So I just learned what Epic Drow SR is.....

[Desdemonte]

SR=45

Are you freaking kidding me?

I saw a thread a while back from someone asking if people are now expected to TR their characters multiple times to have any relevance at end game (once the expansion hits). I saw a lot of people offer sage advice such as not being a one trick pony, learn how to play your class, find alternatives to FoD/Wail/Dancing Ball like a heightened Web....

I find this all laughable.

I spent plenty of time on my 4th life (3 of them wiz) Wizard in the new preview quests seeing nothing but blue shields on drow archers and drow casters waltzing right through my webs.

This toon is *almost* fully geared out, with everything I would need *and more* as a 1st life caster. My Spell Pen is 32. Necro/Enchant DCs at 42.

SR of 45????? The only way a guildy and myself have determined to come close to not burning through the blue bars is to do a 3x Fvs, 3x Wiz ending on an Elf Wiz.

So people aren't expected to have to multi TR their toons to be relevant? I call BS!

This got me wondering- what do the various creatures have for SR through the game, and at Epic. Anybody have a link? What DCs are necessary for different mobs in Epic? Where are we headed?

As far as I can tell, we are headed toward being forced to chug SP pots purchased from the DDO store, on multi-TRd toons that have chugged XP pots from the DDO store, using stat buff pots purchased through the DDO store.

Seeing a trend here?

[Vordax]

SR=45

Drow are pretty much the worst when it comes to SR, their SR is level + 11. Most epic drow are around CR 35, which translate to level 34 so an SR of 45. Most of the rest of the epic/end game mobs I have ran into have an SR quite a bit lower.

Vordax

[Varashad]

The Drow really could use an SR nerf. Forty would still be hard to beat, but it would give you at least some chance of CCing them. The only way I've found to deal with Drow is to hage and displace your melees, and hope for the best.

[Chai]

I disagree with the OP of this thread as I did with the OP of the last thread. You have to use DIFFERENT SPELLS. What spells do you use in house D epics? Same ones youll use in the new epics.

I have three viewpoints on this.

1. It is the one trick ponies who get huge DCs in one school of magic who use the same 2 or 3 spells who will have the hardest time. Those people who concentrated on getting DCs in other schools which have spells that do not check SR will find they can adapt well enough.

2. Congrats. When you play your caster you now have the wonderful opportunity to feel like a melee feels when playing with you in 95% of the other epic content to date. Its about **** time they put something in the game that evens the odds. Melee will actually be valuable now.

3. Theres alot more in the underdark than just drow. Most of it doesnt have an SR of over 9000.

**Your neg rep for this post is hilarious. It shows exactly why the system doesnt work. Might as well be a like/dislike button ~facebook instead.

[Chai]

The Drow really could use an SR nerf. Forty would still be hard to beat, but it would give you at least some chance of CCing them. The only way I've found to deal with Drow is to hage and displace your melees, and hope for the best.

If you be really nice to your melee, maybe they will toss a shattermantle weapon into their offhand.

[Impaqt]

SR=45

Are you freaking kidding me?

I saw a thread a while back from someone asking if people are now expected to TR their characters multiple times to have any relevance at end game (once the expansion hits). I saw a lot of people offer sage advice such as not being a one trick pony, learn how to play your class, find alternatives to FoD/Wail/Dancing Ball like a heightened Web....

I find this all laughable.

I spent plenty of time on my 4th life (3 of them wiz) Wizard in the new preview quests seeing nothing but blue shields on drow archers and drow casters waltzing right through my webs.

This toon is *almost* fully geared out, with everything I would need *and more* as a 1st life caster. My Spell Pen is 32. Necro/Enchant DCs at 42.

SR of 45????? The only way a guildy and myself have determined to come close to not burning through the blue bars is to do a 3x Fvs, 3x Wiz ending on an Elf Wiz.

So people aren't expected to have to multi TR their toons to be relevant? I call BS!

This got me wondering- what do the various creatures have for SR through the game, and at Epic. Anybody have a link? What DCs are necessary for different mobs in Epic? Where are we headed?

As far as I can tell, we are headed toward being forced to chug SP pots purchased from the DDO store, on multi-TRd toons that have chugged XP pots from the DDO store, using stat buff pots purchased through the DDO store.

Seeing a trend here?

we have more levels coming (more Spell Penn), and a revamp of the enhancment system. who knows what else we'll see that may aid our spell penn efforts.

or you could always bring a few melees with ya into epic quests....

