Feedback desired on Human Pure Kensei THF

[Messsenger]

I apologize if this is very close to other builds . . I know it is not a very uncommon route.

I have recent started playing DDO (from WoW) so be gentile. I only have a Premium account with 32 point build and Vet. status . . . none of the other races or classes unlocked.

I'm trying to build a melee DPS that's tough as nails; not a chart topper, but not way behind either.

I'd like to get this right the 1st time around so I don't waste a time or tomes on re-rolling a million times!

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 03.09.02
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Headrush Endbringer
Level 20 True Neutral Human Female
(20 Fighter) 
Hit Points: 446
Spell Points: 0 
BAB: 20\20\25\30\30
Fortitude: 18
Reflex: 10
Will: 7

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
Abilities        Base Stats          Modified Stats
(32 Point)       (Level 1)             (Level 20)
Strength             17                    28
Dexterity            14                    16
Constitution         17                    20
Intelligence          8                    10
Wisdom                8                    10
Charisma              8                    10

Tomes Used
+2 Tome of Strength used at level 7
+2 Tome of Dexterity used at level 7
+2 Tome of Constitution used at level 7
+2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 7
+2 Tome of Wisdom used at level 7
+2 Tome of Charisma used at level 7

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Skills         Modified Skills
Skills           (Level 1)            (Level 20)
Balance               4                    14.5
Bluff                -1                     3
Concentration         3                     8
Diplomacy            -1                     3
Disable Device       n/a                    n/a
Haggle               -1                     0
Heal                 -1                     0
Hide                  2                     3
Intimidate           -1                     3
Jump                  5                    32
Listen               -1                     0
Move Silently         2                     3
Open Lock             n/a                   n/a
Perform              n/a                    n/a
Repair               -1                     0
Search               -1                     0
Spot                 -1                     0
Swim                  3                    12
Tumble                3                     8
Use Magic Device     n/a                    n/a

Level 1 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Power Attack
Feat: (Human Bonus) Toughness
Feat: (Human Bonus) Toughness  <--replace with Exotic Bastard Sword Prof.


Level 2 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Cleave


Level 3 (Fighter)
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Focus: Slashing Weapons


Level 4 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Great Cleave


Level 5 (Fighter)


Level 6 (Fighter)
Feat: (Selected) Two Handed Fighting
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Weapon Specialization: Slashing Weapons


Level 7 (Fighter)


Level 8 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Improved Critical: Slashing Weapons


Level 9 (Fighter)
Feat: (Selected) Toughness


Level 10 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Greater Weapon Focus: Slashing Weapons


Level 11 (Fighter)


Level 12 (Fighter)
Feat: (Selected) Greater Weapon Specialization: Slashing Weapons
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Improved Two Handed Fighting


Level 13 (Fighter)


Level 14 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Greater Two Handed Fighting


Level 15 (Fighter)
Feat: (Selected) Shield Mastery


Level 16 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Quick Draw


Level 17 (Fighter)


Level 18 (Fighter)
Feat: (Selected) Luck of Heroes
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Superior Weapon Focus: Slashing Weapons


Level 19 (Fighter)


Level 20 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Improved Shield Mastery
Enhancement: Fighter Attack Boost I
Enhancement: Fighter Attack Boost II
Enhancement: Fighter Attack Boost III
Enhancement: Fighter Extra Action Boost I
Enhancement: Fighter Extra Action Boost II
Enhancement: Fighter Haste Boost I
Enhancement: Fighter Haste Boost II
Enhancement: Fighter Haste Boost III
Enhancement: Fighter Haste Boost IV
Enhancement: Fighter Weapon Alacrity
Enhancement: Kensei Greatsword Mastery I
Enhancement: Kensei Greatsword Mastery II
Enhancement: Kensei Greatsword Mastery III
Enhancement: Fighter Armor Mastery I
Enhancement: Fighter Critical Accuracy I
Enhancement: Fighter Critical Accuracy II
Enhancement: Fighter Critical Accuracy III
Enhancement: Fighter Kensei I
Enhancement: Fighter Kensei II
Enhancement: Fighter Kensei III
Enhancement: Fighter Greatsword Specialization I
Enhancement: Fighter Greatsword Specialization II
Enhancement: Human Adaptability Strength I
Enhancement: Human Greater Adaptability Constitution I
Enhancement: Human Versatility I
Enhancement: Human Versatility II
Enhancement: Fighter Item Defense I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
Enhancement: Racial Toughness III
Enhancement: Fighter Strength I
Enhancement: Fighter Strength II
Enhancement: Fighter Strength III
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness I
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness II
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness III

