AA FvS? Build ideas please

[kittikatgurl]

With update 9 coming out I'm doing my next life as a FvS and I will be doing some form of FvS as my completionist build (in advance, please no one say its not worth it. I'm doing completionist because my husband is doing it, so i'm grinding that many lives regadless, it may as well all be on one toon, and i am a healer by nature).

I dabbled around with the idea of an AA FvS once before but never really got it off the ground. Any suggestions as to a class split/race to try. I'd really love to give it a go on my next life.

[LordPiglet]

Well, race would be either elf or half elf and then take the Silver Flame as your diety (for the longbow enhancements).

[kittikatgurl]

Yeah thats what I was thinking, unless I throw some ranger levels in there. I think you get faster shooting at ranger level 2, which isn't something you can get with a pure FvS.

[bladepro]

Assuming this is mostly meant to be a lvling build i would do something like this

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.8.2
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Level 20 Neutral Good Half-Elf Female
(20 Favored Soul) 
Hit Points: 322
Spell Points: 2058 
BAB: 15\15\20\25\25
Fortitude: 16
Reflex: 11
Will: 19

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
Abilities        Base Stats          Modified Stats
(32 Point)       (Level 1)             (Level 20)
Strength             10                    10
Dexterity             8                     8
Constitution         16                    18
Intelligence          8                     8
Wisdom               18                    25
Charisma             12                    15

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Skills         Modified Skills
Skills           (Level 1)            (Level 20)
Balance              -1                    -1
Bluff                 1                     2
Concentration         7                    26
Diplomacy             1                     2
Disable Device       n/a                   n/a
Haggle                1                     2
Heal                  4                     9
Hide                 -1                    -1
Intimidate            1                     4
Jump                  0                     0
Listen                4                     7
Move Silently        -1                    -1
Open Lock            n/a                   n/a
Perform               n/a                   n/a
Repair               -1                    -1
Search               -1                    -1
Spot                  4                     7
Swim                  0                     0
Tumble               n/a                   n/a
Use Magic Device      n/a                   n/a

Level 1 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Selected) Empower Healing Spell
Feat: (Diety) Favored by the Silver Flame
Feat: (Half-Elf Dilettante) Half-Elf Dilettante: Barbarian
Enhancement: Improved Concentration I
Enhancement: Favored Soul Life Magic I
Enhancement: Favored Soul Energy of the Scion I


Level 2 (Favored Soul)
Enhancement: Favored Soul Attack Boost I
Enhancement: Favored Soul Damage Boost I
Enhancement: Human Improved Recovery I


Level 3 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Selected) Zen Archery
Enhancement: Favored Soul Prayer of Life I


Level 4 (Favored Soul)
Enhancement: Favored Soul Damage Boost II
Enhancement: Favored Soul Life Magic II
Enhancement: Favored Soul Charisma I
Enhancement: Favored Soul Wisdom I


Level 5 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Favored Soul Bonus) Energy Resistance: Fire
Enhancement: Improved Concentration II
Enhancement: Favored Soul Prayer of Incredible Life I
Enhancement: Favored Soul Energy of the Scion II


Level 6 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Selected) Mental Toughness
Enhancement: Half-Elf Improved Damage Reduction I
Enhancement: Human Adaptability Wisdom I


Level 7 (Favored Soul)
Enhancement: Favored Soul Prayer of Life II


Level 8 (Favored Soul)
Enhancement: Favored Soul Damage Boost III
Enhancement: Favored Soul Life Magic III


Level 9 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Focus: Ranged Weapons
Enhancement: Favored Soul Prayer of Incredible Life II
Enhancement: Half-Elf Barbarian Constitution I


Level 10 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Favored Soul Bonus) Energy Resistance: Electricity
Enhancement: Favored Soul Life Magic IV


Level 11 (Favored Soul)
Enhancement: Favored Soul Energy of the Scion III


Level 12 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Selected) Point Blank Shot
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Conjure +2 Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer I


