Master Assassin: an int based build

[Mellkor]

Posting this build upon request.

U23: Updated for U23. Biggest changes are Lots of Gear! And. The Harper Enhancement Tree, which brings INT modifier score to hit and to damage with all weapons!!!! I haven't actually TR'd into Human yet, so the numbers below may be off a little here and there and feat progression may be off. Let me know if you spot any errors.

U19: Updated for U19. Biggest change was race. Drow is best race for this build IMO, but human is a close second.

Updated for U17: Biggest change is gear! Entirely new gear set for lev 25 over lev 20 gear. I added a level 25 gear section to this post, I left the level 20 gear list as it was. Some chages to twists also.

U16's biggest change is more emphasis on defense. U16 Epic Elite quests are brutal if you neglect defense. I now have 25% dodge + 25% incoporeal + 20/50% concealment running on this guy all the time. You dont get hit much with all of these being separate checks for each incoming blow.

I have tried str based and dex based rogues pures and spalshed, but by far I like this one the best.

This guy requires a lot of hard to grind gear, but it is worth it!

My concept for this build started out a while back (when lev 16 was cap) as an INT based assassin. When I started this build most folks laughed and said no way it would work. LOL. My concept was to max out assassinate DC, with 500+ HP's, be able to hit most mobs on a 2, all while still being able to do all the trap stuff expected of a rogue, without fail. This build does between 80-90% of the dps that a geared STR based build does. That said, I gotta wonder why folks go STR based!!!!

Game play on this guy involves doing most of my DPS via sneak and assassinate. I concentrate on assassinating full health bar mobs, and then joining the main fight on an already engaged mob until my cool down for assassinate is reset, I then go into sneak and hunt down the next mob with a full health bar, rinse, repeat. I usually give priority to mobs in the periphery such as archers and casters for my assassinates. I also try to get lined up so I can hit two or three mobs at once. You can often assassinate 2 at once and rarely 3 if you get lucky with double strike, but the mobs have to be close together. For solo play I use Shadow Manipulation a lot and/or summon monster scrolls to get mobs attention, then stick 'em. I tend to use Bluff and Diplo a lot. All this while being able to do any trap and open any lock on any difficulty, without fail. I have a lot of fun with this guy!

Damage comes primarily from Assassinate and Sneak Attack Damage which on this guy is 29d6 + 12. As far as damage goes, it ALMOST does not matter what weapon you use, since sneak damage is so dominate. You can almost do as much damage with a spoon, LOL.




Anyway, Benchmarks for this build: at Lev 28: (assumptions: ship buffs, GH, haste, as equipped or using equipment described below, 3 rogue past lives, +6 tomes to all).

I do not include other (some easy to get) buffs in these numbers as I consider most of them either too hard to get (abashai cookies, house D pots, bard buffs, etc), too much of a pain in the ass to sustain (rage pots, scrolls of whatever buff, and other short duration buff pots and clickys), or too expensive (store pots, yugo pots, etc). Do keep in mind tho, that the below posted numbers can be even better. The only one of these I often use these days are the store pots, they last 10 mins and allow some flexibility in some aspects of this build, such as making up for lack of a +6 tome, or if you prefer a different destiny set up than what is described below.


Race Human. (36 pt build)

Stats:

Start:

STR 8
DEX 15
CON 16
INT 18
WIS 10
CHA 8

End Game:

STR 27: (8 base, 6 tome, 8 item, 1 exc, 2 profane, 2 ship).
DEX 39: (15 base, 6 tome, 11 item, 2 insight, 1 exc, 2 profane, 2 ship).
CON 41: (16 base, 6 tome, 11 item, 2 insight, 1 exc, 2 profane, 2 ship).
INT 62: (18 base, 6 tome, 7 levels, 1 human, 2 capstone, 2 assassin, 4 harper, 11 item, 3 insight, 1 exc, 2 profane, 2ship, 3 epic destiny).
WIS 30: (9 base, 6 tome, 8 item, 2 insight, 1 exc, 2 profane, 2 ship).
CHA 30: (9 base, 6 tome, 8 item, 2 insight, 1 exc, 2 profane, 2 ship)


Standing Assassinate DC:

26 INT bonus (62 INT)
20 rogue levels
10 base
6 stealthy from shadowdancer destiny
5 measure the foe enhancement from assassin tree
4 Item
------------------------------------------------------------
71 Self buffed standing Assassinate DC

1 bard Song
1 yugo pot
1 store pot
------------------------------------------------------------
74 DC from common and/or not too much a pain to maintain buffs.