The idea here is strong THF line for supplimenting Bastard Sword & Board when Defense is key . .also why Shield Mastery (too good to pass on). With all of the + to hit provided by Kensei path I shouldn't need Exotic Wep Prof BSword . . should I? If so, what feat should be replaced?

Tons of HP to make up for lacking AC; as it is a DPS build.

I'm not familiar with endgame gear so I modeled around Mithral Full Plate and Mithral Tower Shield. Taking Fighter Armor Mastery I enhancement evens out the Max Dex bonus between them to 4. (from what I gather)

With improvements to Cleave and Grt. Cleave I have a hard time not taking both. Aside from downing most caster mobs that much quicker (which are deadliest IMO) the cleaves seem to hit very effectively . . . . in most situations.

7 uses per rest of Power Surge and Fighter Haste IV, and a +3 Human Versatility (would have liked more) should supply some good damage with Quick Draw reducing the lag after boosting.

I'm not very happy with the saves . . . but I'm coming from playing a Paladin so . . .

Feedback please! Let me know your thoughts, changes, suggestions!

[Messsenger]

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 03.09.02
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Headrush Endbringer
Level 20 True Neutral Dwarf Male
(20 Fighter) 
Hit Points: 434
Spell Points: 0 
BAB: 20\20\25\30\30
Fortitude: 19
Reflex: 10
Will: 7

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
Abilities        Base Stats          Modified Stats
(32 Point)       (Level 1)             (Level 20)
Strength             18                    28
Dexterity            14                    16
Constitution         18                    22
Intelligence          8                    10
Wisdom                8                    10
Charisma              6                     8

Tomes Used
+2 Tome of Strength used at level 7
+2 Tome of Dexterity used at level 7
+2 Tome of Constitution used at level 7
+2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 7
+2 Tome of Wisdom used at level 7
+2 Tome of Charisma used at level 7

Level 1 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Power Attack
Feat: (Selected) Toughness


Level 2 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Cleave


Level 3 (Fighter)
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Focus: Slashing Weapons


Level 4 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Great Cleave


Level 5 (Fighter)


Level 6 (Fighter)
Feat: (Selected) Two Handed Fighting
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Weapon Specialization: Slashing Weapons


Level 7 (Fighter)


Level 8 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Improved Critical: Slashing Weapons


Level 9 (Fighter)
Feat: (Selected) Toughness


Level 10 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Greater Weapon Focus: Slashing Weapons


Level 11 (Fighter)


Level 12 (Fighter)
Feat: (Selected) Greater Weapon Specialization: Slashing Weapons
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Improved Two Handed Fighting


Level 13 (Fighter)


Level 14 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Greater Two Handed Fighting


Level 15 (Fighter)
Feat: (Selected) Shield Mastery


Level 16 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Quick Draw


Level 17 (Fighter)


Level 18 (Fighter)
Feat: (Selected) Luck of Heroes
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Superior Weapon Focus: Slashing Weapons


Level 19 (Fighter)