[Jaid314]

or you could take the advice that people gave, and use the tools that already work. there is a reason people pointed out various things that *will* hit epic drow, and gave the advice of using those things instead of telling the person they should just have a temper tantrum and see if that fixed their problem.

there are spells available that work just fine. you can throw a fit because you want to use different ones, but you may as well complain that a hammer isn't very good for cutting a piece of wood when you have a perfectly good saw sitting right next to you.

[Havok.cry]

If web isnt working, I reccomend glitterdust and incindiary cloud, one hits reflex the other will, generally low saves, for blindness. Neither are effected by spell resistance. I have fought many a battle from inside them. Also on your first life you can pump your conj DCs higher. Echrono items, robe gives +3, abishai set another stacking +3 iirc. Also make sure your metas are active on web... Ive had mine turn off mysteriously before. Also be ware that fire burns webs, so try to catch fire casting mobs first.

[Therrias]

How I kill epic Drow:

Step 1: Wall of Fire
Step 2: Acid Rain
Step 3: ...
Step 4: Profit!

[Syllph]

So ignore their Spell Pen and use spells that don't have SR checks.

Prismatic Spray will whip right through it and has a good chance to insta-kill.

Greater Shout will Stun them (no SR check) and then melees can go to town. Simply recast again as needed. Electric loop works well too also no SR check

As for web I have no clue, they were not affected by SR last update so unless they broke web it's not a SR check it's your low DCs. I use Web constantly on Drow and have never seen a SR check.

You don't have to TR a bunch just use different spells. Besides they are epic after all, a wizard has 45 spells to play with that they can change anytime they wish.

[BruceTheHoon]

My friends use web.
I use shattermantle.
We're good friends.

[Desdemonte]

we have more levels coming (more Spell Penn), and a revamp of the enhancment system. who knows what else we'll see that may aid our spell penn efforts.

or you could always bring a few melees with ya into epic quests....

But but but...

Melees are so 1980s ;P

Seriously though, I am all open ears to suggestions that *work*. The glitterdust and incendiary cloud is an interesting combo. I am really curious as to what people are using on their 1st life caster to dominate sufficently that a wipe doesn't occur. You can tell me to rely on my melee all you want, but the fact of the matter is that they *cannot* kill things fast enough, and need a good dent made by instakills, and taking other mobs out of commision by dancing/webbing them.

Pumping up 1 school to offset Drow SR means hurting yourself elsewhere, to a degree I doubt many people would want to do. I don't see this as a viable option. I forgot to mention the 3 cleric lives... that *was* a part of the build we came up with to bump the Web DCs.

Chai, I don't see how you can call Palemasters and WF Archmages 1 trick ponies. When you get to level 20, you can only choose 1 or 2 lines to specialize in. What would you drop to add a 3rd or 4th line? Quicken and not be able to self heal fast enough? Heighten so stuff doesn't land anyway? What feat selection do you propose? Why add a SF feat if you can't follow it up with a Greater SF? All I see is the fact that being a generalist cripples your ability to do *anything* very well at that level.

For me, the SR is a moot point (but I know it's still ****ing a lot of other people off)- I have left my wizard lives behind and am onto cleric. I was going to do 3 FvS as well before finishing up as Sorc, so I would (hopefully) be able to land necro and CC in the new expansion as a sorc. I guess this revelation at least saves me some time- no need to waste the time on the FvS lives, as I'm sure that although there will be other creatures in the Underdark, I'm guessing they will a pittance compared to the number of drow. Not sure how I'm going to approach it other than nuke the **** out of stuff and hope I kill it before it kills me. I'm not going to be able to swap spells around all the time (like Incediary cloud and glitterdust).

I gotta find that other post. Personally, I don't buy it. I would *love* to run with you awesome casters who have a way to solve everything and learn from you first hand....

[MattiG]

With 3 wizzy pl's wouldn't you have
20 - levels
4 - feats
6 - passive PL x3
2-3 - enhancements
3 - item

For a total 35-36 pen?

Add arcane augmentation for another 2. I'm sure you know all this...

Or did you not max out spell pen?

[Impaqt]

But but but...