5 from +10 more int from maximizing INT in destinies (+3 more), twists (+4 more), and epic feats (+3 more)
------------------------------------------------------------------
79 Assassinate DC


Higher than 74 and you really begin to move into PIA-to-maintain-that-DC territory. Requiring (IMO) major sacrifices in destines and feat selection, relying on others for buffs, as well as maintaining short duration buffs that are difficult to obtain, such as abashai cookies or house D pots, etc.

71 is what I consider the best practical DC as all you need to rely on is yourself (and your ship), not make major sacrifices to attain, and not have to worry about refreshing pots or other short duration buffs. I sometimes use store and yugo pots for a 73 DC, but the cost and/or detriments are not worth it or needed most of the time.

80+ DC is possible, but, again, is not practical as it requires hard to acquire or very short duration buffs such as abashi cookies or house D pots, etc. 74 is about the best practical DC one can easily maintain, IMO as of U23. Going all out to 80+ DC really gimps you in other areas that matter in destinies, twists, feats, and enhancements.

~ 910 HP (often ends up to be over 1000 with commonly used party buffs)

Armour Class: 78

Saves:

Fort: 52
Reflex 79 (high 80's vs traps)
Will 52 (useful, even in EE content with Slippery Mind)

Reflex save is very high without really trying so you could drop insightful reflexes and settle for a low 60's reflex save and get some other feat of your choice. But having that high reflex save sure is nice in end game EE content (almost required, I'd say).


Skills:

Max ranks in Balance, Bluff, Concentration, Diplomacy, Disable Device, Hide, Jump, Listen, Move Silently, Open Lock, Search, Spot, Tumble, UMD, and one other of your choice, I put mine into swim


Trap Skills: (at lev 28 using +20 items, +5 exceptional items and/or gear described below and self buffed only. Other buffs such as bard/yugo/store pots, action boosts, etc, will make these somewhat better.)

Spot 83
Search 101
Disable 111 + 1d20
Open Lock 91 + 1d20

I have not failed any trap or lock with these numbers to date in epic elite quests and raids.

Other Skills (as equipped at lev 28 below)

UMD 55 (good enough to cast level IX scrolls at 100% success rate)
Hide 78
Move Silently 78
Jump 40+
balance 71
swim 71 (LOL) try it, its a hoot. (with a +20 item)
Diplo 76
Haggle 60
Bluff 79
Listen 77

Feats:

1 - toughness
1 human bonus feat - two weapon fighting
3 - precision
6 - insightful reflexes
9 - improved two weapon fighting
12 - improved critical: pierce
15 - greater two weapon fighting
18 - dodge
21 - epic toughness
24 - imp sneak attack
26 - perfect two weapon fighting
27 - watchful eye (I love this ability!!) or overwhelming critical or sneak of shadows
28 - toughness


Rogue special feats:

Improved Evasion
Skill Mastery
Slippery mind (this really helps to shore up this builds greatest weakness, the low will save)
Opportunist

Enhancements:

Human Racial tree: +1 INT and healing amp

Assassin Tree: All 6 core abilities, +1 INT x 3, Assassinate, measure the foe III, Crit accuracy III, crit damage III, killer II, knife specialization, sneak attack training x 4, stealthy III, Envenomed Blades III OR Damage Boost III.

Harper Tree: first 4 core abilities, +1 INT x 4, Strategic Combat II, Highly Skilled III, Versatile Adept x 4.

Thief-Acrobat Tree: first core ability, fast sneaking III.


Destiny:

This part of the build is often changing for me. Many good things here. You could actually go all int in twists and main destiny and hit a 75 or so standing assassinate DC if you like, however, I recommend AT THE VERY LEAST maintaining 71 standing DC + 25% dodge somehow. There are many ways to do this by tweaking this destiny to your liking. It becomes even easier if you get lucky with a +6 int tome. I use shadow manipulation a lot, it is really excellent.

Shadow Dancer.

