Cleric Version of Warpriest: Turns vs spellpoints to power Divine Might

[Silverleafeon]

IYour comment that a recent update changed undead CR is interesting...do you happen to know when that was? I did a lot of experiments on turning a couple months after MotU launched and I haven't been actively working on it since. I've been trying to farm up a Radiant ToD set and been unlucky. I was going to go back to it after I got the ring on any of my toons. I did try a run last night through the EE King's Forest PDK favor farming and nothing in the graveyard quest either crouched or exploded. I could have just been very very unlucky, but I didn't see anything to indicate it was behaving any differently than in the past.

Recent, seems like about a month or so ago, and it was definitely lowering significantly.

https://www.ddo.com/en/update-18-release-notes

Monsters
• Many undead creatures, particularly in older content, now have smaller Hit Dice values that match their CR. The main effect of this will be to make the Turn Undead ability more effective against them.

[FranOhmsford]

Turning is situation-ally useful at low levels, but not all quests need to burn the turns. If a Warpriest could spend their turns on their Divine Might, they could decide...do I want to use Divine Might or do I want to turn? It's not as if spending spellpoints is optional in the same way as deciding if you wanted to turn undead is for a cleric. Divine Might is a first tier enhancement, so it should have been priced in such a way that low level clerics can afford to cast it. Are there any other First tier powers that cost 21 spell points to use? By having to spend spellpoints low level clerics are going to have trouble affording the cost to use the power.

I don't think the devs have an interest in hurting clerics, but I do think they can be bad at their jobs. Warpriest is a badly designed tree. They made changes already and some of those are for the better. But it still poorly constructed and it still lacks synergy. Charging cleric Warpriests spellpoints instead of turns to use Divine Might is one poor design choice among several in the tree.

For years now I've been Playing Clerics with a Minimum of 14 Base Charisma {I have one who's FULLY Charisma Specced!}.

During this time I've been told time and time again that I'm gimping my Clerics and that Radiant Burst is oh so much better than TU - Not in my opinion it isn't!

Radiant Burst does nowhere near enough Dmg to Elite Undead at Level in Heroic Quests - It can take 3 of them {sometimes more} to kill a Bunch of Undead that TU wipes out in One Shot!


Divine Vitality is a Fantastic Enhancement BUT I only took it as an AP Use once I realised that it would rarely get used in group play and obviously I can't use it on myself....On the Other Hand every one of my Blue Bar Characters takes a DV Cleric Hire wherever they go!


Divine Might is Yet another way to Burn turns as was Divine Light, Divine Healing and Divine Cleansing {all of which were completely worthless Pre-Enhancement Pass!}.

Divine Light is Now a Superb Enhancement that actually Boosts my Turns so that for those Undead that Don't get Wiped out in the first shot take Dmg anyway.

Divine Healing and Divine Cleansing still appear to be a waste of space at first glance.


I for one am fed up to the back teeth of TU being Under-Represented in DDO {Frankly it does have it's issues BUT if you spec for it and at the very least spend a 2nd Lvl Spell Slot on Seek Eternal Rest and a Gear Slot on a Sacred item it works pretty d@rned well!}.

I'm annoyed that many Giant Skeletons at High Lvls have an Insane version of Deathward that makes them Immune to Turns.

I like that Divine Might Now uses Spell Points cos I'll actually now get to use Divine Might in all those quests that are absolutely FULL of Undead!


Could TU be made better - It's certainly nowhere near the Power Level it was in PnP 2nd Ed. {I don't play 3rd Ed +} BUT it had it's disadvantages in PnP too {Ones it DOESN'T have in DDO.}.

For Example: In 2nd Ed. You got ONE chance to Turn a Group of Undead - Any you didn't Turn were Immune to Further attempts!
In DDO you can make multiple attempts - Btw there does RECENTLY seem to be a small cooldown after a Failed attempt {wait 5 seconds before making another or it's wasted.}.



What the Devs have done is actually give MORE Variety to Clerics - I am absolutely against going back to the way things were thank you very much!

[guardianx2009]

What I've learned playing her is that Divine Might is just too expensive. A lowbie cleric can't afford the casting cost in Protection, and it's not going to be any better once Warpriest goes live.

I'm not so sure it's worth the effort, but I suppose they could make it a toggle sub option (similar to choosing light/dark paths in Divine Disciple), where you can pick the Turn based or SP based version when selecting DM.

Either case, yes at high levels it is in fact, preferable to use SP over turns. Lowbie levels are so easy nowadays, everyone just power level through them in no time.

Regarding TU, if you can't turn a lick, then it is definitely a problem on your end.

[eachna_gislin]

I'm not so sure it's worth the effort, but I suppose they could make it a toggle sub option (similar to choosing light/dark paths in Divine Disciple), where you can pick the Turn based or SP based version when selecting DM.

Either case, yes at high levels it is in fact, preferable to use SP over turns. Lowbie levels are so easy nowadays, everyone just power level through them in no time.

Regarding TU, if you can't turn a lick, then it is definitely a problem on your end.

I was away for a bit and came back to see Warpriest has appeared. Way to go Devs...screw over everyone to please the power gamers. The idea that anyone thinks a level 1 power should be costed based entirely on how end game epic players will use it is astounding.

Less astounding was seeing that the Devs ignored 99% of the feedback given. Capstone +2 stat was changed and now Ameliorating Strike heals on every smite. Otherwise looks the same to me, which is just sad. The tree is still messy and still lacking any cohesion or synergy.

[RedHost]

Warpriests (defined as those who take tier 5 powers) still have nothing else on which to spend their turns.

Most War Priests would be very unhappy if they had Divine Might competing with Positive Energy Burst for Turn charges. I see the point that you are trying to make, but it seems like a much better system to have Divine Might based on spell points than on Turn charges.

[Karavek]

OP

you want divine might with turns.
you want to splash 2 pally.

there is a very simple solution to your problem that requires no dev time.

I know right. I was thinking Im fairly sure the exact same thing you are, if they want turn fueled DM and splash in lvls of pally why not just invest AP in the pallies tree for their form of it.

**** Charo this is one of several posts of yours late that used simple solid logic. We may not always agree on the need to carry on the old school spirit of D&D but at least you clearly have the talent real players do to instantly see how to blend classes together.