Melees are so 1980s ;P

Seriously though, I am all open ears to suggestions that *work*. The glitterdust and incendiary cloud is an interesting combo. I am really curious as to what people are using on their 1st life caster to dominate sufficently that a wipe doesn't occur. You can tell me to rely on my melee all you want, but the fact of the matter is that they *cannot* kill things fast enough, and need a good dent made by instakills, and taking other mobs out of commision by dancing/webbing them.

Pumping up 1 school to offset Drow SR means hurting yourself elsewhere, to a degree I doubt many people would want to do. I don't see this as a viable option. I forgot to mention the 3 cleric lives... that *was* a part of the build we came up with to bump the Web DCs.

Chai, I don't see how you can call Palemasters and WF Archmages 1 trick ponies. When you get to level 20, you can only choose 1 or 2 lines to specialize in. What would you drop to add a 3rd or 4th line? Quicken and not be able to self heal fast enough? Heighten so stuff doesn't land anyway? What feat selection do you propose? Why add a SF feat if you can't follow it up with a Greater SF? All I see is the fact that being a generalist cripples your ability to do *anything* very well at that level.

For me, the SR is a moot point (but I know it's still ****ing a lot of other people off)- I have left my wizard lives behind and am onto cleric. I was going to do 3 FvS as well before finishing up as Sorc, so I would (hopefully) be able to land necro and CC in the new expansion as a sorc. I guess this revelation at least saves me some time- no need to waste the time on the FvS lives, as I'm sure that although there will be other creatures in the Underdark, I'm guessing they will a pittance compared to the number of drow. Not sure how I'm going to approach it other than nuke the **** out of stuff and hope I kill it before it kills me. I'm not going to be able to swap spells around all the time (like Incediary cloud and glitterdust).

I gotta find that other post. Personally, I don't buy it. I would *love* to run with you awesome casters who have a way to solve everything and learn from you first hand....

I generally dont find melees being all that slow in killing Epic drow. I run quite a bit of Sentinel stuff where we see a few drow here and there. Drop a few webs, let the melees kill. Bribe one to use some Shattermantle weapons.....

Epic Ward stopped ALL instakills for quite some time... you made due with other forms of CC and Direct damage.

[Syllph]

I spent plenty of time on my 4th life (3 of them wiz) Wizard in the new preview quests seeing nothing but blue shields on drow archers and drow casters waltzing right through my webs.

Still trying to figure this one out though, why were you seeing SR on your webs?

[jortann]

With 3 wizzy pl's wouldn't you have
20 - levels
4 - feats
6 - passive PL x3
2-3 - enhancements
3 - item

For a total 35-36 pen?

Add arcane augmentation for another 2. I'm sure you know all this...

Or did you not max out spell pen?

So with a 36 does that mean you would break their spell pen with a roll of 10 or more? 55% of the time?

[voodoogroves]

I like it, honestly, and this comes from someone who plays primarily caster types.

I also want golems to return to being nigh-immune to magic though.

These sorts of things absolutely bring balance to the game. No, you aren't expected to TR multiple times just to be relevant. You're expected to do the best you can with the tools you have and recognize that just like the people trying to catch you when you're running and wailing like a banshee, there may be a part where the best solution isn't just to keep wailing.

[MattiG]

So with a 36 does that mean you would break their spell pen with a roll of 10 or more? 55% of the time?

It aint pretty, I know...

But with if you got a friendly well geared monk with 1 ranger lvl to sprint boost your stone until lvl 13 while your sorc buddy mopped up whatever else, you're just 3 quick tr's and a few weeks of eLOBs (or already built SoAP) away from an 80% success rate with spell pen!

worth it, no?

[jortann]

It aint pretty, I know...

But with if you got a friendly well geared monk with 1 ranger lvl to sprint boost your stone until lvl 13 while your sorc buddy mopped up whatever else, you're just 3 quick tr's and a few weeks of eLOBs (or already built SoAP) away from an 80% success rate with spell pen!

worth it, no?

I'm working on the 3rd Wizard life right now. Plus, I am expecting that there may be an Epic feat called Superior Spell Penetration for an extra +2....

We will see what happens. No reason to scream DoooOOOOoooooOOOoOooOoOoOooOOooooomm! before it even happens.

[hcarr]

You are crying about something that already has been solved before for most people when dealing with high drow sr.

1. take a bard with fascinate
2. take someone that can stun like a maniac.

no sr problems or crowd control issues if everyone can work together.

No you wont be able to go through the quest solo killing everything as you skip along. You will just have to spend some time with the unkept masses that bitterly cling to there weapons and armor.