Level 13 (Favored Soul)
Enhancement: Favored Soul Energy of the Scion IV


Level 14 (Favored Soul)
Enhancement: Favored Soul Prayer of Life III


Level 15 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Favored Soul Bonus) Energy Resistance: Acid
Feat: (Selected) Toughness
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Force Arrows
Enhancement: Half-Elf Improved Damage Reduction II


Level 16 (Favored Soul)
Enhancement: Human Greater Adaptability Constitution I


Level 17 (Favored Soul)
Enhancement: Favored Soul Longbow Specialization I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Conjure +3 Arrows
Enhancement: Favored Soul Toughness I


Level 18 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Ranged Weapons
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Explosive Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Conjure +4 Arrows
Enhancement: Favored Soul Toughness II


Level 19 (Favored Soul)
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Force Burst Arrows
Enhancement: Favored Soul Longbow Specialization II


Level 20 (Favored Soul)
Enhancement: Favored Soul Ascendency: Silver Flame
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Conjure +5 Arrows

Could modify the enh a bit probably, not gonna be a top end epic healer but will be good lvling healer with AA

[kittikatgurl]

Assuming this is mostly meant to be a lvling build i would do something like this
Could modify the enh a bit probably, not gonna be a top end epic healer but will be good lvling healer with AA

Leveling is the priority, but an AA fvs is something I am seriously considering as a final build. taking into account that I will be completionist at that point (way waaaay down the track lol)

[kittikatgurl]

Okay, so with 18 starting Wisdom that would give a high DC casting FvS (mind you I have 4 more points to play with). Why barbarian dilettante over say ranger?

I agree that the Silver flame faith line seems the most relevant.

Zen archery? I've heard of it, but never seen it actually used successfully. Doesn't it just affect your to-hit rather than your damage? With a negliglible strength I would guess you would hit a lot using zen, but not deal much damage.

[Drimsdale]

I've been looking at FvS AA builds lately as well. There's this one:
http://forums.ddo.com/showpost.php?p...5&postcount=29

It's focused on Strength and damage at the expense of spell DC.

I must confess, I'm no expert, but I've been trying to maintain high Wisdom as well - it means a much lower Strength (and thus bow dps), but leaves the offensive casting option open (starting array something like 14/15/14/8/16/10 - planning on a +2 Dex tome to pick up Manyshot).

Elf gives ranged attack and damage enhancements, but half-elf gives Ranger dilettante (poor man's Bow Strength). I think I'm going to go with half-elf on the grounds that (as I'm going the Wisdom route anyway) I'm not going to hit the limits of the dilettante feat (+8 to damage, or 26 Strength).

With the FvS17/Mnk2/Wiz1, you miss out on 9th level spells, but gain Evasion, two bonus feats, and Water Stance (+Wisdom and saves) from the Monk and the prereq for Arcane Archer (and a bonus feat) from the Wizard. You can take Zen Archery as a Monk bonus feat - which means if you focus on Wisdom you get attack bonus and spell DC (and AC) all from the one stat.

I had a +2 Wisdom tome drop as a quest reward today - I think someone wants me to make a divine caster.

[wax_on_wax_off]

I've been looking at FvS AA builds lately as well. There's this one:
http://forums.ddo.com/showpost.php?p...5&postcount=29

It's focused on Strength and damage at the expense of spell DC.

I must confess, I'm no expert, but I've been trying to maintain high Wisdom as well - it means a much lower Strength (and thus bow dps), but leaves the offensive casting option open (starting array something like 14/15/14/8/16/10 - planning on a +2 Dex tome to pick up Manyshot).

Elf gives ranged attack and damage enhancements, but half-elf gives Ranger dilettante (poor man's Bow Strength). I think I'm going to go with half-elf on the grounds that (as I'm going the Wisdom route anyway) I'm not going to hit the limits of the dilettante feat (+8 to damage, or 26 Strength).

With the FvS17/Mnk2/Wiz1, you miss out on 9th level spells, but gain Evasion, two bonus feats, and Water Stance (+Wisdom and saves) from the Monk and the prereq for Arcane Archer (and a bonus feat) from the Wizard. You can take Zen Archery as a Monk bonus feat - which means if you focus on Wisdom you get attack bonus and spell DC (and AC) all from the one stat.