Level 20 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Improved Shield Mastery
Enhancement: Fighter Attack Boost I
Enhancement: Fighter Attack Boost II
Enhancement: Fighter Attack Boost III
Enhancement: Fighter Extra Action Boost I
Enhancement: Fighter Extra Action Boost II
Enhancement: Fighter Haste Boost I
Enhancement: Fighter Haste Boost II
Enhancement: Fighter Haste Boost III
Enhancement: Fighter Haste Boost IV
Enhancement: Fighter Weapon Alacrity
Enhancement: Dwarven Axe Damage I
Enhancement: Dwarven Axe Damage II
Enhancement: Dwarven Constitution I
Enhancement: Dwarven Constitution II
Enhancement: Dwarven Spell Defense I
Enhancement: Dwarven Spell Defense II
Enhancement: Kensei Greataxe Mastery I
Enhancement: Kensei Greataxe Mastery II
Enhancement: Kensei Greataxe Mastery III
Enhancement: Fighter Critical Accuracy I
Enhancement: Fighter Critical Accuracy II
Enhancement: Fighter Critical Accuracy III
Enhancement: Fighter Kensei I
Enhancement: Fighter Kensei II
Enhancement: Fighter Kensei III
Enhancement: Fighter Greataxe Specialization I
Enhancement: Fighter Greataxe Specialization II
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
Enhancement: Fighter Strength I
Enhancement: Fighter Strength II
Enhancement: Fighter Strength III
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness I
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness II
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness III

Here is the Dwarven version which prolly works better due to Axe proficiency/bonuses and a little help on the Magic saves. Going to miss a few skill points and of course, versatility. The Greatsword appearance is more my stlye than the great axes (G. axe looks like you hit with the handle when close )

[Baahb3]

I kind of think you are trying to do too many things with this character.

In DDO, AC is really an all or nothing venture, either you go for it all the way or you don't really worry about it at all.

Going Kensei THF is a good idea but then going with bastard swords and a shield is kind of contradictive to the DPS that the PrE gives you.

IMO, if you are wanting a DPS character dump the dex and add some to wisdom. I am not a big fan of the cleave feats either so I would look at swaping them out as well, maybe something like brutal throw for the ocasion when you have to use a thrown weapon or move some of your fighter bonus feats out of general feat selections so you can take Iron Will or more Toughness feats.

Edit: Other feats to consider are Stunning Blow, Sap and Hamstring. You get combat feat bonuses from Kensei, might as well take advantage of them.

[Messsenger]

I kind of think you are trying to do too many things with this character.

In DDO, AC is really an all or nothing venture, either you go for it all the way or you don't really worry about it at all.

Going Kensei THF is a good idea but then going with bastard swords and a shield is kind of contradictive to the DPS that the PrE gives you.

IMO, if you are wanting a DPS character dump the dex and add some to wisdom. I am not a big fan of the cleave feats either so I would look at swaping them out as well, maybe something like brutal throw for the ocasion when you have to use a thrown weapon or move some of your fighter bonus feats out of general feat selections so you can take Iron Will or more Toughness feats.

Edit: Other feats to consider are Stunning Blow, Sap and Hamstring. You get combat feat bonuses from Kensei, might as well take advantage of them.

The main theme of the build is DPSing with a real 2hander 99% of the time- Greatsword for Human; Greataxe for Dwarf. The Defensive option is just the very rare occasion where Damage Reduction (no so much AC) matters. And in this situation it is cool to be able to still get decent glancing blow effects with the heavy focus in 2handers.

As far as Dex points go . .

Which save is more important Reflex or Will? I personally don't know TBH, but aren't there quite a few effects or buffs that protect you from Will oriented effects?

+ to Dex = + to Reflex AND AC
+ to Wis = + to Will only

I've done some reading regarding the Combat Feats (SB, Sap, Hamstring) and all signs point to major nerf compared to previous performance. Especially for endgame. I'd loved to take advantage of the Kensei benefits towards them; trust me, but I found so much negativity about them in the "recent" forums that I decided not to go that route.