Stealthy III
Intelligence x3
Lithe I
Shrouding Strike III
Cloak of Shadows I
Shadow Manipulation I
Improved Ivisibility I
Untouchable I
Grim Precision I
Shadow Form I
Sealed Soul I (immunity to level drain, you need this for tyhe new abbot raid, mainly. If not running Abbot raid, put these points into Grim Precision)


Twists:
Sense Weakness (use the following 3 if not an epic completionist)
Brace for Impact
Hail of Blows
Impregnable Mind



Equipment:


I also use a greensteel healing amp stick when self healing (a heal scroll heals me half my total HPs or so).

For ranged weapons you get repeater crossbows profs from first 4 core abilities from mechanic as well as int bonus to damage!!. I went for this as early as possible because a good repeater with int bonus is really powerful at early levels. Greensteel repeaters at lev 12 on up is also very, very good. This is a nice bonus when ranged is required.


ENDGAME gear: (Lev 28 as of U23):


Head- Mythic Muffled Veneer: (Move +20, Hide +20, Spot +20, Double Strike +9%, +2 Exceptional Reflex Save, Assassinate +4, BLUE SLOT: +40 Hit Points, GREEN SLOT: +2 insight CON).

Neck- Shield of Ardent: (+18 PRR, Smoke Screen, Fear Immunity, Healing Amp +30%, YELLOW SLOT: Blind immunity or some skill +15, GREEN SLOT: Resist Lightning 40).

Trinket- Epic Litney of the Dead: (+2 to all stats, GREEN SLOT:STR +8, BLUE SLOT: Good Luck +2). AND/OR Manual of Stealthy Pilfering: (Good Luck +3, Dex Skills +6, Int Skills +6, UMD +5, Open Locks +20, Disabe Devicen +20, GREEN SLOT: STR +8).

Cloak- Adamantine Cloak of the Wolf (+5 exceptional seeker, 8% dodge, attack +4, diversion 20%). This is borderline useful post U23. Good place for greensteel HP/displacement clickie.

Belt- Epic Belt of Thoughtful Remeberence: (CON +11, Resist +11, Dodge +11%, Greater Regenerate, BLUE SLOT: +8 WIS, GREEN SLOT:Resist Acid 40).

Ring 1- Ring of Deceit: (+20 to bluff, diplo, haggle, +8 CHA, improved deception, YELLOW SLOT:vitality +20, COLORLESS SLOT: +2 insight WIS).

Ring 2- Consuming Darkness: (Seeker XII, GREEN SLOT: Resist Fire 40).

Hands- Epic Fanged Gloves: (INT +11, Blurry, some useless stuff, YELLOW SLOT: Globe of Imperial Blood, GREEN SLOT: Resist Cold 40).

Feet- EE Sure Footed Boots: (Mobility Feat (+2 to dodge and dodge cap), Balance +20, GREEN SLOT: protection +8).

Bracers- Epic Ethereal Bracers: DEX +11, Ghostly, Deadly 10, Feather Fall, GREEN SLOT: Resist Sonic 40, BLUE SLOT: +2 insight DEX).

Eyes- EE Intricate Field Optics: (+3 insight INT, True Seeing, Spot +20, YELLOW SLOT: +Resist Sonic 40, GREEN SLOT: +2 Rear Immunity).

Armour- Thunder Forged Light Armour: Alchemical Armour Defense ritual, Fortification 130%, Shadow Killer, From the Shadows, Ghostly, BLUE SLOT: +2 armored agility, GREEN SLOT: Natural Armour +8).

Quiver- Epic Quiver of Alacrity.

Main Hand: Thunderforged Dagger with Touch of Flames, Dragons Edge, Mortal Fear, SLOTS: Caustic Acid, Search +15.

Off Hand: Thunderforged Dagger with Blinding Fear, Paralyzing Fear, Mortal Fear, SLOTS: Caustic Acid, Tumble +15


For DR bypassers, 2 Celestia's works on almost everything needing bypassers. I also carry a good set of portal beaters.



This guy is a lot of fun for me because blindly running ahead is NOT the thing to do with this guy. This guy requires smart play and accomplishing things by thinking outside the box, which for me is the biggest appeal for this character, and a nice refreshing change from the norm. There is almost nothing more satisfying than listening to the big bad barb ***** because you decimated his precious kill count. LOL. And you did most of it with one swing / mob



Max Theoretical Assassinate DC for a rogue:

Max assassinate DC = 85 for a Helf, 84 for a drow elf. (this DC is far from practical since it requires a lot of very short duration and very hard to get int buffs. It is here just for reference.)