I had a +2 Wisdom tome drop as a quest reward today - I think someone wants me to make a divine caster.

Yeah it's hard to find the balance with divine Arcane Archers. Completionist opens some possibilities but in other ways creates more constraints as you probably want to pick up the completionist feat at least and maybe other PL feats.

U9 is bringing in Angel of Vengeance which I don't feel has much synergy with the Arcane Archer PrE as the general idea of both PrE's is to have some pew pew to do in between other duties. When Divine Avenger comes out in ~U11 I think the FvS Arcane Archer will get a really interesting boost to viability.

The spell pass in U9 will also change things up. Implosion will be excellent for a high wisdom character without a spare feat for heighten. Summon Monster IX will be a solid choice for an Angel of Vengeance (Ghaele Eladrin with searing light to pew pew light vulnerable targets that have been hitting a SoC).

The build that is linked above is a post in a thread which is basically a general rant about divine arcane archers, I went through and edited it trying to bring some of the information a little more up to date and better reflecting my changes in game experience. It might provide some food for thought.

For a leveling build I'd say that a pure Angel of Vengeance would be much more effective and provide a good forum for exploring the new PrE and the changes to the spell system. For a wisdom based completionist build I'd worry that you'd suffer from a lack of versatility when it comes to spell choices due to missing higher level spell slots from multiclassing and not being able to swap spells around easily. Cleric is another option that you could consider.

[unbongwah]

The major issues for a FvS AA are:

• Pure or Multiclassed? Pure gets you the awesome FvS capstone, but splashing adds some badly needed extra feats and possibly other abilities (e.g., WIS bonus to AC and Evasion from monk 2). Also if you want lvl 9 spells you have to hit FvS lvl 18, whereas a cleric-based AA can splash up to 3 non-cleric lvls and still get lvl 9 spells, so your multiclassing options are more limited.
• Feat Shortage - for archery you need at least 2 or 3 feats for AA pre-reqs (depending on whether you take an arcane splash); ideally you also have Bow STR (or HE ranger dilly), Rapid Shot, Manyshot, Imp Crit Ranged, Prec Shot, and Imp Prec Shot. And that's not counting Zen Archery, which some like to take. On the spellcasting side, you need at least one metamagic to AoV pre-req, but the more the merrier; I would consider at least Quicken a must-have on any serious caster.
• Feat Progression - because of all the feat pre-reqs for AA & AoV, it's difficult if not impossible to squeeze in everything you want as early as you want it; so some abilities get delayed. You have to prioritize what you're going for first.
• MAD? MAD am I?! - pretty much every stat except INT is important. Everyone needs CON, you need DEX for some of the ranged feats (even if you plan to be WIS-/ZA-based), STR for adding to ranged dmg (unless you plan to gimp yourself there), WIS for spell DCs (unless you play purely as an archer / healer / buffbot, in which case WIS can be dumped), and you need enough CHA to cast spells (though tome, enhs, and item count toward it, so at least you don't need a lot of base CHA).

To be honest, I have yet to come up with a FvS AA build I really like; but here's a sample TR build to give you some idea of the challenges involved in making it work:

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.8.2
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Level 20 Lawful Neutral Half-Elf Female
(2 Monk \ 18 Favored Soul) 
Hit Points: 307
Spell Points: 1789 
BAB: 14\14\19\24
Fortitude: 17
Reflex: 18
Will: 22

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
Abilities        Base Stats          Modified Stats
(34 Point)       (Level 1)             (Level 20)
Strength             14                    16
Dexterity            15                    18
Constitution         14                    16
Intelligence          8                    10
Wisdom               16                    26
Charisma             12                    14

Tomes Used
+2 Tome of Strength used at level 7
+2 Tome of Dexterity used at level 7
+2 Tome of Constitution used at level 7
+2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 7
+2 Tome of Wisdom used at level 7
+2 Tome of Charisma used at level 7

Level 1 (Monk)
Feat: (Half-Elf Dilettante) Half-Elf Dilettante: Ranger
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Sorcerer
Feat: (Selected) Point Blank Shot
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Toughness


Level 2 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Diety) Favored by the Silver Flame


