless entries.
I can't even refuse to learn them as I level up

I agree these spell are just filler but if we start down this path there are a bunch of spells in other classes that are a waste of code as well.

[shores11]

2: Lesser Heartseeker Poison Imbue
2: Lesser Ice Chill Poison Imbue
2: Lesser Soulshatter Poison Imbue
2: Lesser Voidmind Poison Imbue
4: Heartseeker Poison Imbue
4: Ice Chill Poison Imbue
4: Soulshatter Poison Imbue
4: Voidmind Poison Imbue
6: Greater Heartseeker Poison Imbue
6: Greater Ice Chill Poison Imbue
6: Greater Soulshatter Poison Imbue
6: Greater Voidmind Poison Imbue

As far as I am aware there are no circumstances in which these are ever worth casting. There are always better spells to cast. Certainly once you can cast 3rd level spells Elemental Weapon is always more impactful than any these spells.
All they do is fill up the spellbook with extra pointless entries.
I can't even refuse to learn them as I level up

Just NO!

[Tyrande]

The worst part about alchemist (in my opinion) is the inability to buff other players with the assortment of alchemical potions available.

Yeah, I wonder why alchemists can only brew for themselves, and not give the brewed potion to party members?!? Where is the logic in that? Here, try this mystery potion... **boom** hasted and sprinted...

Alchemist doesn't brew regular potions they brew toxic 'Witcher' style concoctions that only they can drink and use.

I see... playing too many Witcher III, eh? None of the alchemist brewed potions for buffs are "toxic" in anyway AFAIK.

Artificer in party:
Sure, here have some flame arrows and deadly to top up your damage. you get deadly and you get deadly and you get deadly...
DR bypass, Planar, Greater elemental, enchant .. sure here ya go.. buffs for everyone.

And yet, artificer cannot buff my warlock eldritch blast damage. Casting deadly on warlocks does nothing.
The DR bypass also does not help striping elemental immunity. i.e. fire elementals will always be immune to fiendish warlocks unless there is also a fire sorc or fire druid in the party.

Players turn to Alchemist:
>_< what are you looking at me for.. (face pushes away player)[...]

Yeah, unfortunately. That lever in Tempest Spine that requires 75 strength on Reaper 10. Sorry, the super duper Greater Evolution - Bull spell only works for the alchemist (self) only... sorry Conan the barbarian; you should have enough strength for this lever...

Potion of evolution... nah you can't handle this brew.. have you seen 'Witcher'.. this [expletive] will mess you up, go ask the druid to make you a berry cider.[...]

[Tyrande]

2: Lesser Heartseeker Poison Imbue
2: Lesser Ice Chill Poison Imbue
2: Lesser Soulshatter Poison Imbue
2: Lesser Voidmind Poison Imbue
4: Heartseeker Poison Imbue
4: Ice Chill Poison Imbue
4: Soulshatter Poison Imbue
4: Voidmind Poison Imbue
6: Greater Heartseeker Poison Imbue
6: Greater Ice Chill Poison Imbue
6: Greater Soulshatter Poison Imbue
6: Greater Voidmind Poison Imbue

[...]

These are filler spells... for the level. Just like mage spells: Bull's Strength (and mass version), Cat's Grace (and mass version), Bear's Endurance (and mass version), Fox's Cunning (and mass version), Owl's Wisdom (and mass version), Eagle's Splendor (and mass version)... etc. are filler spells.

If they had use some of the Pathfinder 3.5e alchemist spells..., they would be more useful...

[LightBear]

Serious question. When and what were the circumstances that those potions were useful?
Were they really better than elemental weapon/greater elemental weapon?

Leveling up on a multi class that likes to splash poison.
Think it can go well with Warlocks, Bards, Rogues.
...
Well just about any specialist build really.

Are there better options, sure.
But that should not restrict anyone on having fun.

Oh, and it's not that there is always an arti in the party.

That said, try using them in reaper. Last I recall they're totally void in there.

[JOTMON]

Oh, and it's not that there is always an arti in the party.

Arti in the party is a perk, UMD and a stack of deadly scrolls covers weapon buffs when needed.

Alchemist scrolls... toilet paper at best... can't utilize UMD for alchemist scrolls they are only usable for inscribing by alchemists.