10 base
20 rogue levels
6 stealthy (shadowdancer tier 1)
4 Item
5 measure the foe
40 INT bonus from 90 INT (18 base, 6 tome, 7 levels, 1 human adaptability, 1 arti dil, 3 action surge, 2 capstone, 2 assassin, 4 harper, 11 item, 3 insight, 1 exc, 2 yugo, 2 ship, 6 epic destiny, 4 twisted, 3 great int, 2 completionist, 2 litany, 2 store pot, 3 house D pot, 4 abashai cookies, 2 bard song)

[MysteryNotes]

Equipment:

Weapons: Epic Midnight Greetings. One with +6 INT slotted in.

Looks like a nice build, but am wondering about this - As far as i know, you can't slot +6 stats on a red slot, am i mistaken?

[voodoogroves]

Looks like a nice build, but am wondering about this - As far as i know, you can't slot +6 stats on a red slot, am i mistaken?

Yes, you can put a colorless into that red slot.

[MysteryNotes]

Yes, you can put a colorless into that red slot.

Ah! Never knew that, thanks!

[domandi]

Ok, what am I missing here. How do you get to a 32 con?

14 + 7 enh, +3 exc +3 abishi +2 rage and ....? +2 yugo? that is only 31.

I love the build. If I could ever get ANYTHING to drop from echrono, I would love to make my rog into this.

[Mellkor]

Ok, what am I missing here. How do you get to a 32 con?

14 + 7 enh, +3 exc +3 abishi +2 rage and ....? +2 yugo? that is only 31.

I love the build. If I could ever get ANYTHING to drop from echrono, I would love to make my rog into this.

(assumptions: ship buffs, GH, haste, rogue skill boost active, as equipped or using equipment described below, one TR, +3 tomes to all, +4 int tome)

Sssoooo....

+3 Tome and +2 ship (instead of rage you have listed above) is 32.

I dont count on rage much, pot duration on that is too short to bother with for me, but it is a nice boost when you have it.


So 34 with rage, 36 with a store pot, 38 with a yugo pot, heck, you can even hit 41 with a house D pot. But I dont use those much. The penalty on yugo pots is just not worth it, House D pots only lasts 90 seconds, and I dont always have store pots to use. I sometimes use store pots for int, every now and again yugo pots for int, and sometimes use store pots for con, but 507 HP's is enough usually. If you get killed with 500 hp's then whatever killed you will most likely also kill you with 20 or 40 more anyway, LOL

I dont like to count on too many short duration buffs, hard to get buffs, or buffs that cost TP's, so I dont put those numbers into my build description, mainly because too many short duration buffs are too much of a hassle to manage, yugo pots have penalties that most people wont tolerate, and who wants to constantly buy Turbine Points?

Too many folks put in too many unrealistic numbers into their builds, I prefer to keep numbers closer to actual practice instead of the theoretical or fantasy numbers that plague too many builds posted on these forums.

[domandi]

Right! I can't believe I forgot about tomes/ship... thank you. Now I need to get back to farming epics...

[TheDearLeader]

I noticed you have Half-Elf, and Skill Boost IV.

Don't Helves get Human Versatility enhancements, or am I making that up?

You'd benefit much more from 10 AP spent into HV IV than SB IV, since you have the option of using it to increase your damage output, Saves, to-hit, etc. dependant upon your situation. Especially since it can be used concurrently with Haste Boost.

Also.. no Power Attack? Hurting you on Boss Battles here, where they can't be insta-killed.

Wand and Scroll Mastery IV seems a bit overkill - even taking only tier III gets you impressive Heal-Scroll numbers, while allowing you a few free AP for something else.

Actually, looking at those enhancements I just realized... no Haste Boost in there?

[Mellkor]

I noticed you have Half-Elf, and Skill Boost IV.

Don't Helves get Human Versatility enhancements, or am I making that up?

You'd benefit much more from 10 AP spent into HV IV than SB IV, since you have the option of using it to increase your damage output, Saves, to-hit, etc. dependant upon your situation. Especially since it can be used concurrently with Haste Boost.

Also.. no Power Attack? Hurting you on Boss Battles here, where they can't be insta-killed.

Wand and Scroll Mastery IV seems a bit overkill - even taking only tier III gets you impressive Heal-Scroll numbers, while allowing you a few free AP for something else.