Level 3 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Selected) Rapid Shot


Level 4 (Monk)
Ability Raise: WIS
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Zen Archery


Level 5 (Favored Soul)


Level 6 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Focus: Ranged Weapons


Level 7 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Favored Soul Bonus) Energy Resistance: Fire


Level 8 (Favored Soul)
Ability Raise: WIS


Level 9 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Selected) Manyshot


Level 10 (Favored Soul)


Level 11 (Favored Soul)


Level 12 (Favored Soul)
Ability Raise: WIS
Feat: (Favored Soul Bonus) Energy Resistance: Electricity
Feat: (Selected) Past Life: Arcane Prodigy


Level 13 (Favored Soul)


Level 14 (Favored Soul)


Level 15 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Selected) Maximize Spell


Level 16 (Favored Soul)
Ability Raise: WIS


Level 17 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Favored Soul Bonus) Energy Resistance: Cold


Level 18 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Selected) Quicken Spell


Level 19 (Favored Soul)


Level 20 (Favored Soul)
Ability Raise: WIS
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Acid Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Explosive Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Force Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Force Burst Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Slaying Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Terror Arrows
Enhancement: Silver Flame Exorcism
Enhancement: Favored Soul Longbow Specialization I
Enhancement: Favored Soul Longbow Specialization II
Enhancement: Improved Ranger Dilettante I
Enhancement: Improved Ranger Dilettante II
Enhancement: Improved Ranger Dilettante III
Enhancement: Human Adaptability Wisdom I
Enhancement: Human Improved Recovery I
Enhancement: Human Improved Recovery II
Enhancement: Way of the Patient Tortoise I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Conjure +2 Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Conjure +3 Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Conjure +4 Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Conjure +5 Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer I
Enhancement: Favored Soul Prayer of Smiting I
Enhancement: Favored Soul Prayer of Smiting II
Enhancement: Favored Soul Prayer of Life I
Enhancement: Favored Soul Prayer of Life II
Enhancement: Favored Soul Prayer of Incredible Smiting I
Enhancement: Favored Soul Prayer of Incredible Life I
Enhancement: Favored Soul Smiting I
Enhancement: Favored Soul Smiting II
Enhancement: Favored Soul Smiting III
Enhancement: Favored Soul Life Magic I
Enhancement: Favored Soul Life Magic II
Enhancement: Favored Soul Life Magic III
Enhancement: Favored Soul Life Magic IV
Enhancement: Favored Soul Energy of the Scion I
Enhancement: Favored Soul Energy of the Scion II
Enhancement: Favored Soul Energy of the Scion III
Enhancement: Half-Elf Ranger Dexterity I
Enhancement: Favored Soul Wisdom I
Enhancement: Favored Soul Wisdom II
Enhancement: Favored Soul Toughness I
Enhancement: Favored Soul Toughness II

[If sorcerer is not one of your past lives, take Mental Toughness instead of Arcane Prodigy.]

EDIT: I believe I took all of the AoV pre-reqs, but you would need to free 6 APs to add AoV I & II.

This build focuses on archery first, then spellcasting, but it still winds up backloaded; so she gets Manyshot @ lvl 9, AA @ lvl 12, and AoV @ lvl 15. You can change the order of that progression by changing feat order, but there's no way to get everything any sooner.

A couple of ways in which you could mix things up:

• A ftr 2 splash instead of monk 2 would let you front-load the necessary feats sooner; you'd swap out Toughness & ZA (monk bonus feats) for a couple of archery feats, which would let you bump up Arcane Prodigy (or MT) and Maximize sooner. That would let have Manyshot, AA, and AoV by lvl 12. The downside is you would lose Evasion & monk WIS AC bonus.
• A wiz or ftr splash on top of monk 2 would get you an extra feat but cost you lvl 9 spells.
• You could give up Rapid Shot & Manyshot for two extra metamagics; this would also let you drop DEX for more, say, WIS or CON, since WF:R & PBS have no DEX pre-req. Although honestly, why would you bother with an AA w/out MS? That's like drinking cheap non-alcoholic beer: all of the bad taste, none of the buzz to make up for it.