I am noob to this game and not trying to argue, just trying to justify my choices. Am I dead wrong in what I've looked into? Does anyone else agree/disagree with myself or Baahb3?

[Baahb3]

The main theme of the build is DPSing with a real 2hander 99% of the time- Greatsword for Human; Greataxe for Dwarf. The Defensive option is just the very rare occasion where Damage Reduction (no so much AC) matters. And in this situation it is cool to be able to still get decent glancing blow effects with the heavy focus in 2handers.

In that case I think your plan of 'only emergencies' for the shield feats are fine. I would stick with Human though because the damage bonuse from Human Versitility will be worth much more than the racial weapon boni you would get from dwarf.

As far as Dex points go . .

Which save is more important Reflex or Will? I personally don't know TBH, but aren't there quite a few effects or buffs that protect you from Will oriented effects?

+ to Dex = + to Reflex AND AC
+ to Wis = + to Will only

To be honest your AC will probably not matter much past mid level anyway so '+ to Dex' is really just + to Reflex. IMO, Wisdom is more important than relfex because you will usually have the HPs to survive a failed reflex save and while there are alot of items that can block many will based effects you are not always guarenteed to have them. Combined with an uncanny ability of enemy spellcasters to dispell the one protection that works against them, it is a good idea to have something to fall back on other than the -1 to will saves.

I've done some reading regarding the Combat Feats (SB, Sap, Hamstring) and all signs point to major nerf compared to previous performance. Especially for endgame. I'd loved to take advantage of the Kensei benefits towards them; trust me, but I found so much negativity about them in the "recent" forums that I decided not to go that route.

I am noob to this game and not trying to argue, just trying to justify my choices. Am I dead wrong in what I've looked into? Does anyone else agree/disagree with myself or Baahb3?

That may be so but they are still very usefull for a variety of situations and IMO are more useful than things like cleave and greatcleave. The good things with feats are that they are relativly easy to swap out should you want to.

[Kinerd]

I mentioned this in the other thread, but you need EW:BS to generate glancing blows while using them with a shield.

While you can survive Reflex saves, a better save will mean less HP lost. Even if you don't have immunity X, +3 Will save probably won't be enough to matter.

[Messsenger]

In that case I think your plan of 'only emergencies' for the shield feats are fine. I would stick with Human though because the damage bonuse from Human Versitility will be worth much more than the racial weapon boni you would get from dwarf.



To be honest your AC will probably not matter much past mid level anyway so '+ to Dex' is really just + to Reflex. IMO, Wisdom is more important than relfex because you will usually have the HPs to survive a failed reflex save and while there are alot of items that can block many will based effects you are not always guarenteed to have them. Combined with an uncanny ability of enemy spellcasters to dispell the one protection that works against them, it is a good idea to have something to fall back on other than the -1 to will saves.



That may be so but they are still very usefull for a variety of situations and IMO are more useful than things like cleave and greatcleave. The good things with feats are that they are relativly easy to swap out should you want to.

I was hoping that someone would defend the Human race; as it is the one I prefer. I thought Dwarf was the more powerful choice; however, I just like the options provided by Humans a bit more (and I think they look cooler too).

Do people realy use hamstring and sap as a Fighter? I'll give Stunning Blow a shot because I always though it had potential . . if it worked enough, and at high enough levels. I assume that I'll have to switch a few enhancements to bring the DC's for it as high as possible or is the Kensei bonuses enough? If so what enhancements do I sacrifice for DC improvements? And in your opinion, you would not even take Cleave . . dump them both entirely?

Thx for the info too btw, much appreciated!

[Messsenger]

I mentioned this in the other thread, but you need EW:BS to generate glancing blows while using them with a shield.

While you can survive Reflex saves, a better save will mean less HP lost. Even if you don't have immunity X, +3 Will save probably won't be enough to matter.

Rofl, so now I have no idea what to do about saves. . . Maybe hybrid in levels of Pally and crank up the Charisma! (JK, that's my tank)