As for haste boost, its a good one to get, but I prefer to spend AP's on enhancements that are always on, rather than limited. My experience with haste boost was I burned thru them too darn fast to feel like they were of any real value.

Actually, looking at those enhancements I just realized... no Haste Boost in there?

Good point on the HV IV.

No need for power attack. I am not a boss beater so much. But do just fine w/o PA anyway. Also for power attack to be truly effective you have to still be able to hit most mobs on a 2. On this build, with PA running, that would not be the case.

Wand and Scroll mastry, meh matter of personal preference on that one, I guess.

[TheDearLeader]

Good point on the HV IV.

No need for power attack. I am not a boss beater so much. But do just fine w/o PA anyway.

Wand and Scroll mastry, meh matter of personal preference on that one, I guess.

K. And Haste Boost?

[Mellkor]

K. And Haste Boost?

Thats a good one to get, but I prefer enhancements that dont run out. My experience with haste boost always left me feeling like it was a waste of points since I burned thru them so fast lol.

[TheDearLeader]

Thats a good one to get, but I prefer enhancements that dont run out. My experience with haste boost always left me feeling like it was a waste of points since I burned thru them so fast lol.

They're a dramatic increase to DPS. With Extra Action Boost I (2 AP), and a Lesser Action Boost Enhancement Item (Such as Kensei Necklace), you can have 8 Haste Boosts/Rest. Even firing them off as soon as you're off timer, that's 4 minutes where 2/3rds of the time you're swinging 30% faster.

I dunno, I guess it goes back to the "Boss DPS" thing. Your Rogue is heavily built towards the 6-man party, insta-kill trash mobs. Barbarians/Fighters tend to go for the in-your-face, hit as hard and fast as possible, big numbers approach. Seems like maybe the pendulum has swung too much in one direction.

I admit, my Assassin's 41 DC doesn't instakill everything - but I find that I'm happy with a comfortable medium of instakill and DPS.

[DragonTroy]

:O i am certainly going to TR my rogue into this, it is incredible. i have run him through epics on a regular occasion, and its always so fun to just watch that caster/any other epic mob get ready to do something, then sneak up behind them and then suddenly drop. I've even out killed some of my arcane friends on this guy, and he's only running around with a 40 assassinate DC with ship buffs and 1 EMG. always wondered how effective i could be if i completely maxxed it. and i had planned on getting a 5 piece abashai set anyway, already have a few of the items listed here.


couple of questions:

i know you have stated you aren't much of a boss dps'er, but when you are doing that, do you keep 1 EMG in your offhand, or swap to a rapier or some such?

how much use have you seen slippery mind? i know one of the few things i haven't enjoyed about my rogue was his weak will save. he had it at one point, but it seemed more like he just had to fail twice, but i think my lil halfing is a bit weaker it that department than you brainiac half elf.i think i have rolled a 20 and still gotten held

with all your skill points and your such excellence in heal scrolls, why no concentration? im sure you can get by with a 57 swim or something


Oh, and i as far as someone else was saying, i think even on a build like this, haste boost is still a very effective addition, even if it would be regulated to boss fights

[voodoogroves]

The super high DC is better in epic quests.

The PA/haste boost is better in raids.



What do you like to do with your time?

[Mellkor]

Boss DPS is only marginally less than a str based build anyway. Boss DPS is more than adequent on this guy. And just because I think haste boost is a waste, doesn't mean you can't tweak this to your liking. DPS gain from assassinating more often more than off-sets the marginal weapon DPS gain that a str build has anyway. If you wanna be a boss beater, you can always roll a barb or a fighter. Besides, fighting bosses is only a small part of what this build does, so I am not going to build around boss beating just for a marginal gain on boss DPS at the heavy cost of a much lower assassinate DC.

[TheDearLeader]

Boss DPS is only marginally less than a str based build anyway. Boss DPS is more than adequent on this guy. And just because I think haste boost is a waste, doesn't mean you can't tweak this to your liking. DPS gain from assassinating more often more than off-sets the marginal weapon DPS gain that a str build has anyway. If you wanna be a boss beater, you can always roll a barb or a fighter.

If you like playing this, more power to you.

I prefer a happy medium - you prefer extreme focus on trash killing. There's nothing inherently wrong with either. I'm glad you put the build up - I've thought it's been a good discussion of it's abilities up until now.

[Mellkor]

They're a dramatic increase to DPS. With Extra Action Boost I (2 AP), and a Lesser Action Boost Enhancement Item (Such as Kensei Necklace), you can have 8 Haste Boosts/Rest. Even firing them off as soon as you're off timer, that's 4 minutes where 2/3rds of the time you're swinging 30% faster.

I dunno, I guess it goes back to the "Boss DPS" thing. Your Rogue is heavily built towards the 6-man party, insta-kill trash mobs. Barbarians/Fighters tend to go for the in-your-face, hit as hard and fast as possible, big numbers approach. Seems like maybe the pendulum has swung too much in one direction.

I admit, my Assassin's 41 DC doesn't instakill everything - but I find that I'm happy with a comfortable medium of instakill and DPS.

Also I am not so interested in increasing weapon DPS. DPS for me is mainly from successful assassination and Sneak attack. That said, DPS is still excellent on this guy even when not considering SA and assassinate. Is it the best it can be? no. But it is certainly not worthy of being dismissed as easily as some of you are implying.

[Mellkor]

couple of questions:

i know you have stated you aren't much of a boss dps'er, but when you are doing that, do you keep 1 EMG in your offhand, or swap to a rapier or some such?

I really only meant this as a generic statement regarding all rogues since they really all fall into the category of being a poor boss DPS'r relatively speaking,

how much use have you seen slippery mind? i know one of the few things i haven't enjoyed about my rogue was his weak will save. he had it at one point, but it seemed more like he just had to fail twice, but i think my lil halfing is a bit weaker it that department than you brainiac half elf.i think i have rolled a 20 and still gotten held

with all your skill points and your such excellence in heal scrolls, why no concentration? im sure you can get by with a 57 swim or something


Oh, and i as far as someone else was saying, i think even on a build like this, haste boost is still a very effective addition, even if it would be regulated to boss fights

I usually just use my EMG's for just about everything, mostly because I am too lazy or forgetful to swap. The +10 enhancement and the disintegrate procs are hard to beat, tho. I do use boss DR beaters, and portal beaters where appropriate, but for almost all else it is dual EMG's.

I like having slippery mind, that second roll on will saves is nice to have, Also I just dont think the other choices available bring as much to the table as slippery mind does.

As for concentration, I dunno, I didnt think about getting it to help with scroll casting. Might be good to throw some spare points into it. I havent noticed failing scroll casting because of it tho, probably because when it gets to the point of having to self heal, I am usually running away and/or clear of all dangers.

If you like haste boost you can easily fit it in, it is just not something I want or need for my playstyle.

[DragonTroy]

I usually just use my EMG's for just about everything, mostly because I am too lazy or forgetful to swap. The +10 enhancement and the disintegrate procs are hard to beat, tho. I do use boss DR beaters, and portal beaters where appropriate, but for almost all else it is dual EMG's.

I like having slippery mind, that second roll on will saves is nice to have, Also I just dont think the other choices available bring as much to the table as slippery mind does.

As for concentration, I dunno, I didnt think about getting it to help with scroll casting. Might be good to throw some spare points into it. I havent noticed failing scroll casting because of it tho, probably because when it gets to the point of having to self heal, I am usually running away and/or clear of all dangers.

If you like haste boost you can easily fit it in, it is just not something I want or need for my playstyle.

yeah, i figured as much, they aren't bad weapons by any means, especially on this build, and can be made beaters if ya good slot them and have a friendly artificer in the group. just wanted to ask

if/when i make this build, although probably without the +3s, don't have those on hand so may have to do a slight allocation of stats for twf, but if/when i make this build i would take slippery mind again to at least try it. if it didn't help, i could always take a skill mastery instead, have a 100% chance with summon monster IX/PWK scrolls, and just to have a really nice looking skill sheet

i wonder how much use that little bit of concentration would be now that i think about it. 11, and i've heard that even arcane's with really nice concentration, 40-60 maybe, still failing when getting the stuffing beaten out of 'em when they forget to turn quicken on. but im not sure though

yeah, im sure i could fit it in, just wanted to weigh in on the debate happening around me

EDIT: about that highlighted red statement, yeah, you're pretty much correct, rogues aren't made for boss dps'ing, but we get much cooler abilities than those dumb barbs, so no worries

[wax_on_wax_off]

The super high DC is better in epic quests.

The PA/haste boost is better in raids.



What do you like to do with your time?

Why can't we have both?